BullBuchanan

Houston switched their QB under very similar circumstances - look what happened.

How do you figure? Taylor threw a pick on his own side of the field and couldn't move the team all day. The Mabin missed pick was meaningless

Good point. How many NFL coaches does it take to realize this guy can't get the job done when it matters?

I would pick a current starter or backup NFL QB at random and they win this game today.

The thread should have ended right here. Bravo. http://media2.giphy.com/media/b9aScKLxdv0Y0/giphy.gif

I don't really understand how you're getting there. I'd bet Whaley has a job next year maybe GM or maybe director, but his track record is pretty damn solid if all you do is look at the facts. When you toss in the Pegulas mismanagement of both of their franchises, I really think someone will look at it and say his did the best that could have been expected.

We kind of need Ragland to have a monster game - like a blow your socks off kind of game. If that kid ends up being the stud he was supposed to be, it changes everything moving forward. Not counting on it though.

Might have something to do with him being publicly undermined by his bosses. Once it was known that Whaley didn't have any power over Marrone/Rex then I wouldn't respect him either. Frankly, I'm ready to have the discussion about whether or not the Pegulas are terrible owners. The Sabres have gone through almost the exact same thing. The fact that they fired Murray before the rebuild came to term speaks volumes to me. I think they're too used to having complete control, even when they don't know the subject matter. If they have a problem with how the team is being run, they should be directing the GM what they expect of them and telling the coaches and players that the GM is king. Otherwise, it destroys all of that person's credibility. The fact that "Coach & GM are finally on the same page" - well they damn well better be. They were promoted off of the same team and given the opportunity of a lifetime. I'd expect they've had plenty of time to talk about how they ensure they don't end up like the rest,

King accidentally makes a point that is going completely unnoticed. From 2013 on (whaley's involvement) every player drafted in the 5th round or higher is still in the league, they just don't play for the Bills. Some folks in Buffalo like to paint this picture that Whaley was some sort of disaster, but he doesn't have any Aaron Maybin, James Hardy. John McCargo. Mike Williams, Erik Flowers, Avion Black, Shawn Bryson on his resume. Not one. Truth be told, he's the only GM we've had in a t least 30 years that didn't draft a complete scrub rounds 1-5. All of them can play with the best players in the world. Maybe he should have drafted another QB and he'd still have a job.

I would absolutely trade a 7th for him/sign him.

I just don't understand how we get to "genius moves" or even a "coaching staff that finally gets it" by letting our marquee players walk out the door for peanuts.I mean that's pretty much the one line summary of every GM we've had for 20 years. "We believe in building through the Draft" - McDermott "Unless it's somebody else's draft" - Beane. I mean, seriously. Why on earth would anyone expect they'll do a better job of drafting from the same talent pool, with mostly the same grades as every other team in the league? Can anyone tell me the last time that a tank or even a "rebuild" created a perennial contender/dynasty in the NFL? The Browns have shown no evidence thus far that it's worked. If it does, it'll be one the back of Kizer that every single team could have had. The Colts have yet to bear fruit from Suck for Luck Are the Bucs going to finally move from potential to contender? My money is nope. The Steelers, Patriots, Seahawks, Raiders, Broncos, Cowboys, Chiefs, Packers, Cardinals, etc haven't had to go through a "rebuild" let alone 5 or 6 of them to get where they are. They just drafted players that became stars and kept them. Except for the Broncos who don't have a QB, every single one of those teams QBs could have been had by any team that really wanted them. What I hear Beane/Buffalo Fans telling me is QB is all that matters. If that's the case why not just draft 3 every year, let the best 2 split time, keep the best one after the season and do the whole thing again the next year until you get a guy you can live with? What's the point of taking a 5th round linebacker if you're telling me you can't win without a top 10 QB? Draft them all. Take every Kirk Cousins, Derek Carr, Dak Prescott, Russel Wilson, etc that's available and get one that works out. If you get two, trade one for a linebacker. You're probably going to tell me that's ridiculous, but is it any more so than letting two 23 year old high draft picks walk out the door for slightly better than nothing?

I think it depends on the health of McCoy. I'll pick 7-9.

Save your breath. Buffalo hated Watkins since he got here because he took an extra 1rst round pick to get. No one really likes to acknoweldge the fact that's what it would have cost to get any player, but they never got over it. He could have been Jerry Rice, but everyone will always have wanted to draft Justin Gilbert #19 the following year...

A lot of folks are buying into the message. Some people actually believe Jordan Matthews is an upgrade over Watkins, because they still can't let go of the fact we had to trade a 1rst round pick to get him. Darby had a ROTY candidate season and a bad one, so obviously any 6th round corner off the street is also an upgrade. That sponsored FB post about Eddie Yarborough is generating a lot of positive buzz too. The 76'ers last won a division crown in 2001, wake me up when "trust the process" of a three year tank makes them a champion.

I think they'll have the worst back to back seasons in the last 30 years and get canned after 2018. Rookie HC and Rookie GM are out there looking like rookies. They may have already lost the team, so they'll gut it after the season and leave us with nothing. Jerry will go on to win a Super Bowl with NE, and Kyle Williams story goes down as one of the saddest stories in Bills Football.

If this new staff came in and said, "you know, we think WR is the biggest deficiency on this team, so we're going to overhaul it to give us a better chance to win. We'll trade Sammy and in return we'll be able to field a complete stable of capable Wideouts". I wouldn't like it still, but I'd understand it, and it would very well be a great move. Instead, when a staff comes in and says, we think WR, CB, S, LB, QB are the biggest deficiencies on our team so we'll just get rid of whatever we have left that has any value and start over because we know better than the half a dozen people that came before us. Forgive me for being skeptical. History says these guys will be out of jobs by the time whatever their vision was starts to show itself - not because I know they'll be awful, but because most of these guys get fired after 3-4 years. If they knew they'd be here for 20 years like Belichick then they could go ahead and rebuild the car from the frame up, but they have no guarantee of that. You need 10% more horsepower so drop in a turbo and live with the tan cloth interior for a couple years.

Tantrum? You can try to devalue my take all you want but it's based on logic and real things that happened. I haven't missed a game in over 25 years of watching this team, and I know they had a chance to win each of those games late in the 4th last year because they had the ball and didn't score. All I see coming out of the pro-trade crowd is a bunch of conjecture and superficial takes on how Watkins NEVER played, was ALWAYS hurt and that we should be lucky to get anything we could for him, like a 2nd rd pick and a depth corner. Just own that you made up your minds about this before it even happened and any real discussion on the topic is completely pointless, because you have no interest in actually questioning anything.

This is the best take I've seen on the subject. Wholesale stealing it. In a pre-Trump world where statistics and math were superior to the feels: http://www.footballdb.com/teams/nfl/buffalo-bills/results/2016

I hope they trade Kyle Williams to the pats. He deserves a chance to win a ring. Close to being my all-time favorite Bill. Send Shady to KC or Dallas. Tyrod to Denver. Jerry to Arizona, Wood to wherever Ragland to wherever

I don't *think* it, it's what happened. We lost 5 games by a touchdown or less and in each of those we had a shot to win at the very end of the game and couldn't get it done. Guys didn't get open, there were drops, picks, etc. It's even worse than that because IIRC if we beat miami and the jets the last two weeks of the season we were in. If you tell me that the team wasn't capable of winning 2-3 more games out of 5 how good of a Coach & GM can you really be? Maybe because they were both from the same team? We've tried this stuff before. We've been the Pittsburgh Bills, The New Jersey Bills, and now we're the Carolina Bills.

I'm concerned about them not picking the right guy after moving all in to do it. Coaches around the league do this constantly. They have the opinion that somehow their guys will be better than everyone else's guy and it almost never works out. In fact I really can't recall a coach & GM coming in and gutting a talented roster and coming out better on the other side. The NFL has so much parity today that it's unnecessarily. The Bills were literally 5 plays away from being a 12-4 team last year. They completely controlled their own destiny and it wasn't for a lack of talent that they didn't get the job done. Have Beane & McDermott with their 0 combined years of experience really convinced this fanbase that in order to get 5 more touchdowns per year we need to set a fire to everything we have and start all over again? I call bull ****. The simple addition of Anquan Boldin and a healthy watkins should have been all we needed to get over the hump. I dont want to wait another 4 years to find out if we have JP Losman and I sure as hell don't want to draft Andy Dalton or Ryan Tannehill and decide we have to hitch our Wagon to them for the next 10 years because it's as good as we can reasonably hope for. I have 0 expectations that we'll end up with a Brady, Manning, Rothlisberger, Brees etc, because you might as well play the powerball.

Not at all what I'm saying. My point is that the Bills are obviously putting themselves in a position to go up to #1 overall, and gutting the current team to do it, when the expected value of that pick is extremely low. The far better solution is to take many more, but less risky shots until you get someone that works. As an example, if the Bills knew they wanted a QB next year, which they obviously did, why not just draft Watson where they stood instead of trading back to draft a guy next year that may not be any better? If they didn't like what they saw form Watson year one, do it again next year. Everyone thought the redskins were silly for taking RGIII & Cousins, and it may have been the most savvy move they've ever made, in hindsight. Thanks for getting where I was going.

7+ QBs get drafted every year and 5-6 of them flame out of the league while 0-2 of them range from too serviceable to get rid of (Tannehill, Cutler, Dalton, etc) Getting that "QB for a decade plus" is winning the lottery. The Bolts still get flack from drafting Leaf, but if he didn't go 2, he would have gone 3rd, 4th, etc. It's not a science. Doing all of this to most likely get the next Ryan Tannehill is far from worth it. This is the worst time I've seen in the drought. There's no light at the end of the tunnel and a coaching staff is telling us that they can sell the farm next year and get a QB that will turn around this franchise on what will end up being a team otherwise void of talent: Gonna say my goodbyes to Kyle Williams and McCoy right now as they limp through this 20 game pre-season.

Why is everyone throwing around $20 million like that was some sort of realistic number. He probably would have been a lot closer to 10. For all the pissingand moaning that goes on around Buffalo for being a farm team for the rest of the league, I don't know how you let this slide. We just developed a top WR for another team to build a dynasty around.