oldmanfan

So all you can do is criticize the guy trying to get people to protect themselves and kiss the behind of the guy who let it get out of control to begin with and lied to the American people as recorded by Woodward. Got it.

Here it is. The video proves my point. In March 2020 when Dr. Fauci was interviewed he said the general public did not need to wear masks because health care workers needed them. And as further research as to how the virus spread primarily through droplets, and that not only N95 masks but surgical as well as cloth masks could mitigate spread, recommendations changed. The CDC started recommending masks and social distancing. That is called science. I do agree with the left wing guy that the full resources of the country could have been put into action to make a ton of masks early on. But remind me: who was running the country in the spring of 2020?

Anybody glad we got Bass?

I asked SoCalDeek what he would do if he were Biden since he keeps criticizing him, and that is what he said. So I agreed.

I just said if I were him I would make it mandated for all. And you saw how pissed I was about Afghanistan. So spare me the giving him a pass stuff.

He did not lie about masks and this has been debunked numerous times. When the pandemic first started he said the public should not wear masks because masks should be kept for health care workers. As more data became available as to how different types of masks could mitigate the spread of droplets, he said so. One of the most frustrating things for me with the pandemic is that so many people do not understand how science works. Or more accurately understand but willfully deny. As more research is done and more data is obtained you change your theories.

I agree with 2 and 3.

What exactly should he do? He stands up and tells people to get it but they’d rather believe nut case conspiracy garbage. So he then goes to mandates and people get up in arms. If you’re advising him give me two things you’d say to do.

Read what I wrote. These are facts and data, they are what should be used to drive decision making and not unfounded hysteria. I said previously in this thread that India has pulled Ivermectin from its list of drugs used for Covid because it is not effective. But here again you bring it up because you read it somewhere. The scientific method is being used here and it favors the use of vaccines because the data is unmistakable. And if the restrictions do not go away once this virus is under control, I’ll stand with you in opposition. Until then, stop refusing to see what science tells you because you want to turn everything into a political conspiracy. https://www.indiatoday.in/

First this is not a drug, it is a vaccine. Second, no one including me has ever said that we can guarantee with 100% confidence that there will not be an untoward side effect. In fact, because of the strenuous system that has been put in place by different regulatory agencies around the world, the very rare cases of blood clots with the J&J vaccine and myocarditis with Moderna and Phizef were found. As for 10-15 years from now, let’s look at results from other vaccines first. We have never seen side effects crop up with any at that time frame after immunization. And if you can find one let me know. The rare side effects that have been seen from past vaccines were all seen within weeks, as again were the rare ones with the Covid vaccines. Now let’s focus on the mRNA ones since they are “new”. First they are not new, decades of research have gone into them but yes, this is the first clinical application. These vaccines have the mRNA, some lipids for solubility, and salts. Which of those scientifically would cause an incident 10 years later? Lipids or salts ? How? The mRNA is translated into the spike protein, then degraded. It does not alter your DNA at all and is not gene therapy, and if you are a scientist and have ever taken introductory cell or molecular biology you know this. Have there been bad drugs that even after all the clinical trials came up with really bad side effects that weren’t found? Yes. Thalidomide is the one always quoted and after that regulatory requirements were tightened. I sit on an FDA devices panel and the regulatory requirements are very strict. But even with that there could be an extraordinarily rare event. One was the COX inhibitors for as anti-inflammatories which had to be pulled within months when folks started having heart attacks. Again this was found within months, not 10-15 years later. You say you are a scientist so you should know science and medicine are rarely 100% fields, unless you are talking about things like the law of gravity. Medicine is, as I have now said numerous times, is about benefit vs. risk. There is no question that the vaccine benefit far outweighs the risk. There is no question masks help alleviate droplet spread, or that social distancing helps prevent spread. But the same folks who deny the science of vaccines deny those as well. And it’s because of politics. And if you’re a scientist, you should look at the data and not play political games.

Ok boys, let’s matriculate the ball down the field!

Because you have too many idiots in this country who refuse to believe science and instead make this into a ridiculous political issue. I don’t. I want everyone who isn’t vaccinated to do so. You are against everything that could help, vaccines, masks, etc. As near as I can tell you’d be fine with your loved ones dying as long as it met with your political views.

The Washington Post, NPR, NBC, US news and World Report among others all have had stories in the past few weeks about his the infection and hospitalization rates are falling. Nice try.

About 8,000 out of 700,000 some deaths and out of about 180 million vaccinated. You wanted millions to die because you wanted to do nothing

1. Study done in Kentucky. It’s on the CDC website. The Israeli study is somewhat biased because the vast majority of folks were vaccinated before the delta variant arrived. And the stuff about pharmaceutical conspiracies would negate all the medications that have worked wonders for so many. Or would you rather we not have them? 3. No one agues that healthy living and boosting one’s own immune system is admirable. I take zinc for colds for example. Ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine do not have effect on Covid based on prospective randomized trials. India has pulled Ivermectin from use, and that was the country everyone pointed to as to being the proof of its efficacy. Regeneron I believe is the monoclonal and that is used once you have it and are hospitalized. A basic tenet of medicine is to prevent before needing to cure. Vaccines do that. 4. You ignore all historical data on vaccines showing that in the very rare case of side effects they are found within weeks, as the small risk of myocarditis and blood clots with Covid vaccines. You ignore the basic tenet of benefit vs. risk with medical treatments and I’ve already shown the math on that. 5. Vaccines introduce a foreign antigen into the body which stimulate an immune response, which is exactly what the Covid vaccines do. The delta variant can still reside in the upper respiratory tract for several days and thus be passed, but vaccinated people spread it less than unvaccinated, and of course unvaccinated account for over 90% of hospitalized patients and/or death. Vaccines do not have to offer a cure, that is not the definition. They help prevent you from getting infected as per flu vaccines, HPV vaccines, DPT vaccines, and so on. Some are much more effective such as the eradication of smallpox, sone require boosters such as tetanus, flu, and probably Covid. Finally this is a public health problem. It requires the public to work together to attack it. We did so with previous such crises such as polio. Why aren’t we doing so now? I think the answer is obvious. Good discussion for sure. Appreciate your thoughts.

How many should have died to make you happy?

Thanks for confirming your desire to just let people die off. In all your incessant ranting you have never offered one constructive thought about how to effectively deal with the pandemic, other than letting people die.

Since the pandemic started it appears your position has been to let the virus just spread and kill people. Billions of vaccine doses have been given with the benefits far outweighing risk.

Those are voluntary choices. A viral pandemic is not. Does that really need to be pointed out? Seriously?

And there are studies showing natural immunity is worse. And there are studies indicating not everyone who gets Covid mount as strong an immune response as others. And there are no other proven remedies. And by inferring young people or healthy people should just allow themselves to get infected, what you are saying is you are fine that some of them will die or have long lasting complications. If you truly think the way to handle this is to play Russian roulette with people’s lives, that is incredibly sad.

As far as masks, there is abundant data from both observational and laboratory studies showing that masks mitigate against the spread of droplets and aerosols, which are the main sources of transmission. As for vaccines, I really can’t believe I need to say this yet again, but the data on that shows that they are extremely protective against getting seriously ill and requiring hospitalization or resulting in death. The vast majority, over 90%, of hospitalized individuals are non-vaccinated. Is it still spreading? Spread slowed earlier this year, then went back up with the delta variant, and is now slowing again. You want to try to absolutely stop the spread? Get everyone vaccinated so the virus has no hosts within which to propagate and mutate. It is truly astounding to me that there are some on this board who feel we should never have done anything and just let people die.

I trick or treated in the snow more than not back in the day

There’s no reason to not have trick or treating

This is the most ridiculous thing you’ve posted yet. And that’s saying something. Equally ridiculous.

You think people care, but sadly to me attitudes many times say the opposite.