34-78-83

Good points.... I wanted to go there (about his improvement vs. the run ) but I figured it would be pushing it.

This place never ceases to amaze me. You guys are so sure of the BS you are spewing it's amazing. Just amazing. The guy is not a starting DE to stuff the run. He also is one of the fastest and most relentless pass rushers in the league. And he's got 3 good rush moves now. His He has always been exactly where the Bills staff wants him as far as being in shape. He plays a lot of containment responsibility as the slim DE and that's what they want him doing too. And plenty of coaches/players around the league have shown him plenty of respect. He's no complete DE, and certainly not comparable to a guy like Bruce, but he's a very good consitent player. He is one of the hardest working players on the team by many previous accounts who matter. The out of shape comments almost knocked me out of my chair. I can tell you really believe what you are saying so I don't know what else I can possibly say.

I'd say 20 is about right for Lee. He has proven a lot , but still needs to be better over the middle.

Schobel has already been a successful DE for many a year. So while I agree with you on that I am not trying to tell you "Wait and See". He is already a very good 4-3 Defensive End. He needs to keep playing well, not start playing well.

Lets just say I'm not going spout on about his pass rushing abilities when he is one of the better pass rushers in the league. Apparently many coaches and players in the league feel the same way, as do Jonathan Ogden and Orlando Pace based on their performances against him. And that stupid reference that you always see about "he just takes an outside rush right out of the TV picture" is as uninformed as they come. With a little push from out DT's, that oustside move to nowhereville becomes a sack. A.S. has proven himself to be a consistent player and has never shown up out of shape.

Ahh, ugly side of message boards. Where you come to trash one of the top 3 or 4 players on your team without having a shred of knowledge about how to evaluate the position he plays.

TKO was fantastic prior to the injury and scheme change.

I agree with Ramius on this, and Sapp was never a 2 Gap DT. Also, With Kyle Williams now being #4 in the rotation as opposed to #2, I think he'll be able to fill the bill just fine. He's a very hard working, instinctual player even though he's not quite ideal in size or talent.

Maybe it's because there is no Brady or Seymour type character on the Bills and that we ARE indeed a very young team.

This is why Langston Walker is sometimes used in these situations and has blocked like 7 kicks in his career. He's 6'8"

exactly....Hence my quotes around the word Starter

Everyone forgets that we went into the Titans game with 3 healthy "starters" on the O-line. We came out of the game with one. Not a chance in hell were we making the bowl that year. Let it go................

Chief!!!

Sept. 9 DENVER BRONCOS -- WIN Sept. 16 @ Pittsburgh Steelers -- LOSS Sept. 23 @ New England Patriots -- LOSS Sept. 30 NEW YORK JETS -- WIN Oct. 8 DALLAS COWBOYS -- WIN Oct. 21 BALTIMORE RAVENS -- LOSS Oct. 28 @ New York Jets -- WIN Nov. 4 CINCINNATI BENGALS -- LOSS Nov. 11 @ Miami Dolphins -- WIN Nov. 18 NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS -- WIN Nov. 25 @ Jacksonville Jaguars -- LOSS Dec. 2 @ Washington Redskins -- LOSS Dec. 9 MIAMI DOLPHINS -- WIN Dec. 16 @ Cleveland Browns -- WIN Dec. 23 NEW YORK GIANTS -- WIN Dec. 30 @ Philadelphia Eagles -- LOSS 9-7

Adrian Peterson- Browns Patrick Willis- Bills Brady Quinn- Dolphins Amobe Okoye- 49ers Ted Ginn Jr.- Patriots

I'd be ok with some combination of a 2nd and a 3rd for Turner. One of the picks being this year and one next year....

Nah, that's just the Tender figure. AJ Smith is smart enough to realize that Turner would only be obtained via trade , and the tender is a mere formality that will be waived.

Whoever ends up getting Turner, it would be crazy to think it will involve a 1st round pick (whether this year or next) given up so why is he even mentioned in this argument? You can have Turner AND your 1st round pick.

I miss Nate

The only way the Bills draft a WR in the first round this year is if we plan on not re-signing Lee within 2 years (wouldn't that suck?) or Calvin Johnson falls to #12 (Not going to happen). Otherwise I would officially declare the Bills staff insane from that point forward. There is no reason for a single team in today's NFL to have 2 legit round 1 WR's starting (and getting paid) on their team, unless one is half way out the door to retirement. There are always going to be other areas of need that outweigh picking something you already have, especially with all the turnover on teams. If we were picking closer to the end of the draft order, maybe.

I'd go Harris over Siler if it matters to any.....

Doh! Sorry

What about a guy like Dwayne Bowe ? (LSU WR)

It's impressive in itself that you know "Some Arizona fans"

You still honestly think this can be categorized as a debate????