OldTimer1960

Agreed, you can't pin any one loss on any one player. I guess my point was that I wouldn't want to compare NT candidates using Jeff Wright as an example of a good NT. IMHO, he was definitely not one of the strengths of that defense.

The Bills lost to the Giants because they could not stop the run. Wright was a very undersized NT who could penetrate on occasion, but was not stout against the run. You certainly can't blame him alone for the loss, but with a big time NT instead of Wright, I think the Bills would have beaten the Giants. You can disagree if you like.

I don't like the idea of a QB in this class in rounds 1-3. I don't really think it is worth wasting a 4th or 5th on "whoever is left over at QB" either. If they aren't going big with a round 1 QB (and I hope that they don't), then spend the picks on better players at other positions. Almost none of these 3rd, 4th, 5th round QBs ever amount to anything and some players picked at other positions in those rounds do pan out to be contributors - at least on special teams. Please spare me the "what about 6th round Tom Brady and 3rd round Joe Montana" comments. Those guys are very very rare.

We have to disagree on this one. Terrence Cody is a very risky pick in even the 2nd round, let alone trading up into the 1st round for a fat out-of-shape part-time player. Of course, that is just my opinion and I'd not be shocked if some team took him in the late first, but I'd just as soon it not be the Bills. Really, how much can you spend on a player who might only be capable of 20 snaps a game and won't ever play on 3rd downs because he has ZERO pass rush ability. He is so slow he couldn't get a sack even if nobody blocked him at all.

I agree with the general premise of this post. If the Bills don't think that any of the remaining OTs are legitimate very good LT candidates, then they should pass and pick a better player at another position (Unless they really want a RT, too - they have to know that Cornell Green is not a long-term answer). Players that I'd consider at other positions include: LB Sergio Kindle - top pass rushing 3-4 OLB candidate, no questions about effort, intensity, instincts or production DE Derrick Morgan - Good effort, solid all around DE - only if Bills think he fits their 3-4 scheme Brandon Grahm DE/OLB - Good effort and pass rushing ability, brings size to LB corp Rolando McClain - I don't like him as much as others here, but there could be much worse choice than him. Mike Iupati - G/RT - Love the nastiness, size, strength, but only a viable choice if they think he can play RT - know he isn't a good LT candidate. Outside candidates for me would be: Bruce Campbell - no knocks on effort, attitude or athletic ability. Concerned that he has only a year and a bit of starting experience in college. DE Jason Pierre-Paul - freak athlete, same concerns as with Campbell. Don't like Clausen or any of the other QBs, I think they are a waste of a draft choice this year as we'll be looking to replace them again in a few years. Not a big fan of picking CJ Spiller - nothing against him, but he's a bit undersized and will likely need to be platooned to be effective. Compared to Reggie Bush and I wouldn't spend the #9 pick this year to get a Reggie Bush clone. I'd love them to get a good NT, but the only 1st round guy is Dan Williams and I think #9 is at least 10-15 spots too high for Williams.

Jeff Wright was one of the reasons that the Bills didn't win one of the Super Bowls they were in. All good 3-4 defenses have a very good NT and while I like Kyle Williams very much as a player, I don't think he is going to be an outstanding NT to anchor a good 3-4 defense. Unfortunately, there aren't very many real 3-4 NT candidates in this years draft (at least good ones) and due to the shortage they will all likely be picked higher than their ability warrants. I am especially afraid of Terrence Cody and his lack of work ethic/effort. I think Dan Williams will be taken almost a full round ahead of where he should be and I don't think any of the rest of the NT candidates are worth more than a 3rd/4th round pick (all based on the reports I've read). So, they may be forced to play Kyle Williams at NT this year and he'll probably be "OK" there, but he would be better (I think) at DE or as a backup/change of pace NT behind a big NT.

Vick is 32 and is not the same level athlete he was "back when". He never was a good passer and I think his running will be significantly less effective now that he is older. What's to like?

Well thought out, but neither Iupati nor Ducasse are likely to play LT well and I am not even sure they are RT material. So (based on what I've read), you'd have an OL of a C and 4 Gs. I know that some have speculated that Iupati and Ducasse might be able to move to T, but man I'd hate to see those early picks spent on hoping that these guys from lower level colleges could move from G to T ( especially finding a LT from them). Just my opinion. By the way, I'd have no serious problem if they think Iupati is the best player available and want to try him at RT and if he wasn't good enough, put him back at G and move Wood or Levitre to C. BUT, that still leave the team without a legitimate LT.

McNabb is an old-man QB. Yes, he was good in his prime and yeah he's still better than Trent, Fitz or Brohm. BUT, I would not even remotely consider trading the Bills' 2nd for a 34 y.o. QB. IF this team was just a QB away from being a serious playoff contender (like the Jets were before last year), then I'd consider it. The reality is that this is a very young team that is completely changing their defensive scheme and has MANY personnel holes to fill with an all new coaching staff to boot. They need to fill OLT, ORT (I know Green is the stop-gap), NT, at least one LB position, a WR, hope that Wood comes back 100% and also find a QB. Trading a high draft pick for an old QB means not addressing one of those need positions early in the draft and also, by the time the Bills are able to fill in those gaps, McNabb will be retiring (or at least way on the downside of his career). If the Bills make a trade like that, who would McNabb throw to? They have Lee Evans and who else? How would McNabb look throwing behind the seive-like OL that the Bills have? I don't like the idea. Now, if they'd take Whitner and a late pick for McNabb, I'd consider it.

AGREED!

Why not? Because at 34, McNabb does not have "3-5 years left". McNabb has at most 1 or 2 years left in his tank and he won't be as effective behind a swiss-cheese OL in Buffalo as he's been in Philly. "Outside of a 1st round pick for a LT, what do we really need?" How about NT, a couple LBs, a WR or two, a young QB and maybe some DEs and a TE. This team is not 1 player away from the playoffs and even if they were, I wouldn't be excited to part with high draft choices for an old QB that might have 1 more run in him.

While NT is a very big need for the Bills, I haven't read enough consistently good things about Dan Williams to think he is worth a pick that high. I am not impressed with somebody's mock draft projecting him to the top 15, I want to see scouting reports that really suggest that he is worth that high a pick. What I've seen is that even though he is big and strong with pretty good athleticism, he can consistently be pushed back by OL due to not getting good leverage. This team CAN NOT afford to draft a gimmick player like McCluster in round 2. They need big men at OT, NT, DE and LB way before a part-time RB. Brandon Spikes has slipped because he isn't the athlete that many thought he was. I read somewhere that he recently ran a 5.0 40 time. That is very slow for an ILB - you'd hope that he'd be around 4.8 or better. Still, he'd seem to be an intersting pick in the 3rd round.

I am not a big Clausen fan, so it won't bother me if he isn't available. I really don't like any of the QBs in this draft as I am not sure any are much of an upgrade over JP Losman/Trent Edwards/Fitzpatrick... Regarding trading down, so many on this board seem to think it's as simple as saying, "right, we want an extra 2nd round pick - get in line to give us your 2nd in order to swap 1st round picks." A team needs a motivated trading partner - a team that is desperate enough to give up a valuable pick or picks to move up and grab somebody. If both QBs are gone and the OTs are gone (and assuming Sue and McCoy are gone), who would a team be willing to pay a high price to move up for? I guess if Derrick Morgan were available, some team might want him. *Maybe* WR Dez Bryant might draw interest, but WR isn't a "premium" position. Same with RB CJ Spiller... I guess, I'd like it if they could trade back and pick up an extra second, but I think it is a lot harder to do than most think.

He was still 370 at the combine. That isn't any significant progress in 3 or 4 years! Now, I know he is supposedly down to about 354 or so. I say, too late buddy. I imagine his agent has locked him in the sauna and is feeding him 1 cracker a day to get him to lose the weight. Once he gets paid, the weight will likely be back on. I get that Bruce Smith got "fitness religion", but he is a rare example. More often than not, fat guys in college are fat guys in the NFL (and then they are fat guys NOT in the NFL).

I guess I could be persuaded that taking a great QB over fixing the OL would make sense IF there were going to be a great QB prospect available. I don't know if Bradford is a great prospect, but he'll be gone before their pick anyway. I DO NOT think that Clausen or Tebow or Lefevour or any of the other QBs in this draft are great prospects. Hence my opinion is that while it is clear that the Bills need a much better QB, there isn't one available so do what you can to shore up the rest of the team so that you can maximize the effectiveness of the QBs that you have. Wishing and hoping that Clausen is the answer will likely lead to more pain and years of losses.

Man, I can't imagine gambling a #1 pick on a guy that is SOOOO out of shape. That's a BAD idea in my opinion. He couldn't get motivated enough to get in shape with TONS of $ on the line, how fat do you think he'll get once they hand him enough money to be set for life? I just don't think Cody in the first (or second) round is a good idea - too unmotivated - talented yes, but too big of a risk.

Yes, I agree that they are hard to find. But, why would you want an average one? I can't think of any very good 3-4 defenses with average NTs. Round one is too high (IMHO) to take an average player whom you will be trying to replace shortly after drafting him. I'd just as soon they backtrack on their decision to go 3-4 and stay with the 4-3. Seems there are more good 4-3 DTs and ends this year than 3-4 NTs or ends. Why fight what's available? I thought this coaching staff's claim to fame was not being married to a particular scheme. Doesn't seem to be the case on defense as they seem committed to changing to 3-4 regardless of whether they have the personnel to make it work.

If there were a dominant NT available to the Bills in the first, I would support taking him. However, I don't see one in the draft worth taking in the first, let alone as high as 9th. Too many varied opinions on Dan Williams, but NONE of them say he is a dominating run-stuffing machine who will really set the line in an NFL 3-4. They read more like "he has power and will do the dirty work in the trenches". That doesn't scream 9th overall pick to me. Beyond Williams, there are few true NT candidates that I'd even want in the 2nd. Scouts don't agree on Cam Thomas from NC - some rate him highly, others think little of him. I am not a big Terrence Cody fan - anyone who can't be bothered to get in shape for a job interview that could land him $Millions has to scare you. From what I've read, the remaining candidates are more 3rd-4th round guys: Torell Troup, Linval Joseph and maybe Al Woods. While I think that NT is a very key position for a team that aspires to run a 3-4, I do not advocate reaching for one in the 1st or 2nd "just to get one".

Draft two OTs early? They'll be lucky to find one that can play LT let alone a Left and Right Tackle. For all of the talk of how "deep" the draft is at OT, I don't see it for LTs. There seems to be Russell Okung and then a bunch of questions: Trent William's work ethic and effort have been questioned. Anthony Davis' ability to stay in shape and his judgement have been questioned (didn't even show for his pro-day and then when called refused to work out or be weighed). Bryan Bulaga has everything you want in terms of effort and attitude, but some question his strength and whether he is an elite-enough athlete to pick in the top 10 Bruce Campbell - is supposed to be a tremendous athlete, but supposedly lacks aggressiveness and lacks experience (having started only 17 games in college). I don't like any of the guys whose work ethic and effort are concerns - especially Davis. Bulaga seems to be the safest pick of the bunch (that has a chance to be available) - he seems to have the "highest floor", but maybe the "lowest ceiling" of the group. Campbell probably would be my next choice in that there are no real knocks on his effort and he has super athletic ability. I could live with the concern about being a "finesse" blocker as LT is more about pass protection than being a powerful run blocker. As far as OTs after the first round, I think many here are over-rating them. Saffold might be interesting in the 2nd with eventual starting-LT potential, but is the 9th pick in the 2nd round too high for him? I guess if the Bills want more power and less pass blocking ability at LT, they could consider Vlad Ducasse in the 2nd - if he's still available. Beyond him, I think the pickings are slim and they'd be getting a guy that they'd be trying to replace again soon. I guess they could maybe consider Charles Brown in the 2nd, too, but for a guy who was at a very top level program, it concerns me that he isn't more physically developed and didn't play better since his team was usually much better than the opposition. So, what do they do? I could easily see them going with another position in the first because they don't like the guys that are left when their pick is up. If they do, that will leave them with the potential of not filling the LT position in the draft, but I'd rather they do that than reach for someone that they aren't sold on at LT. As for RT, I guess I agree with the thread's poster that they may be able to find a future starting RT in the 2nd or 3rd round.

What do you propose to give up for a 34 year old QB who has relied in the past at least as much on his athletic ability as his passing ability? You want to spend the Bills' 2nd pick on Tebow, right? So, then what would you give Philly to acquire McNabb? I would not even consider giving up their first for McNabb and I don't think the Eagles would take a 3rd this year (and I'd be reluctant to part with that, too).

Boy, FAT Cody in the first round is a BIG BIG gamble. The guy hasn't bothered to get into decent shape when $MILLIONS are on the line - enough to set himself and his family for life. How on earth will he be able to be motivated once he HAS that money? In my opinion, he would be THE biggest risk in round 1 and maybe even in round 2. Yeah, I know he's lost a few pounds since the Senior Bowl and I know that there have been some HUGE FAT DTs that have been pretty good, but I'd be very leery of spending a high pick on that guy.

I could be wrong, but I don't like Clausen. I don't know how you can call fat Anthony Davis a "workout warrior". Workout warrior refers to a player who performs better in combine-like drills than he does in actual games. If anything, Davis is more of an ugly guy who has gotten good results - but don't read me wrong, I don't want hm because of the negative things I've read about his work ethic. Now, Bruce Campbell might be described as a "workout warrior". I don't know if that is true or if he is just young and inexperienced. He is only a Junior coming out and is a phenomenal athlete. Question is whether he will blossom with more coaching and experience or is he a very athletic guy who isn't a great football player?

I am not arguing that the Bills should draft Tebow, but why do you think "Pike or Skelton are the best options for us"? Pike is a guy who showed nothing until someone ahead of him got hurt and he is very skinny (injury prone) and didn't play against a very high level of competition at Cinci. Skelton is a big-arm who didn't dominate against an even lower level of competition. Granted, these guys both have good arms, but why is that enough - especially if they'd need to be taken within a round or two of Tebow? College play and level of competition should have a lot to do with evaluation and Tebow was much more productive over a longer period of time at a higher level of competition. If having the raw arm-strength is enough, then most pitching starved MLB teams should only have to turn to a couple of their outfielders who have great arms. Clearly that isn't enough. There is more to playing QB (or pitcher) in the majors than just arm strength.

You can do the same exercise for each round of the draft for any team. Have the Bills missed more than their share of 1st round picks? Maybe, but they aren't that far off from most other teams. As you said, the draft is a crap-shoot and the Bills biggest problem has been a lack of decent QB play. Where would NE be if they hadn't gotten stupid lucky on Tom Brady in round 6? Yeah, they did pick him, but there is no way they expected anything like what they got from their 6th round pick. Take Brady away and the Pats are probably much like the Bills have been for some time. Now, I am not saying that I think the Bills should draft a QB this year. I don't like what I've read about any of them other than Bradford who won't be available. I am just arguing that sometimes its when you get lucky that you are the smartest (like SF was with Joe Montana in round 3).

It isn't just about "practice and learning", a player also has to have enough size and athletic ability to play a position. By that logic, Demetrius Bell and Jamon Meredith should also be fine at LT because they too have all offseason to practice and learn. Now, maybe Levitre is an exception and he can overcome his relative lack of height and shorter arms to be a good NFL LT. I don't know that. But, I do know that most or all of the starting LTs in the NFL are taller and have longer arms than he does.