Guest dog14787 Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Jaws understands it takes good execution for the no huddle to work properly and until we execute properly the no huddle will struggle. Common sense tells you communicating back and forth will help improve our execution. Maybe we can work our way through it, time will tell I suppose. Going up against the Pats it would be beneficial if the Bills could control the ball and win the time of possession because you really need to keep Tom Brady off the field as much as possible. In that respect the no huddle does not work to our advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 So, if you actually read Jaws' comments, his concerns pertain solely to the communication factor with young players up front. He doesn't question the skill players or Edwards' ability to run it. His concerns are absolutely legitimate. What NONE of us know is whether the Bills are in fact going to be able to communicate effectively at the LOS. Maybe Jaws will be right, and maybe he won't. Honestly, is there ANY expert out there who thinks the Bills are doing the right thing with the no-huddle at this point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 So, if you actually read Jaws' comments, his concerns pertain solely to the communication factor with young players up front. He doesn't question the skill players or Edwards' ability to run it. His concerns are absolutely legitimate. What NONE of us know is whether the Bills are in fact going to be able to communicate effectively at the LOS. Maybe Jaws will be right, and maybe he won't. Honestly, is there ANY expert out there who thinks the Bills are doing the right thing with the no-huddle at this point? It did catch my attention last night when Big Ben contributed his teams ability to pull off the tough win by utilizing the no huddle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Bills fan Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Can anyone answer this for me? When the Bills installed the no-huddle attack in the '90's, did we already have an effective offense, or was it the no-huddle that made it effective? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 What difference dose it make if you are running the same play with or without it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Bills fan Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 What difference dose it make if you are running the same play with or without it? It means our defense will be on the field for waaaaaaay too long making it much easier for opposing offenses to score on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Can anyone answer this for me? When the Bills installed the no-huddle attack in the '90's, did we already have an effective offense, or was it the no-huddle that made it effective? Ted Marchibroda was the OC from 89 -91 and the offense was effective before and after the the no huddle was introduced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Bills fan Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Ted Marchibroda was the OC from 89 -91 and the offense was effective before and after the the no huddle was introduced. Cheers for that. That's what I thought I remembered too. The thing with THIS offense, is that it stinks like holy hell, but they're counting on the no huddle to miraculously make it better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 So, if you actually read Jaws' comments, his concerns pertain solely to the communication factor with young players up front. He doesn't question the skill players or Edwards' ability to run it. There you go. Jaws has been reading my August posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Cheers for that.That's what I thought I remembered too. The thing with THIS offense, is that it stinks like holy hell, but they're counting on the no huddle to miraculously make it better. Sure seems that way and without good execution you just run sloppy plays at a fast pace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koufax Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 I have heard this a lot and I don't agree at all. I think we are remembering what was the weakness of the K-Gun...which was having our D on the field a lot whether it was a 1:15 three and out or a 3:25 TD drive. 3 and outs will kill this offense whether it stalls 30 seconds more or not. I don't think the difference between the two is significant enough when factored in TV timeouts, opponents 15 play drives, etc. What will kill us is not moving the chains. That is a complete and absolute reality no matter how long we huddle or don't. I agree it will kill us slightly faster if we don't huddle, all things being equal. But the point is that the no-huddle is supposed to not make all things equal. It is designed to HELP us get MORE first downs, move the ball more effectively, and score more often. If our coaching staff is mistaken and the no huddle will not increase our offensive productivity, then the increased tempo will work against us slightly, but not as significantly as I think some think. If instead it helps our productivity by getting simpler defenses, tiring out opponents snap to snap, then I think that will easily offset the disadvantage of giving the ball back sooner when it goes right (quick score) or when it goes wrong (quick 3 and out). Can anybody with game tapes compare the total time between opponents snaps on some of our no huddle 3 and outs in the preseason and normal huddling 3 and outs last year? I'm curious what it means in terms of both game time and real world time. The biggest draw back to the no huddle would be a quick 3 and out repeatedly. The Bills have offensive skill players in ample supply. If Trent can find his nads and push the ball downfield a bit, this could be pretty exciting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 I have heard this a lot and I don't agree at all. I think we are remembering what was the weakness of the K-Gun...which was having our D on the field a lot whether it was a 1:15 three and out or a 3:25 TD drive. 3 and outs will kill this offense whether it stalls 30 seconds more or not. I don't think the difference between the two is significant enough when factored in TV timeouts, opponents 15 play drives, etc. What will kill us is not moving the chains. That is a complete and absolute reality no matter how long we huddle or don't. I agree it will kill us slightly faster if we don't huddle, all things being equal. But the point is that the no-huddle is supposed to not make all things equal. It is designed to HELP us get MORE first downs, move the ball more effectively, and score more often. If our coaching staff is mistaken and the no huddle will not increase our offensive productivity, then the increased tempo will work against us slightly, but not as significantly as I think some think. If instead it helps our productivity by getting simpler defenses, tiring out opponents snap to snap, then I think that will easily offset the disadvantage of giving the ball back sooner when it goes right (quick score) or when it goes wrong (quick 3 and out). Can anybody with game tapes compare the total time between opponents snaps on some of our no huddle 3 and outs in the preseason and normal huddling 3 and outs last year? I'm curious what it means in terms of both game time and real world time. I agree with you 100 percent. If the offense isn't effective, not huddling will hurt us only a bit because as you pointed out, there are many mechanisms within an NFL game which adds time between plays anyways. The effect of a no huddle 3 and out would only be slight compared to a conventional three and out (yes, this is a sad discussion to be having). The decision to use a no huddle would be based upon an evaluation of the cost/benefit or risk/reward. Clearly Jauron feels he has more to gain than to lose by implementing this system. Hopefully he's right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishman Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Can anyone answer this for me? When the Bills installed the no-huddle attack in the '90's, did we already have an effective offense, or was it the no-huddle that made it effective? The year prior being Buffalo implemented the "no-huddle" full time we had an effective offense but it definitely could have been better. What everybody noticed was when we went into the 2minute drill, we would EASILY march up and down the field and score a quick TD within a minute or so w/Jim Kelly @ the helm. Then towards the 2nd half of that season we used it from time to time with the same gret results. I remember going to the home opener the following year and I can't remember who we were playing off-hand but once Buffalo received the ball for the very 1st time in the game the no huddle was immediately utilized. The one thing I remember vividly @ the game is when they did that the whole stadium erupted into cheers. It was obvious from the Owner, to the coaches, to the players, and to right up to the fans in the stands is that was the way to go. They never looked back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 One more thought on this debate. I hope the Bills have made it very clear to the NFL officials that there intention is to run the no huddle as quickly as possible so that the officials don't lollygag in spotting the ball. Slow spotting of the ball after a play is one element which could reduce the tempo in which we run the no huddle. Of course it seems like the Patsies have the NFL in their hip pocket. Nonetheless I hope this point has been made to the NFL...just so it's on the record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFLstyle Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 I seriously think we need to trust the coaching staff here. If Jauron didn't think these young guys on the line could handle the no huddle, he wouldn't have gone with it, and most certainly wouldn't still be sticking with it. It might struggle a big early, but when you think about how young this offense is, it might be best for the long run. Everyone's saying we must win this year. Well, I don't find that to be necessarily true. It would be nice to win, but you can't put all your eggs in one basket. This is finally developing a young Oline from scratch, instead of compiling a makeshift offensive line. When the team struggles for the first half of the season, don't throw in the towel. I half a feeling the second half of the season is going to be much better, and heading into next year we'll have a lot of momentum. (Yes, cue the argument "that's how it is every year." True, but I'm not sure this is their year with the difficult schedule and a new offensive line. As much as nobody wants to admit it, this team has all the makings of a two-year plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 The year prior being Buffalo implemented the "no-huddle" full time we had an effective offense but it definitely could have been better. What everybody noticed was when we went into the 2minute drill, we would EASILY march up and down the field and score a quick TD within a minute or so w/Jim Kelly @ the helm. Then towards the 2nd half of that season we used it from time to time with the same gret results. I remember going to the home opener the following year and I can't remember who we were playing off-hand but once Buffalo received the ball for the very 1st time in the game the no huddle was immediately utilized. The one thing I remember vividly @ the game is when they did that the whole stadium erupted into cheers. It was obvious from the Owner, to the coaches, to the players, and to right up to the fans in the stands is that was the way to go. They never looked back. As I recall, the K-Gun was installed at the beginning of the 1990 season, after it was used to great effect throughout the second half of the playoff loss to the Cleveland Browns the previous season--yes, the Ronnie Harmon dropped ball game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Maybe he meant when he got the proper coaching so he could develop? JP could have been coached by the ghost of Vince F'n Lombardi & he still wouldn't have been any good. When are you going to get it that a million $ arm & a 10 cent brain =an uncoachable player & a bust at QB? He had Sam Wyche, a man who proved to be a very good coach of QBs as his QB coach his 1st 2 seasons and he couldn't learn anything from him. Proper coaching? He had "proper coaching". Just because you fell in love with a bum, don't blame the coaching he got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wing Man Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Nobody watches more film than Jaws, and Trent Edwards is no Jim Kelly. I could substitute my dead grandmother in the time it takes the Bills to get to the line of scrimmage. If we continue to run the no-huddle with this speed and efficiency, it's going to be a long season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 3 and out is 3 and out. If you huddle and throw 3 incomplete passes, what is the difference, 30 seconds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numark Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 The consensus opinion of most football people who follow the NFL is that the Bills are going to have a tough season. I can't recall one football "expert" predicting that the Bills will make the playoffs. (Donte Whitner is not an expert or objective). The local press whose job is to cover the team (Hamilton, Sullivan and Wilson etc) all come to the same conclusion that the Bills are going to struggle. You don't have to be a football expert to see a looming bust of a season. Most local fans who are sober are smart enough to realize that our owner, front office and coaching staff are very mediocre. No one should be surprised. Just look at the record for the past decade. I guess you are right. Let's not wait a few weeks to see how they do, let's just officially claim they suck. That was easy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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