Does it really make sense?

[Alphadawg7]

Firing Turk was much needed and even more obviously needed now that all the internal differences have to light. I am glad we did that...but does it make sense to promote Van Pelt to the new OC?

 

I understand the basic logic of the move which is he knows the offense, but honestly, Van Pelt has been the QB coach and Trent seems to have only regressed. Not to mention, he knows the offense, the very offense that has stunk the last 3 years.

 

Seems to me you earn promotions and what has Van Pelt done to earn a promotion? Trent has a lousy 18 TD's (21 if you count the 3 rushing) to 23 turnovers in 23 games. He averages one turnover a game. Not to mention Trent has been regressing not progressing, and Van Pelt was his QB coach.

 

So as much as I like the Turk firing, I sit back and wonder what does it Van Pelt bring to the table becaue his body of work as both a player and a coach sure doesnt seem to indicate we are any better shape. I hope he can do some good with this new position, but the more I think about it the more his hiring has me scratching my head...

[Albany,n.y.]

Firing Turk was much needed and even more obviously needed now that all the internal differences have to light. I am glad we did that...but does it make sense to promote Van Pelt to the new OC?

 

I understand the basic logic of the move which is he knows the offense, but honestly, Van Pelt has been the QB coach and Trent seems to have only regressed. Not to mention, he knows the offense, the very offense that has stunk the last 3 years.

 

Seems to me you earn promotions and what has Van Pelt done to earn a promotion? Trent has a lousy 18 TD's (21 if you count the 3 rushing) to 23 turnovers in 23 games. He averages one turnover a game. Not to mention Trent has been regressing not progressing, and Van Pelt was his QB coach.

 

So as much as I like the Turk firing, I sit back and wonder what does it Van Pelt bring to the table becaue his body of work as both a player and a coach sure doesnt seem to indicate we are any better shape. I hope he can do some good with this new position, but the more I think about it the more his hiring has me scratching my head...

Unless they want to hire 1 of the 2 other fired OCs who else is out there in September? They had no choice but to hire from within. Based on the Bills offensive record, who within the organization would have satisfied you? If you have a name, tell us who you want.

[ThereIsNoDog]

The only other realistic choices were Studesville, Tolbert, Coiner, and Kugler. But from what I gather, the QB coach has to know the offense almost as well as the OC. And Van Pelt has stated that he wants to be an OC and someday a HC.

[Alphadawg7]

Unless they want to hire 1 of the 2 other fired OCs who else is out there in September? They had no choice but to hire from within. Based on the Bills offensive record, who within the organization would have satisfied you? If you have a name, tell us who you want.

 

Honestly, I dont know who else is out there right now, but there has to be someone more qualified than Van Pelt. Not saying Van Pelt will fail, but I just am not sold he is going to make much of a difference.

 

One name intriguing given the weapons he could use on this team is Martz...

[Alphadawg7]

The only other realistic choices were Studesville, Tolbert, Coiner, and Kugler. But from what I gather, the QB coach has to know the offense almost as well as the OC. And Van Pelt has stated that he wants to be an OC and someday a HC.

 

I totally get that, and I understand why he was chosen...but given the high risk gamble of firing a OC at this point why not take a little more risk and grab someone outside the organization who has proven to be able to produce some offense instead of a guy who has overseen our young QB's regression with no OC experience...I mean I hope he does well, just not a lot to hang your hat on here with his hiring other than he is not Turk...

[spartacus]

Let's be clear

 

Alex is not the OC

 

He calls the plays and is the passing game coordinator,

 

which has no more priority than eric as the running game coordinator.

 

 

as with all other Bills management structure, there is no one in charge to be held accountable

[PushthePile]

Honestly, I dont know who else is out there right now, but there has to be someone more qualified than Van Pelt. Not saying Van Pelt will fail, but I just am not sold he is going to make much of a difference.

 

One name intriguing given the weapons he could use on this team is Martz...

Martz is cancer. His offense and our defense wouldn't mesh to well. Personally, I don't like the thought of Trent or Ryan slinging it around every down, especially in Buffalo's wind. While Van Pelt is not a real exciting pick, he seems to be well liked by the players and is familiar with the offense and its personel. Every great coach got a break somewhere, who knows.

[SteamRoller67]

Honestly, I dont know who else is out there right now, but there has to be someone more qualified than Van Pelt. Not saying Van Pelt will fail, but I just am not sold he is going to make much of a difference.

 

One name intriguing given the weapons he could use on this team is Martz...

 

Martz would change the entire offense immediately.

Why would you want to bring someone in to teach an entirely new scheme in 9 days?

Stick it out with AVP and he might actually surprise some folks. The worst misconception in sports is the new guy can't coach at the same level as a guy who's done it before. Youth and new ideas are the lifeblood of the NFL.

[Alphadawg7]

Martz is cancer. His offense and our defense wouldn't mesh to well. Personally, I don't like the thought of Trent or Ryan slinging it around every down, especially in Buffalo's wind. While Van Pelt is not a real exciting pick, he seems to be well liked by the players and is familiar with the offense and its personel. Every great coach got a break somewhere, who knows.

 

Yeah, I am not a big Martz fan either, but the guy does have a knack for developing the passing O, something we have been missing since Bledsoes frist year in Buffalo.

 

I hope you are right about AVP, just not much to hang your hat on with him. If Trent had been progressing instead of regressing I feel much better about it...

[Original Byrd Man]

I totally get that, and I understand why he was chosen...but given the high risk gamble of firing a OC at this point why not take a little more risk and grab someone outside the organization who has proven to be able to produce some offense instead of a guy who has overseen our young QB's regression with no OC experience...I mean I hope he does well, just not a lot to hang your hat on here with his hiring other than he is not Turk...

How would a new OC implement his offense a week before the season kick off??? Not happening! I believe AVP will excel and be hired as OC for next year. And as far as your comment about TE's regression, It may be all him. He was never the same after the concussion. And to be honest he hadn't exactly set the world on fire before that.

[SteamRoller67]

Let's be clear

 

Alex is not the OC

 

He calls the plays and is the passing game coordinator,

 

which has no more priority than eric as the running game coordinator.

 

as with all other Bills management structure, there is no one in charge to be held accountable

 

????

Ofcourse Alex is the one being held accountable...he's calling the plays. He has more priority because he's sending the play in. Nobody will blame Studesville if the 3rd and 3 play action bomb falls incomplete.

 

It doesn't matter if his title is offensive custodial assistant or O.C.

[Lori]

Martz would change the entire offense immediately.

Why would you want to bring someone in to teach an entirely new scheme in 9 days?

Stick it out with AVP and he might actually surprise some folks. The worst misconception in sports is the new guy can't coach at the same level as a guy who's done it before. Youth and new ideas are the lifeblood of the NFL.

For the unintentional comedy factor, against New England in a stadium where the Bills are 0-7, on national TV?

[Alphadawg7]

Martz would change the entire offense immediately.

Why would you want to bring someone in to teach an entirely new scheme in 9 days?

Stick it out with AVP and he might actually surprise some folks. The worst misconception in sports is the new guy can't coach at the same level as a guy who's done it before. Youth and new ideas are the lifeblood of the NFL.

 

I totally get what you are saying, but on the flip side, do you really think this offense is prepared to come in and compete with the Pats as is right now? Changes have to made one way or another and as much as I hate to say it, we likely wont win the NE game no matter who our OC is. The TB game is a toss up and the Saints game looks like a high potential loss too given your lack of offensive production.

 

So, if you think about it, we are looking at a very real possibility of being 1-2 or 0-3 in the first 3 weeks anyway with AVP. So, if you bring in another guy, installing a new O that will put us in a much better position by week 4 really gives him a full month to get the offense developed. Its not like our opening schedule is a cake walk and we are risking some easy wins, know what I mean...

 

But who knows, AVP may surprise us, and I hope he does because given our schedule we are going to need a lot more production from Offense than we have had the last 3 years

[CodeMonkey]

He is probably cheap. Heck, didn't AVP work for free 2 seasons ago?

[crazyDingo]

Let's be clear

 

Alex is not the OC

 

He calls the plays and is the passing game coordinator,

 

which has no more priority than eric as the running game coordinator.

 

 

as with all other Bills management structure, there is no one in charge to be held accountable

Oh, goody, Ralph just expanded his Circle of Trust.

[transient]

Firing Schonert 10 days before the season was a desperation move by a coach who knows he's in real danger of losing his job. He has no time to let another OC teach a very young offense an entirely new system. He would be fired before they ever learned it. The only chance he has is to work with what's already in place and get rid of the desenting voice (based on the interview Schonert gave after his firing.) In addition, who from the outside is going to want to come in for 4 games before the coaching housecleaning that is likely on the horizon?

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

If he were progressing, it's unlikely there would have been a need for a change.

 

I hope you are right about AVP, just not much to hang your hat on with him. If Trent had been progressing instead of regressing I feel much better about it...

 

 

It likely would take more than four weeks, plus you typically sign players to play a certain offense, again something that's done in off season. At this point, AVP was the best option for them.

 

So, if you think about it, we are looking at a very real possibility of being 1-2 or 0-3 in the first 3 weeks anyway with AVP. So, if you bring in another guy, installing a new O that will put us in a much better position by week 4 really gives him a full month to get the offense developed. Its not like our opening schedule is a cake walk and we are risking some easy wins, know what I mean...

[THE GASH STATION]

Riddle me this

IF AVP is the qb coach / passing coach and

Studesville is the running game coach

Who decides if they will run or pass ???

Please please dont say tricky dick.

[John from Riverside]

Lets face facts

 

I pride myself on being one of the eternal optomists of this board.......do you know what I look forward to this year?

 

- Watching young guys that I know will be with this team next year go thru their learning experiences and get better....guys like Bell, Wood, Levitre, McKelvin, Maybin, Harris etc.

 

- Knowing that this horrible coaching staff will not be able to save its jobs and they will all be gone this time next year

 

- Having draft pick selections good enough to make a difference since we know this owner will not pay for the premium free agent talent.....we will only improve by better coaching and solid draft picks

 

My bar is set very low this next year in all honesty

[Guest dog14787]

Riddle me this

IF AVP is the qb coach / passing coach and

Studesville is the running game coach

Who decides if they will run or pass ???

Please please dont say tricky dick.

 

 

Holy Dick Tracy Batman, a Studesville equipped with AVP sounds like DJ's ticket to glory.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Riddle me this

IF AVP is the qb coach / passing coach and

Studesville is the running game coach

Who decides if they will run or pass ???

Please please dont say tricky dick.

If you believe what Schonert said, Jauron has already had a big hand in setting the table. Jauron has been insistant on reducing the complexity of the offense.

 

If you believe what Jason Peters said, then the Bills play book that Schonert was using was already markedly smaller than the one the Eagles use.

 

AVP and Studesville may not have a lot of options.

 

"What do you think? It's 1st and 10."

"Flip the coin, man."

"OK. It was heads. Damn."

"Ha! We run it. Call our running play."

"Well, that sucked. It's 2nd and 11."

"I thought we'd execute that play better this time. It's almost like they're in our huddle. Well, flip the coin."

"Tails."

"Call the pass play."

"Damn. They had TO quadruple covered again. Nice scramble, though."

"It's 3rd and 9. Flip the coin."

"This is Skeletor speaking... you guys are getting too fancy! Dumb it down!"

"Heads."

"Call the run play. ... April, get the punter's leg uncramped quick."

 

[spartacus]

Riddle me this

IF AVP is the qb coach / passing coach and

Studesville is the running game coach

Who decides if they will run or pass ???

Please please dont say tricky dick.

 

ah - grasshopper

 

you have stumbled on the complete farce that our offense has become

 

the last time the bills used this structure without someone qualified to play referee resulted in one of the "run/pass coordinators" getting his head smashed through a wall by the other

[spartacus]

Lets face facts

 

I pride myself on being one of the eternal optomists of this board.......do you know what I look forward to this year?

 

- Watching young guys that I know will be with this team next year go thru their learning experiences and get better....guys like Bell, Wood, Levitre, McKelvin, Maybin, Harris etc.

 

- Knowing that this horrible coaching staff will not be able to save its jobs and they will all be gone this time next year

 

- Having draft pick selections good enough to make a difference since we know this owner will not pay for the premium free agent talent.....we will only improve by better coaching and solid draft picks

 

My bar is set very low this next year in all honesty

 

why are you so sure Dick will be fired.

 

He is the coach when season ticket record sales were set.

He already has a 2 pronged excuse for a bad 2009 (OC gone bad and a gutted OL)

 

By being paid peanuts (for an NFL HC), Ralph is maximizing cash flow.

 

If Dick gets fired, Ralph has to pay 2 coaches- not going to happen.

 

Russ will come up with some flash and pizzazz (like the TO signing) to con the fans and all is well in Ralph's world.

[BuffaloBillsMagic1]

Yeah, I am not a big Martz fan either, but the guy does have a knack for developing the passing O, something we have been missing since Bledsoes frist year in Buffalo.

 

I hope you are right about AVP, just not much to hang your hat on with him. If Trent had been progressing instead of regressing I feel much better about it...

Our O sucks so bad and for so long how much worse could Martz or anyone else outside of Billsville make it. i say Martz or Shanahan as O cooridnatior and then fire Dickless and replace him with either one when we are 2-7.