Vincent Moving To Safety

[flomoe]

Call this a hunch but I think that the Bills plan all along was to have Vincent move to safety sooner or later. He probably would have been there sooner if he didn't have the injury. The Bills do have the luxury of having pretty decent CB's to step up and fill the CB, Nickel and Dime positions. Thomas will probably move to Nickel and Greer or Reese will take over at Dime. Reese wasn't a bad Safety but Vincent gives the Bills a little more flexibility with their defensive coverages which might allow Milloy to cheat closer to the line and get man to man on the TE's which have been burning us this year. I like the move and am sure it would have been looked at earlier barring the injuries to Milloy and Vincent. Nice to see a pretty strong defense getting stronger. Things are looking up over at OBD.

 

Also, in reference to wondering about McGee pulling double duty as a KR/CB. After he returns the kicks, I do believe the Offense takes the field and he should have at least a few minutes to get a rest. It's the same with Clements handling the punts. I'm not concerned about this being a problem. It's worked for some pretty good returners in the past, namely Woodson and Sanders.

[Mark VI]

This was the plan as far back as May mini-camp, when reported in the Buffalo News. Mularkey and TD both mentioned this. Vincent would move to Free Safety. No surprise at all.

 

Smart move. Prioleau isn't a front line Safety and Reese is just putrid. Last week, Reese had a shot at a sideline INT and just jogged to the spot . I saw a couple of our Coaches on the sidelines just snap. He didn't lay out and had a great shot at it. He sealed his fate.

 

McGee is still learning and will get beat at times. They (CB's) ALL do when first starting. Clements is doing better this season after having a poor 2003. Milloy and Vincent bring lots of experience and smarts too the Safety spots.

[Alaska Darin]

AD I just don't think the line is that bad. It wasn't bad when flutie was back there ( and you know I HATE Flutie).  I agree the rest of the way with your post though, but I just don't see them benching bledsoe. Hell yes he needed to be benched this offseason, but that is beside the point.

 

By St. Louis I'd like to see Losman play, won't happen but I'd like to see it. Hopefully by he cleveland game he can start and finish up the season.

101799[/snapback]

I think he'll see the field occassionally once we are mathmatically eliminated. Just enough to get his feet wet.

 

The comparison to Flutie has minor merit, as DF is obviously mobile. The difference to me is him being a veteran and proven winner. That gave him instant credibility with his teammates. I have no doubt our record would be flipped if he were here instead of Bledsoe and we would be viable post season contenders.

[Talonz]

has anyone been able to verify this? (no disrepect to the poster)

 

i'd love this. Izelle just does NOT make plays. He doesn't make major mistakes, but he NEVER makes a big play. This puts our 4 best DBs on the field, and I love it.

101805[/snapback]

 

 

Hmmm....Unless I am on an acid trip and I am hearing voices, I can ASSURE you that I am not making this up. Its been on WGR at every sports break....I listen at work.

[Bear]

Okay, someone explain to me how the decision to keep Bledsoe in the game over JP has ANYTHING to do with TD's ego?

 

Isn't TD the guy that moved up in the draft to get JP? Is that the kind of move a guy makes when he is trying to convince the world Bledsoe is the guy that is going to lead us to the Super Bowl?

 

So apparently MM is ready to put JP on the field, and TD is saying NO??????

 

Are you kidding me?

 

Hello?

[stevewin]

Wow - it is such a relief to see a discussion of safety personnel with Wire not even being considered in the picture anymore.

[Lori]

This is just another example of TD and his ego costing the Bills a lot of money.

 

How much money are we now paying our SAFETIES????

101768[/snapback]

TD's ego. You would rather have gone into the season with an unproven McGee as your opening-day starter, or given Winfield the insane amount of money Minnesota did? If you don't like either of those choices, then Donahoe needed to sign a CB.

 

And Vincent wasn't exactly terrible before he got hurt; this is more a commentary on McGee's progress, and on the mediocrity of Reese/Prioleau/Wire/Baker, than it is an indictment of TV's level of play at CB.

 

JMO.

 

And if Vincent starts making big plays from the FS position and we start pitching shutouts, I doubt his salary will be an issue....

[theesir]

TD's ego. You would rather have gone into the season with an unproven McGee as your opening-day starter, or given Winfield the insane amount of money Minnesota did? If you don't like either of those choices, then Donahoe needed to sign a CB.

 

And Vincent wasn't exactly terrible before he got hurt; this is more a commentary on McGee's progress, and on the mediocrity of Reese/Prioleau/Wire/Baker, than it is an indictment of TV's level of play at CB.

 

JMO.

 

And if Vincent starts making big plays from the FS position and we start pitching shutouts, I doubt his salary will be an issue....

101852[/snapback]

I wish we would have signed Winfield seeing the kind of numbers he's putting up in Minnesota. But Winfield is the one exception to the fact that all of the high priced FAs that TD has let go have basically flopped when they left. So he gets pass from me on this one.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

Call this a hunch but I think that the Bills plan all along was to have Vincent move to safety sooner or later. He probably would have been there sooner if he didn't have the injury.

Actually I think the exact opposite. I think Vincent wanted to stay at CB for this year at least, and WOULD have if he didn't get hurt. Kind of hard to move a starting CB to FS. However after the injury, Vincent probably realized it would be best for him in the short and long term to move to FS, especially with TM doing a decent job.

 

The Bills do have the luxury of having pretty decent CB's to step up and fill the CB, Nickel and Dime positions. Thomas will probably move to Nickel and Greer or Reese will take over at Dime.

Thomas and Greer are decent, but not as good as McGee at nickel and Thomas at dime. Hopefully the continue to develop and step-up their game.

 

Reese wasn't a bad Safety but Vincent gives the Bills a little more flexibility with their defensive coverages which might allow Milloy to cheat closer to the line and get man to man on the TE's which have been burning us this year. I like the move and am sure it would have been looked at earlier barring the injuries to Milloy and Vincent. Nice to see a pretty strong defense getting stronger. Things are looking up over at OBD.

Reese is average at best. Vincent at FS will basically give the Bills the best FS they've had in decades, and really upgrade the secondary overall, even with Thomas and Greer being the nickel and dime. And again, I think that Vincent can slide over to nickel DB, or at least dime DB, in those packages.

 

Also, in reference to wondering about McGee pulling double duty as a KR/CB. After he returns the kicks, I do believe the Offense takes the field and he should have at least a few minutes to get a rest. It's the same with Clements handling the punts. I'm not concerned about this being a problem. It's worked for some pretty good returners in the past, namely Woodson and Sanders.

I meant over the course of a game, and season. Not a huge concern, just trying to be cautiously pessismistic .

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I cannot believe this rumor. Vincent hasn't practiced for 4 weeks and then after a half week of practice, the coaches are going to start him at a position he has never played? Unlikely. It's especially unlikely considering the FS is in charge of calling all the defensive plays for the DB's.

 

Maybe Vincent will be moved to FS eventually, but not this week. I won't believe it until it comes straight from MM's mouth!

[ICE]

Okay, someone explain to me how the decision to keep Bledsoe in the game over JP has ANYTHING to do with TD's ego?

 

Isn't TD the guy that moved up in the draft to get JP?  Is that the kind of move a guy makes when he is trying to convince the world Bledsoe is the guy that is going to lead us to the Super Bowl?

 

So apparently MM is ready to put JP on the field, and TD is saying NO?????? 

 

Are you kidding me?

 

Hello?

101847[/snapback]

 

 

Because like I said TD can always sit on JP for 3 more years and claim "Development". TD has really tied his legacy to the Bledsoe move. Too much made of it, too much fanfare etc.

[Alaska Darin]

I cannot believe this rumor. Vincent hasn't practiced for 4 weeks and then after a half week of practice, the coaches are going to start him at a position he has never played? Unlikely. It's especially unlikely considering the FS is in charge of calling all the defensive plays for the DB's.

 

Maybe Vincent will be moved to FS eventually, but not this week. I won't believe it until it comes straight from MM's mouth!

101879[/snapback]

He is a veteran and a Probowler who has been the signal caller for DBs in the past. He knows everyone's responsibilities. Reality is, we really can't do much worse than Reese. He's a lazy and stupid football player who continues to make the same mistakes.

[bills_fan]

Smart move. Prioleau isn't a front line Safety and Reese is just putrid. Last week, Reese had a shot at a sideline INT and just jogged to the spot . I saw a couple of our Coaches on the sidelines just snap. He didn't lay out and had a great shot at it. He sealed his fate.

 

I didn't see that. Hmmmmm....TV could help TMcGee in coverage and we could lock down 1 receiver and Clements could take another. That would be a pretty sweet pass defense. I just hope Greer and/or Thomas come up big in the nickel and dime.

[Bear]

Because like I said TD can always sit on JP for 3 more years and claim "Development".  TD has really tied his legacy to the Bledsoe move.  Too much made of it, too much fanfare etc.

101884[/snapback]

 

Okay, but how does this help TD? If he sits on JP for 3 years for any reason, it makes him look worse. "Another failed draft pick".

 

IMO, there is no chance in hell TD is having an impact in any way over Mularkey's decision on JP.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

I cannot believe this rumor. Vincent hasn't practiced for 4 weeks and then after a half week of practice, the coaches are going to start him at a position he has never played? Unlikely. It's especially unlikely considering the FS is in charge of calling all the defensive plays for the DB's.

 

Maybe Vincent will be moved to FS eventually, but not this week. I won't believe it until it comes straight from MM's mouth!

101879[/snapback]

Besides rehabbing, what else do you think Vincent was doing with his time? I think that watching film and learning to call plays at FS is something he could conceivably have been working-on. And he's a professional and a Pro Bowler, and it's not like FS is rocket science, or that Vincent is dumb.

[Alaska Darin]

I didn't see that.  Hmmmmm....TV could help TMcGee in coverage and we could lock down 1 receiver and Clements could take another.  That would be a pretty sweet pass defense.  I just hope Greer and/or Thomas come up big in the nickel and dime.

101891[/snapback]

Implying Nate is actually interested in covering, unlike the 4th quarter of last week's game.

[ICE]

I cannot believe this rumor. Vincent hasn't practiced for 4 weeks and then after a half week of practice, the coaches are going to start him at a position he has never played? Unlikely. It's especially unlikely considering the FS is in charge of calling all the defensive plays for the DB's.

 

Maybe Vincent will be moved to FS eventually, but not this week. I won't believe it until it comes straight from MM's mouth!

101879[/snapback]

 

I believe it 100%. Like AD Said, the guy knows all of our calls at this point. TV doesn't have the deep speed he had the last couple of years. Slow? Hell no, but not quite quick enough like our younger players do.

 

Let me ask you this....how many times this season (the NE game alone) was a Safety out of position and it led to a score? Do you really think from a mental standpoint and knowing our D that Vincent and Milloy will make those mistakes? Not a chance in hell my brother! I guarentee teams are grimmacing at Vincent being at Safety. The Deep ball has all but been taken away from opposing teams for awhile!

[BF_in_Indiana]

You all realize that this is now going to be a 4 million a year safety right? We can couple that with the big money Lawyer is getting.

 

We now have WAY too much money tied up in that area.

 

Vincent was a mistake if we are moving him to safety already in my opinion. The goal was to get two good years out of him at CB then try moving him to safety if he was showing his age.

 

Here we are in week 9 of his first year here and he will be our new safety.

 

Not good.

[ICE]

Okay, but how does this help TD?  If he sits on JP for 3 years for any reason, it makes him look worse.  "Another failed draft pick".

 

IMO, there is no chance in hell TD is having an impact in any way over Mularkey's decision on JP.

101899[/snapback]

 

 

I respectfully disagree bear. But hey, we are all Bills fans right? Somehow some way this will get turned around. I sincerely believe it won't be until Bledsoe is benched.

[drnykterstein]

wow, i was thinking what this means to our team. if vincent is as good at safety as we all think he is, this adds a whole new dimension to our defense.

 

we already have an amazing run defense, now our pass defense will just be sick. i'm not sure if we'll need to blitz ever, just send the front four in and make the offense deal with it. they wont be able to run or pass. nothing will get by us.

 

that is... if he is as good at FS as we all think he will. not even having gilbride calling the plays could mess up this defense, we cant lose.

[MadBuffaloDisease]

One question for those who know. In the nickel/dime, does the FS continue as a FS would in a standard package, or does/can he play more as a DB?

[ICE]

You all realize that this is now going to be a 4 million a year safety right?  We can couple that with the big money Lawyer is getting.

 

We now have WAY too much money tied up in that area.

 

Vincent was a mistake if we are moving him to safety already in my opinion.  The goal was to get two good years out of him at CB then try moving him to safety if he was showing his age.

 

Here we are in week 9 of his first year here and he will be our new safety.

 

Not good.

101905[/snapback]

 

 

BF...TV isn't making 4 mill per. It's more like 2. something I think. It really ended up being a cap friendly designed contract with the intent on him moving to safety.

 

Like I say above....how much is it worth to take away the deep ball? how much is it worth NOT to give up stupid TD's because our inept safetys are out of position.

 

Well worth the investment brother!

[ICE]

One question for those who know.  In the nickel/dime, does the FS continue as a FS would in a standard package, or does/can he play more as a DB?

101910[/snapback]

 

He tends to be more of a DB in the dime. We have specific CB's to run the nickel. in the Nickel he would still be in a free safety mode.

[theesir]

BF...TV isn't making 4 mill per. It's more like 2. something I think. It really ended up being a cap friendly designed contract with the intent on him moving to safety.

 

Like I say above....how much is it worth to take away the deep ball?  how much is it worth NOT to give up stupid TD's because our inept safetys are out of position.

 

Well worth the investment brother! 

101912[/snapback]

I was just about to post this, he signed for a little over 2 mil a year WITH his signing bonus. I think thats a bargain for a veteran safety who can tudor some of the young CBs on this team.

[BF_in_Indiana]

BF...TV isn't making 4 mill per. It's more like 2. something I think. It really ended up being a cap friendly designed contract with the intent on him moving to safety.

 

Like I say above....how much is it worth to take away the deep ball?  how much is it worth NOT to give up stupid TD's because our inept safetys are out of position.

 

Well worth the investment brother! 

101912[/snapback]

 

I was thinking his contract was something like 6 years 23 million. Maybe I'm off here?

 

I have no doubt he can make plays at safety, that much is fine, but it's clearly an error in judgement by TD in signing him if we are already moving him to saftey.

 

I pmed you ICE.

[ICE]

wow, i was thinking what this means to our team. if vincent is as good at safety as we all think he is, this adds a whole new dimension to our defense.

 

we already have an amazing run defense, now our pass defense will just be sick. i'm not sure if we'll need to blitz ever, just send the front four in and make the offense deal with it. they wont be able to run or pass. nothing will get by us.

 

that is... if he is as good at FS as we all think he will. not even having gilbride calling the plays could mess up this defense, we cant lose.

101909[/snapback]

 

 

EEEEEEExactly! yeah try to throw deep bastards! Anyone realise that with the DL having confidence the deep ball won't connect as well, they can bring the house.

[theesir]

I was thinking his contract was something like 6 years 23 million.  Maybe I'm off here?

 

I have no doubt he can make plays at safety, that much is fine, but it's clearly an error in judgement by TD in signing him if we are already moving him to saftey.

 

I pmed you ICE.

101919[/snapback]

Do you think he was actually signed with the expectation that he would play as a CB until he was 36 or 37? He was signed to move to Safety.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I believe it 100%.  Like AD Said, the guy knows all of our calls at this point. TV doesn't have the deep speed he had the last couple of years. Slow? Hell no, but not quite quick enough like our younger players do. 

 

Let me ask you this....how many times this season (the NE game alone) was a Safety out of position and it led to a score?  Do you really think from a mental standpoint and knowing our D that Vincent and Milloy will make those mistakes?  Not a chance in hell my brother!  I guarentee teams are grimmacing at Vincent being at Safety. The Deep ball has all but been taken away from opposing teams for awhile! 

101902[/snapback]

 

I agree that the safety position is a problem for us. But is the transition from CB to FS so seemless that it can be done with less than one week of practice? I have no idea--but I'd imagine even the smartest, most-skilled CB needs more time than that.

[ICE]

Do you think he was actually signed with the expectation that he would play as a CB until he was 36 or 37? He was signed to move to Safety.

101921[/snapback]

 

I think it was for this year only as mcgee and the others improved. I think the injury made him and the coaches realise how badly we need him at safety.

 

the thing is he will make the probowl with Milloy next year and he knows it

[Dan Gross]

Besides rehabbing, what else do you think Vincent was doing with his time?  I think that watching film and learning to call plays at FS is something he could conceivably have been working-on.  And he's a professional and a Pro Bowler, and it's not like FS is rocket science, or that Vincent is dumb.

101900[/snapback]

I heard he was trolling the Wall.

[Bear]

I agree that the safety position is a problem for us. But is the transition from CB to FS so seemless that it can be done with less than one week of practice? I have no idea--but I'd imagine even the smartest, most-skilled CB needs more time than that.

101927[/snapback]

 

It may take a bit of time, and a few mistakes, but I don't think it's as hard as you think.

As a CB, he has to know what the FS is doing (what the play is designed for him to do) on every play.

I have no doubt that TV knows the plays. He may make some some bad judgment calls while he is getting used to the position, but he won't be as bad as Coy Wire is at Safety. Once he gets used to the position, he will be very good.

 

Expect too see the INT numbers get a nice bump from this move.

[ICE]

I agree that the safety position is a problem for us. But is the transition from CB to FS so seemless that it can be done with less than one week of practice? I have no idea--but I'd imagine even the smartest, most-skilled CB needs more time than that.

101927[/snapback]

 

I agree with others he has been watching film so that helps. I would have to guess it is easier. No real man to man stuff, just do your assignment and protect your area.

 

BTW....I wanna see a TV "We must protect this house" Commercial!

[ICE]

It may take a bit of time, and a few mistakes, but I don't think it's as hard as you think.

As a CB, he has to know what the FS is doing (what the play is designed for him to do) on every play.

I have no doubt that TV knows the plays.  He may make some some bad judgment calls while he is getting used to the position, but he won't be as bad as Coy Wire is at Safety.  Once he gets used to the position, he will be very good. 

 

Expect too see the INT numbers get a nice bump from this move.

101950[/snapback]

 

 

Hey Bear, can you see our OL and LB's licking their chops knowing "Over the top" is now much safer? Swwwwwwwwwweeeeeeeeeeet!

[Bear]

Hey Bear, can you see our OL and LB's licking their chops knowing "Over the top" is now much safer?  Swwwwwwwwwweeeeeeeeeeet! 

101957[/snapback]

 

I don't know about the OL, but the DL will have some fun.

 

I know one thing, the biggest problem with our 2nd ranked defense was giving up too many 3rd down conversions. We may have just solved that.

 

Look out Washington, your #1 spot is in trouble.

[ICE]

I don't know about the OL, but the DL will have some fun. 

 

I know one thing, the biggest problem with our 2nd ranked defense was giving up too many 3rd down conversions.  We may have just solved that.

 

Look out Washington, your #1 spot is in trouble.

101963[/snapback]

 

 

Damn it, Damn it, Damn it! I hate when I type too fast!

[34-78-83]

This is just another example of TD and his ego costing the Bills a lot of money.

 

How much money are we now paying our SAFETIES????

101768[/snapback]

 

You continue to astound with your posting wisdom

[MadBuffaloDisease]

I agree that the safety position is a problem for us. But is the transition from CB to FS so seemless that it can be done with less than one week of practice? I have no idea--but I'd imagine even the smartest, most-skilled CB needs more time than that.

101927[/snapback]

A FS is the "QB" of the secondary, and a "centerfielder." Vincent has the skills to be a "centerfielder" and he's smart, savvy, a veteran, and probably knows the play-calls down cold. I don't think he'll have much of a problem, if at all.

[nodnarb]

Here's the Deal on Vincent's contract:

 

http://www.nflpa.org/Members/playerProfile.asp?ID=19321

 

an average of 2.8 million thru 2009. I doubt he'll play thru the contract, but it locks up a very good football player and KNOWLEDGE AND CHARACTER SOURCE on this team for the price of an average NFL CB.

 

In other words, it's a good contract for the Bills.

[Dan Gross]

You continue to astound with your posting wisdom

101968[/snapback]

Leave him alone, he's probably drunk.

[EndZoneCrew]

I pmed you ICE.

101919[/snapback]

ICE....he's not asking you to meet him at a reststop is he????

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

....j/k BF...I just can't hold back on here