Dan III Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 I think we can all agree that our O-line and D-line have struggled this year. Regardless if you're pro-Donahoe(TD is god!) or anti-Donahoe(He should be stabbed, shot, strangled and electrocuted), TD is the President & GM, so he is responsible. Below, I've listed TD's 5 drafts as President and GM of the Bills. Instead of telling me how much TD sucks, please tell me specifically who you would have drafted.. 2001 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 1 21 Nate Clements CB Ohio State 2 46 Aaron Schobel DE Texas Christian 2 58 Travis Henry RB Tennessee 3 76 Ron Edwards DT Texas A&M 3 95 Jonas Jennings T Georgia 4 110 Brandon Spoon MLB North Carolina 5 144 Marques Sullivan T Illinois 6 178 Tony Driver FS Notre Dame 6 195 Dan O'Leary TE Notre Dame 6 196 Jimmy Williams CB Vanderbilt 7 214 Reggie Germany WR Ohio State 7 238 Tyrone Robertson DT Hinds CC 2002 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 1 4 Mike Williams T Texas 2 36 Josh Reed WR Louisiana State 2 61 Ryan Denney DE Brigham Young 3 97 Coy Wire SS Stanford 5 139 Justin Bannan DT Colorado 6 176 Kevin Thomas CB Nevada-Las Vegas 7 215 Mike Pucillo G Auburn 7 249 Rodney Wright WR Fresno State 7 251 Jarrett Ferguson RB Virginia Tech 7 260 Dominique Stevenson OLB Tennessee 2003 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 1 23 Willis McGahee RB Miami 2 48 Chris Kelsay DE Nebraska 3 94 Angelo Crowell OLB Virginia 4 111 Terrence McGee CB Northwestern State, La. 4 127 Sam Aiken WR North Carolina 5 151 Ben Sobieski G Iowa 6 187 Lauvale Sape DT Utah 7 228 Mario Haggan MLB Mississippi State 2004 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 1 13 Lee Evans WR Wisconsin 1 22 J.P. Losman QB Tulane 3 74 Tim Anderson DT Ohio State 4 109 Tim Euhus TE Oregon State 7 207 Dylan McFarland T Montana 7 214 Jonathan Smith WR Georgia Tech 2005 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 2 55 Roscoe ParrishWR Miami 3 86 Kevin Everitt TE Miami 4 122 Duke Preston C Illinois 5 156 Eric King CB Wake Forest 6 197 Justin Geisinger OL Vanderbilt 7 236 Lionel Gates RB Louisville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 if the young guys who are showing promise right now pan out, and mike williams stays a bill and can get healthy and play consistantly, those are solid drafts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Dragon Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 if the young guys who are showing promise right now pan out, and mike williams stays a bill and can get healthy and play consistantly, those are solid drafts 495142[/snapback] Those are plenty of "ifs" for Mike Williams. I believe that the expression that best describes these drafts is "failed expectations". No players from Rounds 4-7 from 2001 are still on the team. Ryan Denney, Ron Edwards, Coy Wire and Tim Anderson has failed to achieve. There are only nine starters from all of these drafts, and one (Crowell) is due to an injury. There is nothing solid about these drafts-it is a record of failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 So far this is my sublist of what you posted that is either a quality starter, or a good reserve- pretty high ercentage IMHO 1 21 Nate Clements CB Ohio State 2 46 Aaron Schobel DE Texas Christian 2 58 Travis Henry RB Tennessee 3 76 Ron Edwards DT Texas A&M 3 95 Jonas Jennings T Georgia 4 110 Brandon Spoon MLB North Carolina 6 195 Dan O'Leary TE Notre Dame 2002 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 1 4 Mike Williams T Texas 2 36 Josh Reed WR Louisiana State 2 61 Ryan Denney DE Brigham Young 3 97 Coy Wire SS Stanford 5 139 Justin Bannan DT Colorado 6 176 Kevin Thomas CB Nevada-Las Vegas 2003 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 1 23 Willis McGahee RB Miami 2 48 Chris Kelsay DE Nebraska 3 94 Angelo Crowell OLB Virginia 4 111 Terrence McGee CB Northwestern State, La. 4 127 Sam Aiken WR North Carolina 6 187 Lauvale Sape DT Utah 7 228 Mario Haggan MLB Mississippi State 2004 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 1 13 Lee Evans WR Wisconsin 1 22 J.P. Losman QB Tulane 3 74 Tim Anderson DT Ohio State 4 109 Tim Euhus TE Oregon State 7 214 Jonathan Smith WR Georgia Tech 2005 Rd Sel# Player Pos. School 2 55 Roscoe ParrishWR Miami 3 86 Kevin Everitt TE Miami 4 122 Duke Preston C Illinois 5 156 Eric King CB Wake Forest 7 236 Lionel Gates RB Louisville Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 How about *eight* 1st and 2nd round picks on QB-RB-WR in those ten years. A huge reason why we aren't a playoff team yet is that we invested heavily into a Bledsoe-Henry-Moulds-Reed football team, and then ripped it all out in favor of a Losman--McGahee-Moulds-Evans-Parrish team that has not yet fully developed. The fact that there is only *one* player on this team from 2000 (the last time the Bills won in Foxboro) speaks volumes about the upheavel Donahoe has put this team through..... Everyone wants to call this Year 5 of Donahoe, but really its just Year 2 of Mularkey - and we look an awful lot like a second-year-of-a-rebuilding-project football team. At this point Donahoe has taken the mulligan for Plan A, so I figure we'll have to wait around through at least next year to say if Plan B pans out. If Plan B flops for the rest of this year and next, I can't imagine that even Ralph Wilson will stick around for Plan C. JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Here's how I would revist Donahoe's worst draft, the 2002 affair: 1. DE Dwight Freeney - Syracuse 2a. C LeCharles Bentley - Ohio St. 2b. WR/KR/QB Antwaan Randle-El Indiana 5. DT Justin Bannan - Colorado Is that too much to ask? JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Here's how I would revist Donahoe's worst draft, the 2002 affair: 1. DE Dwight Freeney - Syracuse 2a. C LeCharles Bentley - Ohio St. 2b. WR/KR/QB Antwaan Randle-El Indiana 5. DT Justin Bannan - Colorado Is that too much to ask? JDG 495220[/snapback] Hindsight is always 20/20... the colts got reamed for taking freeny that early and they took him at 13, can you imagine the fallout had we taken him at #4? But i imagine that in 2002, you were saying freeny is going to be a sack monster, undersized be damned, and that the bills should have drafted him at #4. Oh you werent? thats what i thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark VI Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Here's how I would revist Donahoe's worst draft, the 2002 affair: 1. DE Dwight Freeney - Syracuse 2a. C LeCharles Bentley - Ohio St. 2b. WR/KR/QB Antwaan Randle-El Indiana 495220[/snapback] Great minds think alike. That's the draft I always thought TD struck out on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Hindsight is always 20/20... the colts got reamed for taking freeny that early and they took him at 13, can you imagine the fallout had we taken him at #4? 495255[/snapback] Yup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Great minds think alike. That's the draft I always thought TD struck out on. 495257[/snapback] Assuming TD is here next year, he may have a chance to redeem himself. I believe Dwight Freeny is a FA next year. I would let Nate Clements go, if it meant being able to get Freeny. He looks to be the best DL in the leauge right now. I know it is very doubtful the Colts let it get to that point, but I can dream, can't I? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 How about *eight* 1st and 2nd round picks on QB-RB-WR in those ten years. A huge reason why we aren't a playoff team yet is that we invested heavily into a Bledsoe-Henry-Moulds-Reed football team, and then ripped it all out in favor of a Losman--McGahee-Moulds-Evans-Parrish team that has not yet fully developed. The fact that there is only *one* player on this team from 2000 (the last time the Bills won in Foxboro) speaks volumes about the upheavel Donahoe has put this team through..... Everyone wants to call this Year 5 of Donahoe, but really its just Year 2 of Mularkey - and we look an awful lot like a second-year-of-a-rebuilding-project football team. At this point Donahoe has taken the mulligan for Plan A, so I figure we'll have to wait around through at least next year to say if Plan B pans out. If Plan B flops for the rest of this year and next, I can't imagine that even Ralph Wilson will stick around for Plan C. JDG 495211[/snapback] excellent post. i've got nothing to add. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Teams get reamed for "reaches" in part because of media-driven expectations. But who sets those projections? The teams do - with their leaks to the media. Freeney was a freak of nature, and Donahoe could have taken him. After all, Donahoe went for an undersized, slow, WR in the second round instead of Antwaan Randle-El..... JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Lamb Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Teams get reamed for "reaches" in part because of media-driven expectations. But who sets those projections? The teams do - with their leaks to the media. Freeney was a freak of nature, and Donahoe could have taken him. After all, Donahoe went for an undersized, slow, WR in the second round instead of Antwaan Randle-El..... JDG 495270[/snapback] The NFL Draft has become a giant, media event where the over-anaylization has hidden the real process - teams have their criterias (unless you are the Vikings) There are probably as many "busts" as "hidden gems" Perception is everything - reality sucks (sometimes) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 After all, Donahoe went for an undersized, slow, WR in the second round instead of Antwaan Randle-El..... JDG 495270[/snapback] I'm far from a TD fan, but Reed's college credentials were tops...I'll never criticize him for that pick. Plenty of post-draft pundits said it was a nifty selection, also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Teams get reamed for "reaches" in part because of media-driven expectations. But who sets those projections? The teams do - with their leaks to the media. Freeney was a freak of nature, and Donahoe could have taken him. After all, Donahoe went for an undersized, slow, WR in the second round instead of Antwaan Randle-El..... JDG 495270[/snapback] Who knows how Reed would have turned out if his mentor was Hines Ward instead of Eric Moulds and we had a QB who could throw underneath routes with timing and accuracy. Think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Who knows how Reed would have turned out if his mentor was Hines Ward instead of Eric Moulds and we had a QB who could throw underneath routes with timing and accuracy. Think about it. 495328[/snapback] Call me crazy, but I still think Josh Reed can, and will, be a servicable reciever somehere in this leauge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 2005 1 32 32 Logan Mankins G Fresno State 2 3 20 84 Ellis Hobbs DB Iowa State 3 3 36 100 Nick Kaczur G Toledo 4 4 32 133 James Sanders DB Fresno State 5 5 34 170 Ryan Claridge LB Nevada-Las Vegas 6 7 16 230 Matt Cassel QB USC 7 7 41 255 Andy Stokes TE William Penn 2004 1 1 21 21 Vince Wilfork DT Miami (FL) 2 1 32 32 Ben Watson TE Georgia 3 2 31 63 Marquise Hill DE Louisiana State 4 3 32 95 Guss Scott DB Florida 5 4 17 113 Dexter Reid DB North Carolina 6 4 32 128 Cedric Cobbs RB Arkansas 7 5 32 164 P.K. Sam WR Florida State 8 7 32 233 Christian Morton DB Illinois 2003 1 1 13 13 Ty Warren DT Texas A&M 2 2 4 36 Eugene Wilson DB Illinois 3 2 13 45 Bethel Johnson WR Texas A&M 4 4 20 117 Dan Klecko DT Temple 5 4 23 120 Asante Samuel DB Central Florida 6 5 29 164 Dan Koppen C Boston College 7 6 28 201 Kliff Kingsbury QB Texas Tech 8 7 20 234 Spencer Nead TE Brigham Young 9 7 25 239 Tully Banta-Cain DE California 10 7 29 243 Ethan Kelley DT Baylor 2002 1 1 21 21 Dan Graham TE Colorado 2 2 33 65 Deion Branch WR Louisville 3 4 19 117 Rohan Davey QB Louisiana State 4 4 28 126 Jarvis Green DE Louisiana State 5 7 26 237 Antwoine Womack RB Virginia 6 7 33 244 David Givens WR Notre Dame 2001 1 1 6 6 Richard Seymour DT Georgia 2 2 17 48 Matt Light T Purdue 3 3 24 86 Brock Williams DB Notre Dame 4 4 1 96 Kenyatta Jones T South Florida 5 4 24 119 Jabari Holloway TE Notre Dame 6 5 32 163 Hakim Akbar DB Washington 7 6 17 180 Arther Love TE South Carolina State 8 6 37 200 Leonard Myers DB Miami (FL) 9 7 16 216 Owen Pochman K Brigham Young 10 7 39 239 T.J. Turner LB Michigan State Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortured Soul Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 I think we can all agree that our O-line and D-line have struggled this year. Regardless if you're pro-Donahoe(TD is god!) or anti-Donahoe(He should be stabbed, shot, strangled and electrocuted), TD is the President & GM, so he is responsible. 495112[/snapback] Yeah, hindsight makes this exercise useless. You have to judge TD on results, not whether we expected them to perform at the time. (For Baseball fans, think of the moves Steve Phillips made for the Mets.) One correction, the other half, myself included, think Donahoe is the son of satan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 I've liked the occasional flashes we've seen from Josh Reed this year.... but the simple truth of the matter is that there aren't a lot of roster spots in this League for WR's who aren't big and who aren't fast. Maybe if he became a big-time 3rd-down, move-the-chains type guy, but there's no evidence for that at this point. And now that we have drafted Parrish he better be sure that he keeps working on those Special Teams if he wants to stay employed..... but basically, you're hoping that he becomes another Bobby Engram.... JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Vader Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Those are plenty of "ifs" for Mike Williams. I believe that the expression that best describes these drafts is "failed expectations". No players from Rounds 4-7 from 2001 are still on the team. Ryan Denney, Ron Edwards, Coy Wire and Tim Anderson has failed to achieve. There are only nine starters from all of these drafts, and one (Crowell) is due to an injury. There is nothing solid about these drafts-it is a record of failure. 495190[/snapback] I think it is unfair to call Tim Anderson a bust. This is only his second year, and he has only begun to start. I agree Edwards & Wire have been disappointments, and Ryan Denney will never be a starter, but he is a good back-up player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts