GunnerBill Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 7:15 PM, Mr. WEO said: If the Bills are top 10 Offense, he stays. No one is going to make this guy a HC for that. Expand I disagree. He got HC interviews last year. People around the league who didn't like Josh Allen coming out (and there were plenty of them) are giving Daboll a lot of the credit. If we are a top 10 offense the only thing that stops him getting a job is if we make the superbowl. On 8/15/2020 at 7:30 PM, ScottLaw said: Really? Nobody? They were below average offensively. Again, raise your standards eball.? Expand Nobody might be exaggeration. Very few however is accurate. The league view is Daboll has done a good job with Allen.
Mr. WEO Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 7:26 PM, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: Mike Pettine says hi Expand LOL the Browns didn't even want Daboll---and they hired Chudzinski, Mangini, Pettine, Jackson...and Freddie Kitchens!! On 8/15/2020 at 7:31 PM, GunnerBill said: I disagree. He got HC interviews last year. People around the league who didn't like Josh Allen coming out (and there were plenty of them) are giving Daboll a lot of the credit. If we are a top 10 offense the only thing that stops him getting a job is if we make the superbowl. Nobody might be exaggeration. Very few however is accurate. The league view is Daboll has done a good job with Allen. Expand See above. The most desperate team years running turned him down.
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 7:33 PM, Mr. WEO said: LOL the Browns didn't even want Daboll---and they hired Chudzinski, Mangini, Pettine, Jackson...and Freddie Kitchens!! Expand My only point is that it is not uncommon for guys, who are well respected in the league, but dont have stellar resumes, to get hired as head coaches. Mike Pettine, Anthony Lynn, etc. Daboll, as much as may not seem like it, is very well respected in the league.
GunnerBill Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 7:33 PM, Mr. WEO said: LOL the Browns didn't even want Daboll---and they hired Chudzinski, Mangini, Pettine, Jackson...and Freddie Kitchens!! See above. The most desperate team years running turned him down. Expand Think what you like. I guarantee we are a top 10 O he is gone.
Mr. WEO Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 7:35 PM, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: My only point is that it is not uncommon for guys, who are well respected in the league, but dont have stellar resumes, to get hired as head coaches. Mike Pettine, Anthony Lynn, etc. Daboll, as much as may not seem like it, is very well respected in the league. Expand Why did he keep getting fired as OC? On 8/15/2020 at 7:36 PM, GunnerBill said: Think what you like. I guarantee we are a top 10 O he is gone. Expand OK
GunnerBill Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 7:41 PM, ScottLaw said: Do you understand Miami firing of their OC? Expand No. I thought he did a really good job with a bad oline, bad QBs and awful running backs.
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 7:38 PM, Mr. WEO said: Why did he keep getting fired as OC? OK Expand Im pretty sure every OC gig he lost was part of a house cleaning. The team fired every coach and brought in a new staff. Its not often that coordinators are kept in those situations. It doesnt really prove your point. On 8/15/2020 at 7:31 PM, GunnerBill said: I disagree. He got HC interviews last year. People around the league who didn't like Josh Allen coming out (and there were plenty of them) are giving Daboll a lot of the credit. If we are a top 10 offense the only thing that stops him getting a job is if we make the superbowl. Nobody might be exaggeration. Very few however is accurate. The league view is Daboll has done a good job with Allen. Expand JA improves and the offense is top 10, Dabol is a head coach next year. Anyone who thinks otherwise just isn’t paying attention. 1
GunnerBill Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:06 PM, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: Im pretty sure every OC gig he lost was part of a house cleaning. The team fired every coach and brought in a new staff. Its not often that coordinators are kept in those situations. It doesnt really prove your point. Expand I also posted the offenses he presided over earlier in the offseason. The 2020 Bills will be the first time he has had an offense with enough talent to be top half of the league. The 2019 Bills were the most talented offense he had ever coached. Let that sink in.
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:10 PM, GunnerBill said: I also posted the offenses he presided over earlier in the offseason. The 2020 Bills will be the first time he has had an offense with enough talent to be top half of the league. The 2019 Bills were the most talented offense he had ever coached. Let that sink in. Expand Its a weird habit we, as fans, have of failing to see context. Should we just completely ignore the players Dabol is coaching when evaluating his work? That seems crazy to me. 1
MDH Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/14/2020 at 10:10 PM, Warcodered said: I'd say it's probably his last year here. Either he does good in which case the Bills do very well and he gets picked up as HC for another team, or he doesn't get it together and the Bills look to move on. Expand So he’s either HC material or he’s fired? Binary much?
Mr. WEO Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:06 PM, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: Im pretty sure every OC gig he lost was part of a house cleaning. The team fired every coach and brought in a new staff. Its not often that coordinators are kept in those situations. It doesnt really prove your point. Expand Mangini thought it was a great idea to bring him on in Cleveland. For both years their Offense was simply awful. That helped Mangini get fired. In his 4th year as Miami HC, Sporano hired Daboll after 2 7-9 seasons. The immediately lost 7 games, which got Sporano fired midseason. In KC, after Crennel replaced Haley as HC the previous season (7-9), he brought in Daboll. The team went 2-14 and the Offense was dead last in points. In 4 straight seasons, he was OC for 3 different teams that finished 29,31,20 and 32 in scoring. It would be 6 more years before this coach killer would be offered another OC job.
GunnerBill Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:28 PM, MDH said: So he’s either HC material or he’s fired? Binary much? Expand The margin in between is narrow.
Mr. WEO Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:10 PM, GunnerBill said: I also posted the offenses he presided over earlier in the offseason. The 2020 Bills will be the first time he has had an offense with enough talent to be top half of the league. The 2019 Bills were the most talented offense he had ever coached. Let that sink in. Expand OC's with good players do better than with bad players. OK. Was the Bills 2016 roster (top 10 in scoring) that much better than 2019? One RB over 600 yards. Watkins was out half the season, Woods had 13 games. Charles Clay had the most targets. No receiver over 650 yards. Tyrod Taylor at QB. Yet Lynn made more of what he had. On 8/15/2020 at 8:28 PM, MDH said: So he’s either HC material or he’s fired? Binary much? Expand All of the Browns HC's say hello...
GunnerBill Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:43 PM, Mr. WEO said: OC's with good players do better than with bad players. OK. Was the Bills 2016 roster (top 10 in scoring) that much better than 2019? One RB over 600 yards. Watkins was out half the season, Woods had 13 games. Charles Clay had the most targets. No receiver over 650 yards. Tyrod Taylor at QB. Yet Lynn made more of what he had. Expand Yes. Talent wise it was.
MDH Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 This talk about Daboll being subpar directly relates to Allen. You can’t have a consistent offense without consistent QB play and Allen did not deliver that last year. He improved greatly, GREATLY, and I’m optimistic that, given how raw he was coming out of college, he’ll make another jump this year. I expect Allen to be a top 10-15 passer this year given how Daboll handled him. Im not saying Daboll was perfect or even great, and a lot of criticism above is accurate. The persistence of putting Gore on the field during important sequences was maddening. But given the talent level on offense two years ago and a QB who is the model of inconsistency I thought Daboll did a pretty f’n good job last year. His use of McKenzie on fake jet sweeps was a fantastic way of holding one edge to protect a slow, jukey, Singeltary from getting his cutback lane filled by a LB which helped Singeltary thrive. I love Singletary but I think some of his success was schemed and that goes directly to Daboll knowing how to use his players. I also love how Daboll didn’t coddle Allen by making everything easy for him with half field reads or other gimmicky trends that hide a QBs inexperience. They bit the bullet the past two years and made Allen learn to read the D and properly go through his progressions. And he struggled plenty because of it, but that’s how you get better. They taught the kid how to play QB and while it didn’t pay dividends last year I think it will moving forward. 4
Mr. WEO Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:44 PM, GunnerBill said: Yes. Talent wise it was. Expand For the Offense that was on the field, not the trainer's room, I'm not sure about that. It's hair splitting. From 2012 until the Bills hired him, it's not clear that the rest of the league looked at his body of work and concluded he was just unlucky with the rosters he had.
Buffalo_Stampede Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 (edited) 90% of the fans want a new offensive coordinator. When you study the Bills offense play calling and design are far down the list of problems. The biggest flaw I saw was personnel usage, which should improve with added depth and experience on offense. Edited August 15, 2020 by Buffalo_Stampede 1
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 8:32 PM, Mr. WEO said: Mangini thought it was a great idea to bring him on in Cleveland. For both years their Offense was simply awful. That helped Mangini get fired. In his 4th year as Miami HC, Sporano hired Daboll after 2 7-9 seasons. The immediately lost 7 games, which got Sporano fired midseason. In KC, after Crennel replaced Haley as HC the previous season (7-9), he brought in Daboll. The team went 2-14 and the Offense was dead last in points. In 4 straight seasons, he was OC for 3 different teams that finished 29,31,20 and 32 in scoring. It would be 6 more years before this coach killer would be offered another OC job. Expand A ton of words to say, “yes, you are correct.”
Mr. WEO Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 9:08 PM, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: A ton of words to say, “yes, you are correct.” Expand So much for reading and context...
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 15, 2020 Posted August 15, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 9:10 PM, Mr. WEO said: So much for reading and context... Expand Oh were you going to provide some?
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