H2o Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Deion was a horrible tackler. I've seen Sherman wiff a bunch of times. The only great CB tackler I can think of is Revis. Trumaine Johnson, Marcus Peters, Patrick Peterson, Trufant, there are some good tacklers at the position. I think Gilmore's problem was he had not gotten the long term security he was looking for. I expect him to be a more willing tackler after signing his deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Deion was a horrible tackler. I've seen Sherman wiff a bunch of times. The only great CB tackler I can think of is Revis. Deion was also the best cover corner of all time who had several pick 6's in his career. Trying to justify Gilmore's poor tackling and lack of effort on tackles by bringing up Deion Sanders is ludicrous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I think Revis island set up unreasonable expectations for Gilmore here in Buffalo. We looked at him like our very own island and expected him to carry the team, and got outraged when he couldn't. I've had more than my fair share to say about Gilmore myself, but he's not nearly as bad as some people make him out to be. If we don't miss him next year it'll be due to a solid draft. Gilmore is a very. very good CB1. Is he Revis great? No. But if Gilmore so much as allows a catch, he sucks, to some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 He is a CB1 by every possible metric. Gilmore is just a scapegoat He literally let's up less than 4-5 TDs a year but he's a bum Is he the best? No But we are gonna miss him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bocephuz Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) http://walterfootball.com/freeagents2017OT.php Walter football seems to be the most spot on analysis site to my eyes. Looking at their list .. and considering Wagner is gone.. I would say Beachum would be my next best RT target based on his age and profile. I think I'd be ok paying him $6 mil. I think Reiff is overrated.. I wouldn't pay him more than $4 mil/year. Okung hasn't really played RT. Edited March 8, 2017 by Bocephuz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Deion was also the best cover corner of all time who had several pick 6's in his career. Trying to justify Gilmore's poor tackling and lack of effort on tackles by bringing up Deion Sanders is ludicrous. I'm simply pointing out that one of the best CBs of all time, wasn't a great tackler. To be a good or great CB, seeing as one of the best wasn't, doesn't require the CB to be an amazing tackler. That's not what he's paid for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Gilmore has made plenty of big hits and tackles in his career. I think you are stuck on the negatives a little too much. Hogan ain't slow but looking back at a teammate was a bad look. But I think it did come out that the S screwed up on that play right? I doubt it. No Gilmore has made plenty of big hits and tackles in his career. I think you are stuck on the negatives a little too much. Hogan ain't slow but looking back at a teammate was a bad look. But I think it did come out that the S screwed up on that play right? I doubt it. Nope, sorry. Those plays were pure lack of effort. You don't win championships by paying guys like Gilmore $14 million or more per year. I wouldn't give him 10. This will be the worst contract given out this off-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PABillsFan4Life Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Dude, I am sorry but Gilmore costs this team games with his unwillingness to tackle. Flat out, the guy is a kitty. He has the size and ability, but he isn't willing to stick his head in there and make a form tackle. When you have a 3rd and 7 on the opening drive of the home opener against the Jets, they run a bubble screen, Gilmore is right there for the tackle, doesn't put in the effort and the guy gets and easy first down, that is unacceptable. That play was right in front of me about 30 rows up. All he had to do is put in a little effort and slow the WR down and the linebackers would have got there. He was too much of a kitty to make the attempt. When it's you and the running back and he catches the ball with no momentum, you are right there to make a tackle and you throw a shoulder, that is unacceptable. The running back runs for 40 because you decided to puss out. When you get burned deep by a slow receiver and turn around before the receiver is in the end zone looking for a teammate to blame, that is unacceptable. Good riddance to Gilmore, we will be better with someone who is isn't as talented but is willing to play a complete game and not blame his teammates when he !@#$s up. Mark my words, whoever signs him will be talking about cutting him in 2-3 years, the next Jarius Byrd. I agree that this year, especially, he was a bad tackler and looked to avoid contact. Not making an excuse, but I did notice this much more this year as opposed to years past. I think the contract year had a huge part to play in that. It is what it is, I think after he gets paid what he feels he is worth he will put in the work and play with a chip on his shoulder. No evidence to base this off of just a feeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 He's not. What CB in the draft will outplay GIlmore this season? Please tell me. Trouble is it's not just for this season. There is likely a player in this DB rich draft that is better than Gilmore , and yes may even outplay him this season. You can either overpay for Gilmore or get a quality replacement for far less money in the draft or even a suitable guy in FA . It's just the league market is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) I'm simply pointing out that one of the best CBs of all time, wasn't a great tackler. To be a good or great CB, seeing as one of the best wasn't, doesn't require the CB to be an amazing tackler. That's not what he's paid for. He isn't paid to try and tackle a RB on a screen when it is him and the RB alone and no other defender is near the play? You are flat out wrong if you think the coaches don't expect their corners to make tackles or at least attempt to make a real tackle and slow the ball carrier down. Edited March 8, 2017 by K-GunJimKelly12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 This is ridiculous. I'm trying to read a thread about RTs. And I have 57 posts about Gillmore to ignore. Can you PLEASE stick the Gillmore posts in their own thread and argue all you want about it there? Leave this thread alone for RTs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 He isn't paid to try and tackle a RB on a screen when it is him and the RB alone and no other defender is near the play? You are flat out wrong if you think the coaches don't expect their corners to make tackles or at least attempt to make a real tackle and slow the ball carrier down. Are you suggesting Gilmore hasn't made tackles on RBs? Or slow the RB down? This is ridiculous. Linebackers are paid to tackle. Cornerbacks are paid to cover. Why aren't the best tackling CBs paid the most money? Why is Deion considered one of the best CBs in history considering he wouldn't even attempt to tackle. Surely that would knock him out of on of the greatest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 No Nope, sorry. Those plays were pure lack of effort. You don't win championships by paying guys like Gilmore $14 million or more per year. I wouldn't give him 10. This will be the worst contract given out this off-season. We'll see. I doubt it. Trouble is it's not just for this season. There is likely a player in this DB rich draft that is better than Gilmore , and yes may even outplay him this season. You can either overpay for Gilmore or get a quality replacement for far less money in the draft or even a suitable guy in FA . It's just the league market is all. They may. I doubt it. I think we're gonna feel the loss of Gilly. Are you suggesting Gilmore hasn't made tackles on RBs? Or slow the RB down? This is ridiculous. Linebackers are paid to tackle. Cornerbacks are paid to cover. Why aren't the best tackling CBs paid the most money? Why is Deion considered one of the best CBs in history considering he wouldn't even attempt to tackle. Surely that would knock him out of on of the greatest. He doesn't address this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Are you suggesting Gilmore hasn't made tackles on RBs? Or slow the RB down? This is ridiculous. Linebackers are paid to tackle. Cornerbacks are paid to cover. Why aren't the best tackling CBs paid the most money? Why is Deion considered one of the best CBs in history considering he wouldn't even attempt to tackle. Surely that would knock him out of on of the greatest. I think I already explained the Deion angle a few posts ago. The best corners tackle and cover, Gilmore isn't even close to those guys. Please tell me the play in the Dolphins game where Gilmore threw the shoulder would be acceptable to any coach. Sometimes linebackers have to cover to, and actually it is as important in the NFL today as tackling is for them. That is why every team is looking for linebackers that can cover and they get paid the most. Linebackers are paid to tackle and corners are paid to cover show a complete lack of understanding of how defenses work in today's NFL. We'll see. I doubt it. They may. I doubt it. I think we're gonna feel the loss of Gilly. He doesn't address this. Go look about five posts up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I think I already explained the Deion angle a few posts ago. The best corners tackle and cover, Gilmore isn't even close to those guys. Please tell me the play in the Dolphins game where Gilmore threw the shoulder would be acceptable to any coach. Sometimes linebackers have to cover to, and actually it is as important in the NFL today as tackling is for them. That is why every team is looking for linebackers that can cover and they get paid the most. Linebackers are paid to tackle and corners are paid to cover show a complete lack of understanding of how defenses work in today's NFL. Go look about five posts up. Deion can't be a great CB because he was a notorious poor tackler though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I think I already explained the Deion angle a few posts ago. The best corners tackle and cover, Gilmore isn't even close to those guys. Please tell me the play in the Dolphins game where Gilmore threw the shoulder would be acceptable to any coach. Sometimes linebackers have to cover to, and actually it is as important in the NFL today as tackling is for them. That is why every team is looking for linebackers that can cover and they get paid the most. Linebackers are paid to tackle and corners are paid to cover show a complete lack of understanding of how defenses work in today's NFL. I'm sorry but no you haven't. Deion Sanders is one of the best CBs to ever play the game. All you said was he was the best cover corner ever and you are saying Gilmore is horrible because he can't tackle. Deion couldn't tackle. Why is he considered one of the best to play the game, if he couldn't tackle? It doesn't show a complete lack of understanding at all. That is what Deion was paid for. He was paid for covering. Richard Sherman, also not a good tackler, is paid to cover. If you'd like to talk about how defense work in the NFL today, I'm more than happy to discuss. But why certain payers are paid the way they are is a completely different topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Deion can't be a great CB because he was a notorious poor tackler though. I don't know how I can dumb it down more for you but Deion is the greatest cover corner of all-time. When you have a guy like that shutting down half the field and returning int's for TD's when he gets it, it allows you to do things on defense that you would not normally be able to do. The fact that you can't understand that Deion was light years beyond Gilmore in coverage or that you think there is a threshold you can hit as a coverage corner, then you don't have to worry about tackling makes your opinion not that respectable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I don't know how I can dumb it down more for you but Deion is the greatest cover corner of all-time. When you have a guy like that shutting down half the field and returning int's for TD's when he gets it, it allows you to do things on defense that you would not normally be able to do. The fact that you can't understand that Deion was light years beyond Gilmore in coverage or that you think there is a threshold you can hit as a coverage corner, then you don't have to worry about tackling makes your opinion not that respectable. Doesn't Deion hit that threshold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I don't know how I can dumb it down more for you but Deion is the greatest cover corner of all-time. When you have a guy like that shutting down half the field and returning int's for TD's when he gets it, it allows you to do things on defense that you would not normally be able to do. The fact that you can't understand that Deion was light years beyond Gilmore in coverage or that you think there is a threshold you can hit as a coverage corner, then you don't have to worry about tackling makes your opinion not that respectable. No one is comparing Deion the player to Gilmore the player. We are talking about the CB position, which both players play. They both get paid for that position. You are complaining about how much Gilmore is going to get paid. Obviously you understand that Deion got paid because he was an amazing cover corner but admit he can't tackle. You think Gilmore is a bad CB and shouldn't be paid, because he can't tackle and is "kitty". Do you not see the problem with that argument? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Doesn't Deion hit that threshold? That was a little confusing. Deion was so good at coverage that a coach could forgive his poor tackling because they were able to do things with other players on defense that would give them a distinct advantage. If you think Gilmore is anywhere near that, you are insane. No one is comparing Deion the player to Gilmore the player. Actually that is exactly what you are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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