Polian critical of Bills not drafting a QB

[Kelly the Dog]

Right, genius. BTW, we don't have one now. Do we??????

No. But there is historical proof that what you suggested has no virtually no chance, unless you want to count once every 50 years.

[NickelCity]

Hogan from Stanford could be the star of the 2016 draft.

 

I would be absolutely astounded if that turned out to be the case. I just don't see it happening at all.

[Fadingpain]

He's right, they've mismanaged the position and continue to do so. DRAFT ONE EVERY YEAR UNTIL YOU FIND ONE. Overdraft if you have to - BPA is less important when you don't have any QB. Mettenberger last year. Grayson, Hundley or Petty this year. You can't win the lottery without buying tickets. It's the most important position. Believe it or not it's more important than nickel corner or the fourth RB.

Great post.

I know this is really unpopular, but I'm a big believer in drafting a QB every year. Every invention in history has been accomplished by trial and error experimenting. The odds of you being successful are FAR lower when you select a QB every 5 years, than if you select one every year. Similar to you trying only 1 idea every 5 years, than 1 idea every year.

 

If the value of a good QB is X times higher than any other position on the field (and we have a mostly stacked team in every other position), I see no reason to pass on a Petty/Grayson/Hundley in the 3rd, 4th, or 5th round every year. At that point you can cut Tuel and have 4 promising QBs face off and you cut the one who shows the least potential or provides the worst results. Run the QBs like an A/B test until you find a winner. I see spending 4th round picks as similar to spending $100 in a marketing campaign to find the best advertisement. To make money, you need to spend money and to get good QBs, you need to use draft picks.

 

This way you go into every draft saying "OK, we're taking a QB, who's the best guy at the best draft position". Now you end up taking Pat White, Colt Mccoy, Andy Dalton, and then Russell Wilson. Now boom, you have a franchise QB and a good young backup QB in Dalton you can trade for a high pick. In exchange this would have cost us Eric Wood, Alex Carrington, Aaron Williams, and T.J Graham. Are those 4 guys worth more than Russell Wilson and Andy Dalton?

Not unpopular with me.

[thewildrabbit]

To those being critical of Bill Polian because he is being critical of the Bills failure to find that elusive franchise QB need to understand that Polian found his man with every team in which he was the GM / president.

 

Buffalo Bills GM: 1986-1992 built a team that was the 2-14 bottom feeder, and won the division in three years. Polian managed to make Jim Kelly the highest paid QB in the league, and he came to Buffalo all smiles.

 

Carolina Panthers GM: 1995-1997 took an expansion team to the AFC championship game in two years. Drafted his franchise QB with the 5th overall pick in Kerry Collins who went on to the SB with the NY Giants.

 

Indianapolis Colts president: 1998-2011. 3-13 to 13-3 in one year as president because he took the right QB in Peyton Manning over Ryan Leaf.

 

Its my belief that Polian purposely tanked the 2011 Colts to obtain once in a generation QB Andrew Luck. Manning missed the 2011 season with a neck injury, and Polian knew he wasn't coming back that year. So Bill waited until two weeks before the season opener to sign a veteran backup QB in Kerry Collins, and had to know that wasn't going to be enough time to get him up to speed to field a winning team. The backup QB's were bums in Curtis Painter who started a whole two games previous to 2011, and Dan Orlovsky from Detroit.

 

The interesting thing here that that Manning's long time QB tutor, and mentor in former Colts OC Tom Moore suddenly decided to retire... leaving that world renowned NFL OC Clyde Christensen in charge of the Colts high powered offense. Clyde who? Needless to say the Colts offense went from 4th in points, and 4th in yards to 30th in yards, and 28th in points in 2011. Anyway the Colts owner didn't like the 2-14 record or Polian's son as GM so he fired them both.

 

Anyway, my point is that Polian basically found his franchise QB as soon as he joined the team he was in charge of and looking at his track record of success I'm honestly surprised so many fans here are denigrating his opinion on this subject.

 

Doug Whaley is now in his third season, and the team still doesn't have a clear cut franchise QB or even a decent solid O line for the maybe guys. I have to think if Polian had taken the job of team president / czar the Bills this year he would have already found their franchise QB, someway, somehow.

[Cleveland Rocks?]

Why draft a bad QB prospect just to say you drafted a QB? That's what scouts are for. Taking a longshot on a QB is ok in the 6th or 7th but wasting a pick a player who you don't think is ever going to be any more than a backup when you already have (sorry) 3 backups is flawed logic. Draft good QBs. This was a horrible QB class. I saw the piece on ESPN and I agree with the OP - Polian was not talking about just not drafting one at all, he was saying they should have drafted one to compete for the starting job this year. I don't think he knows the Bills have a 3-way competition and I have no idea who he thinks could compete for a starting position in 2015 out of the QB class this year outside of Winston and Mariota. The Browns and Texans are not being criticized for not taking a QB. The only criticism of the Browns is they refused to give up enough for Mariota.

 

I don't understand "just take a shot! You never know!" Really? The scouts' job is to determine how long it will take these QBs to become franchise QBs or if they ever be starters. The Bills have 4 QBs better equipped to start NFL games than any of the players they could have drafted this year. The Bills could have burned a 3rd rd pick on Petty, a 4th on Hundley, traded up for Grayson, but they would have not gotten their CB or OL and the QB wouldn't have (hopefully) seen the field for years. How does that help you. You could just take a better QB next year. Draft players, not positions. Where would they even keep this Project QB? The PS? They can't keep 4 QBs active. Are they even going to keep 3 active?

 

The Browns QB depth chart is Josh McCown, Johnny Rehab,Thad Lewis, and Connor Shaw and even we didn't take one of these QBs. And we had 12 picks! If the teams think there is someone out there that can help them they will pursue them. If they don't, they don't waste a pick and their time.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Cleveland Rocks?

[TXBILLSFAN]

Over the past 11 drafts, the Bills have only used ONE 1st or 2nd round pick on a QB. Let that sink in.

 

Only once in the past 11 years, have the Bills used one of their 1st or 2nd round picks to "take a shot" on a QB !!

 

Any of you who want to defend that fact with the backdrop of the crap we've had playing QB over that same time period, have at it.

[Cleveland Rocks?]

Over the past 11 drafts, the Bills have only used ONE 1st or 2nd round pick on a QB. Let that sink in.

 

Only once in the past 11 years, have the Bills used one of their 1st or 2nd round picks to "take a shot" on a QB !!

 

Any of you who want to defend that fact with the backdrop of the crap we've had playing QB over that same time period, have at it.

What does that have to do with what Polian said? BTW the Browns have done the opposite. Same result.

[H2o]

Watching the post draft analysis on espn and polian said he thought the bills had a good draft, but then went all melancholy about the fact they didnt take a Qb and would be entering the season with EJ manuel and "retread" Matt Cassel. He sounded like Eeyore.

 

Imo the bills signing TT is just like drafting a qb. The benefit is he's been a disciple already behind a SB winning qb for a few years. I didn't think any of the QBs left after the top 2 would be able to play in the NFL this year. The experts said all had big flaws and were all projects, none projected starters. So wth is Polian's issue. Plus we have 3 project QBs as it is.

The game has passed Bill Polian by hence he is on ESPN.

[Cleveland Rocks?]

You just drafted a QB in the 1st rd two years ago, right?Why not develop the guy you already have? How many QBs do you want the coached spending time developing - I'd rather try to win games. You have 4 QBs. I could se if there was a guy out there that they loved but no team that needed a QB seemed to love anyone. Bryce Petty lasted all the way until the 4th round.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Cleveland Rocks?

[White Linen]

I would have drafted one instead of the Karlos Williams and/or the Clemson LBs selections. The RB position is too crowded and the LB had surgery on both knees, if you want to gamble, do it on the most important position on the field.

 

The RB position seems crowded at the moment - but either before this year or next years season begins it will look a lot different. We are re-loading. The smart teams stay ahead of these situations and bring in rookies to play later when it's time to move away from a veteran (more expensive contract) to sign your key players.

[Cleveland Rocks?]

 

The RB position seems crowded at the moment - but either before this year or next years season begins it will look a lot different. We are re-loading. The smart teams stay ahead of these situations and bring in rookies to play later when it's time to move away from a veteran (more expensive contract) to sign your key players.

Bingo. This concept has always been hard for fans to understand. It is an adjustment to your team having a loaded roster and winning record, being a huge player in FA plus signing your own FAs and not creating holes you need to fill in the draft You are used to having obvious needs to fill and drafting high. It is very easy to understand those drafts. Drafts in NE, Seattle and now yours are geared toward the future though I am sure the OL will get a chance to start. Pretty exciting for ya'll.

[TXBILLSFAN]

What does that have to do with what Polian said? BTW the Browns have done the opposite. Same result.

 

Read the title of thread "Polian critical of Bills not drafting a QB"

 

As for Cleveland, eventually it does work, just ask Seattle, San Francisco and maybe Minnesota and Oakland. You will never get a franchise QB if you don't try.

[Cleveland Rocks?]

 

Read the title of thread "Polian critical of Bills not drafting a QB"

 

As for Cleveland, eventually it does work, just ask Seattle, San Francisco and maybe Minnesota and Oakland. You will never get a franchise QB if you don't try.

Did you read anything other than the title? Just wondering. He wasn't saying they should have traded into the 1st round. Or reach in the 2nd. Your post was about taking a QB in the 1st or 2nd round?

 

The Bills took a QB in the 1st rd the year before Minnesota and Oakland did. SF took one in 2011 and not since then. Seattle? When did they take one in the 1st or 2nd? The Bills JUST took one. What is the last 11 years about? Is this the same GM? Your posts are incongruent to Polian's comments. Polian said they should have taken a QB to compete for the starting job this year. There were none projected to do this with any team, outside of the top 2.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Cleveland Rocks?

[TXBILLSFAN]

Did you read anything other than the title? Just wondering. He wasn't saying they should have traded into the 1st round. Or reach in the 2nd.

 

I heard what he said on draft day. The point he was making was that the Bills are weak at the QB position and haven't addressed it in the offseason.

 

The point I'm making, is why would you expect anything but weakness at a position that has essentially been ignored over the past 11 years.

[Cleveland Rocks?]

 

I heard what he said on draft day. The point he was making was that the Bills are weak at the QB position and haven't addressed it in the offseason.

 

The point I'm making, is why would you expect anything but weakness at a position that has essentially been ignored over the past 11 years.

They signed two QBs didn't they? I assume they felt they were better short term prospects that the play dough available in the draft. I mean I'm not even a Bills fan and I would have been surprised if they took any of these guys. Didn't they also try to trade for Bradford? I don't think your QB situation is as dire as you do. Just go out and win games. They aren't playing with a rookie out there or anything.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Cleveland Rocks?

[negativo]

Grayson was the only QB worth taking after the Big Two, but he was gobbled up before the Bills 3rd round pick by NO. Had he been available the Bills very well might have taken a shot on him. The rest of the pack were essentially athletic projects, and we have enough of that already.

[TXBILLSFAN]

They signed two QBs didn't they? I assume they felt they were better short term prospects that the play dough available in the draft. I mean I'm not even a Bills fan and I would have been surprised if they took any of these guys. Didn't they also try to trade for Bradford? I don't think your QB situation is as dire as you do. Just go out and win games. They aren't playing with a rookie out there or anything.

 

Believe me, it's DIRE.

 

That's the excuse many Bills fans use EVERY YEAR the Bills don't select a QB, "oh, but we signed XXX" or "there wasn't a QB worthy of a 1st round or 2nd round or 3rd round pick"

 

How about this statistic, in the last 8 drafts, the Bills have selected 2 QB's in the entire draft, a 1st round pick on EJ and a 7th round pick on Levi Brown. 8 years, 2 QB's.

 

In that same timeframe, the Bills passed on the following QB's in the draft (Ru Wilson, Bridgewater, Da Carr, Foles, Dalton, Kaepernick, Flacco)

 

Not to mention NOT trading UP to take some of the other QB's that weren't available at their selection. But, they did trade up for a WR!!

Edited May 4, 2015 by TXBILLSFAN

[Cleveland Rocks?]

 

Believe me, it's DIRE.

 

That's the excuse many Bills fans use EVERY YEAR the Bills don't select a QB, "oh, but we signed XXX" or "there wasn't a QB worthy of a 1st round or 2nd round or 3rd round pick"

 

How about this statistic, in the last 8 drafts, the Bills have selected 2 QB's in the entire draft, a 1st round pick on EJ and a 7th round pick on Levi Brown. 8 years, 2 QB's.

 

In that same timeframe, the Bills passed on the following QB's in the draft (Ru Wilson, Bridgewater, Da Carr, Foles, Dalton, Kaepernick, Flacco)

 

Not to mention NOT trading UP to take some of the other QB's that weren't available at their selection. But, they did trade up for a WR!!

Why would they have taken a QB in the 1st or 2nd last year when they just took one in the 1st the year before though? I get the frustration believe me... but I guess I have a hard time looking too far back to criticize the current. You can drive yourself nuts that way. They just took a guy, you need to develop him. You are what you are by year 3. If he doesn't step into the desired role this year then you take another one as high as possible next year. That's just my opinion. Unless there was someone worthy other there this year you can't pass up, but there wasn't. Bridgewater and Carr aren't any better than Manuel are they? Looked decent at times but overall inconsistent as you would expect. I mean, they looked better than Manziel and Bortles.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Cleveland Rocks?

[JohnC]

 

Read the title of thread "Polian critical of Bills not drafting a QB"

 

As for Cleveland, eventually it does work, just ask Seattle, San Francisco and maybe Minnesota and Oakland. You will never get a franchise QB if you don't try.

From where we were drafting no qb available in this draft would not have been a factor for us this year or next. Why reach for a qb that won't be a factor for the next couple of years when next year you will be in a better position with a first round pick to select a better qb prospect.

 

I understand your frustration with the lack of initiative over the past number of years to meaningfully address the qb position. The Levy two years, the Brandon one year and the Nix three years on top of the Whaley short stint gave scant attention to the position. I'm aware that Nix/Whaley drafted EJ in the first round. But in my view they over-reached (maybe out of desperation) in drafting a third round prospect in the first round.

 

One of the reasons for the expression of so much frustration over the qb issue is that most people who follow the team recognize that this franchise is assembling a strong enough roster to be a contending team. On the other hand most people recognize that our current stable of qbs undercuts the overall strength of the roster. That's why the level of frustration is high for so many people.

 

Based on past history the worst thing that Whaley can do is make decisiions out of desperation. If the opportunityh isn't there to accomplish what you want to do then bide you team and act when you are in a better position to do so. That is a sign of organizational maturity. And that isn't a bad organizational attribute to have.

[TXBILLSFAN]

From where we were drafting no qb available in this draft would not have been a factor for us this year or next. Why reach for a qb that won't be a factor for the next couple of years when next year you will be in a better position with a first round pick to select a better qb prospect.

 

I understand your frustration with the lack of initiative over the past number of years to meaningfully address the qb position. The Levy two years, the Brandon one year and the Nix three years on top of the Whaley short stint gave scant attention to the position. I'm aware that Nix/Whaley drafted EJ in the first round. But in my view they over-reached (maybe out of desperation) in drafting a third round prospect in the first round.

 

One of the reasons for the expression of so much frustration over the qb issue is that most people who follow the team recognize that this franchise is assembling a strong enough roster to be a contending team. On the other hand most people recognize that our current stable of qbs undercuts the overall strength of the roster. That's why the level of frustration is high for so many people.

 

Based on past history the worst thing that Whaley can do is make decisiions out of desperation. If the opportunityh isn't there to accomplish what you want to do then bide you team and act when you are in a better position to do so. That is a sign of organizational maturity. And that isn't a bad organizational attribute to have.

 

 

Why would they have taken a QB in the 1st or 2nd last year when they just took one in the 1st the year before though? I get the frustration believe me... but I guess I have a hard time looking too far back to criticize the current. You can drive yourself nuts that way. They just took a guy, you need to develop him. You are what you are by year 3. If he doesn't step into the desired role this year then you take another one as high as possible next year. That's just my opinion. Unless there was someone worthy other there this year you can't pass up, but there wasn't. Bridgewater and Carr aren't any better than Manuel are they? Looked decent at times but overall inconsistent as you would expect. I mean, they looked better than Manziel and Bortles.

 

You both make rational arguments, but, too often, as fans we tend to rationalize our team's actions.

 

The QB position is too important to ignore the draft as a source for the next franchise guy.

 

As for EJ, yeah he should be developed and given a chance, then why didn't he play the last 2 games last year when the Bills were eliminated from the playoffs ?

 

I wanted the Bills to trade back into the 4th round and take Petty or Hundley.

Edited May 4, 2015 by TXBILLSFAN