Fezmid Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 A lot of people unfortunately do not look at it that way. They only think of themselves, not how their actions effect other people. 220357[/snapback] Well, maybe I look at it differently because if I miss work, I still have the same number of projects on my plate the next day (and oftentimes will have to work extra hours later to get it done anyway). Plus, even if I'm really sick, I need to be available by cell in case something comes up. Heck, when I went on my honeymoon to London, I had to give them the name and number of the hotel I was staying in, "Just in case." Things get a little harrier when, as has been mentioned, you need to find someone else to cover your time or if other co-workers will need to work extra hard that day. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 So much of this comes down to personal work ethic, and KD is 100% right in what he says about the way he manages his staff. In my previous life I had one employee who showed up everyday exactly at 8:30 a.m., left for lunch exactly at noon, returned from lunch exactly at 1 p.m. and left exactly at 5 p.m. She used every vacation day...every sick day...and in some cases took days off without pay, which then led to some disciplinary action. The problem? She was surrounded by people who worked longer hours, skipped lunches, rarely took sick days. So come review time, how could I not judge her accomplishments based on a comparison of those around her. She'd get a 2% raise, and then complain about it. It comes down to work ethic. You either have it or you don't. And that's okay, because businesses need people who do as little as they can for as long as they can. But when they only get a small raise, they should understand why. Becaues you'll never see a Turkey graduate from Eagle School. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 There's no such thing as truly "unlimited" sick days. 220448[/snapback] That's not true. There is such a thing if you actually use them as SICK DAYS. As an exempt employee here that's what I get, "unlimited" sick days. I use that time when I'm sick or when one of my kids is sick. When our daughter was in the hospital for a week with viral pneumonia, I stayed out all week to trade off with my wife being with our daughter at the hospital and with our son at home, and I didn't have to worry about not having enough sick time. When we had to go to Philadelphia for four days for some tests for our daughter, I took those as sick time, same deal. I get a certain amount of vacation each year based on time served, and three days' worth of personal time. I can't roll those over. Even though I get "unlimited" sick days, I'd never think of using one just because I didn't feel like going to work. Nobody else is going to do my job if I don't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Even though I get "unlimited" sick days, I'd never think of using one just because I didn't feel like going to work. Nobody else is going to do my job if I don't do it. 220553[/snapback] I guess that was kind of my point. Any employer who offers "unlimited" sick days knows he is either in a field where the people generally aren't slackers, or knows all of his employees well enough (unlikely) to know that they wouldn't abuse the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderweb Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I would tend to agree that employees who use "sick days" as if they are somehow thiers to use for whatever they deem appropriate (long weekend, etc) are displaying less than desirable character. As a manager I can also say that every review I've ever written (company forms), have ALWAYS had a grade for attendance. An outstanding review cannot be obtained if an employee has bad attendance. Just for the record, the grades are determined by the company as to what constitutes excellent to poor attendance. So that everyone understands, a multiple day illness (hospital stay, servere flu, etc) are not weighted severely on your attendance record by the company that employs me. A day here, a day there until they're gone is heavy weighted against the employee, but even then the reason does come into play. There are some factors that can mitigate this, but in general, that's how this would be viewed. For those who argued the "productivity" thing yesterday relative to smoke breaks, etc, is this not lost productivity of the worst kind (100%) when an employee just decides to blow off a day for "just because I can"? In my business (Transportation - Import/Export) every day is a new battle. There isn't any tomorrow when your customer needs their product today. Absenteeism is the largest blow to our productivity. No my friends, sick days are not just extensions of your vacation allotment, nor were they ever intended to be. Only those who are able to rationalize away their own actions find that they are. They are for pay continuation in the event that you are truely sick. We have 7 days (called "discretionary days") available to our employees to use. Every January 1st you get a new allotment of 7. They cannot be carried over to the next year. You're truely sick? Use them as needed. Have a dentist appointment for a root canal, medical tests, etc., let us know when the tests or procedures are and use them. They are not to make a long weekend. Yet, as we all know, some will use them just for that so there's a bit of an incentive offered not to. If you don't use the "discretionary" days then at the end of the year, you get paid for any unused ones. Lastly, in every employment interview we give, we stress right up front that attendance is a MAJOR issue. There are no secrets going into our Employer/Employee relationship in this respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 For those of you who think using "sick days" when you aren't sick is wrong, how do you feel about PTO. All of my time off is PTO -- to be used for sick, personal, or vacation. Now, if i wake up one day, and don't feel like going to work and call in "sick" and use one of my PTO days, that's fine, right? I mean, I'm taking away one of my own vacation days anyway. (Note: I have not called in sick since I have been here). My next planned day off is February 7th. Day after the SB, and my birthday is the next day, so why not make it a 3dayer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taterhill Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 funny story...a group of 20 of us went to the Bills/Indy MNF game in 2000 i think...one of my buddies...a school teacher...used a SICK day monday and a personal day Tuesday...well due to us screaming like idiots for the Bills, the MNF cameras decided to come up and pan our row after Rob Johnson ran for a first down...since 95% of Buffalo watches the bills, esp on MNF, everybody saw us, including our friend, who they showed for like 3 seconds before the panned our row...well all of his students, fellow teachers , and admins saw him on national TV, after he called in sick that day....he came very close to losing his job, because he called in sick, instead of a personal day...I thought it was kind of funny.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 What about people with children who have to take a lot of sick time to take care of their kids? Where do they fall into this whole hierarcy? CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewin Posted January 27, 2005 Author Share Posted January 27, 2005 What about people with children who have to take a lot of sick time to take care of their kids? Where do they fall into this whole hierarcy? CW 220646[/snapback] I usually call that "work from home". Goes back to the 'unlimited sick day thing' and the type of job/situation you are in. In my situation we are appraised based on output and results, not number of hours worked in the office. If something comes up that takes you away from the office you are still expected to meet your schedules/deadlines (or work out an acceptable contingency). If I miss a day or two because my kids are sick my manager doesn't blink - as long as ultimately I get my job done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I warned my bosses and co-workers that i might call in sick a couple weeks ago, the day the bills played the steelers, so sure enough i did, i used the excuse that i was taking a mental health day. in retrospect, staying home to watch that fiasco would indicate that perhaps i do have some mental health issues i need to address........ My favorites from this article: I forgot to come back to work after lunch I couldn't find my shoes My monkey died Best excuses for calling in sick I wonder if severe agitation/depression resulting from a Pats SB victory would count? 220282[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Now, if i wake up one day, and don't feel like going to work and call in "sick" and use one of my PTO days, that's fine, right? I mean, I'm taking away one of my own vacation days anyway. 220564[/snapback] It's fine. It's just inconsiderate and unprofessional. But it's all relative based on how you view your job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I warned my bosses and co-workers that i might call in sick a couple weeks ago... 220667[/snapback] And that, to me, is considerate and professional and the kind of thing your employer remembers when you apply for a higher-paying job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 What about people with children who have to take a lot of sick time to take care of their kids? Where do they fall into this whole hierarcy? CW 220646[/snapback] You take vacation time, since it is not you that is sick. In most all cases, having children is a voluntary act, so it is your responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 It's fine. It's just inconsiderate and unprofessional. But it's all relative based on how you view your job. 220676[/snapback] Well, like I said, I have yet to call in sick... I can't do it anyway. My christmas vacation took me 8 months to save up the days for. But I do feel calling in "sick" when you're not isn't even worth it. I mean, is it worth risking your job over if you leave the house and someone "spots" you... have fun with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I always give people the benefit of the doubt. People can come in late or leave early --- hey, we all have personal business to take care of and if the work gets done I could care less. I don't like to be treated like a punk or micro-managed, so I don't do that to others. BUT, almost everywhere I've gone, there have been one or two who take as much advantage as they can of the good natured environment. It's those people who piss me off to no end (these are the people who are ALWAYS out sick) and for those people I am a serious prick. Thats the environement I work in. We basically come and go as we please, all anyone cares about is if the work gets done. Taking days off is never a problem and I've never called in sick. We are well compensated, but work hard. 70-80 hour work weeks do happen and you are expected to step up and perform. Conversely, you have the freedom to come and go as you please and can structure your day however you want (2 hour lunch to pick up something from Midtown for instance). The focus is the work itself, not on petty bull sh--, which is the great part of the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 And that, to me, is considerate and professional and the kind of thing your employer remembers when you apply for a higher-paying job. 220679[/snapback] Funny, when I worked in Customer Service in this same company, I took my PTO day the first saturday available. And yet, I still got a promotion and a raise. Must just be that personality and doing well at your job means more to some people than being a drone who works 50 hours a week and hasn't taken a day off in 9 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Funny, when I worked in Customer Service in this same company, I took my PTO day the first saturday available. And yet, I still got a promotion and a raise. Must just be that personality and doing well at your job means more to some people than being a drone who works 50 hours a week and hasn't taken a day off in 9 years. 220695[/snapback] Maybe, just maybe, it means you didn't do it all the time. Personality? Mmmkay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Personality? Mmmkay. 220703[/snapback] yes. Some people in this world aren't pompous pricks, believe it or not. As a matter of fact, my old boss and I go to the dog track once a month to play hold em. Some people just like to shoot the sh-- and hang out. Others like to judge and think they are better. To each his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 You take vacation time, since it is not you that is sick. In most all cases, having children is a voluntary act, so it is your responsibility. 220687[/snapback] The FMLA allows time off for (among other things) personal illness AND for the illness of a child for whom you're a primary caregiver. Most enlightened employment policies follow similar logic. Staying home to take care of a five-year-old with chickenpox is an acceptable use of sick time under most employment policies. Staying home to babysit your grandchildren because your adult daughter (who is old enough to make other care arrangements) is sick is not an acceptable use of sick time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 yes. Some people in this world aren't pompous pricks, believe it or not. As a matter of fact, my old boss and I go to the dog track once a month to play hold em. Some people just like to shoot the sh-- and hang out. Others like to judge and think they are better. To each his own. 220708[/snapback] So you should get a raise because you're not a pompous prick? Mmmkay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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