Kirby Jackson Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I think we agree on at least this-- as a practical manner, the NFL would basically have to approve of Rogers, approve of his plan to move the team to the Toronto, and approve of the potential risk of some litigation-- something that seems unlikely, at least to me. If the NFL does all that, then if I am Rogers, I make the $400 m payment. The county may decline to accept it. Then, Rogers either: (a) proceeds with his plan, and dares the county to sue, seeking an injunction; or (b) Rogers sues, seeking a declaratory judgment, essentially asking the court to declare the payment of $400 m effectively voids the lease. Either way, the county faces an uphill battle, because, as I said above, they have quantified the harm through the liquidated damages provision. I doubt home court advantage is going to save them on that. And, the litigation delay is not going to be all that significant; preliminary injunctions are decided relatively quickly. I obviously hope this doesn't happen, but I wouldn't bank on the county's ability to seek an injunction in court as the thing that stops a move from happening. I think that the where you are off JR is that the county and Bills have already agreed that a $400M payment does not make the lease void. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I think we agree on at least this-- as a practical manner, the NFL would basically have to approve of Rogers, approve of his plan to move the team to the Toronto, and approve of the potential risk of some litigation-- something that seems unlikely, at least to me. If the NFL does all that, then if I am Rogers, I make the $400 m payment. The county may decline to accept it. Then, Rogers either: (a) proceeds with his plan, and dares the county to sue, seeking an injunction; or (b) Rogers sues, seeking a declaratory judgment, essentially asking the court to declare the payment of $400 m effectively voids the lease. Either way, the county faces an uphill battle, because, as I said above, they have quantified the harm through the liquidated damages provision. I doubt home court advantage is going to save them on that. And, the litigation delay is not going to be all that significant; preliminary injunctions are decided relatively quickly. I obviously hope this doesn't happen, but I wouldn't bank on the county's ability to seek an injunction in court as the thing that stops a move from happening. You're missing the point entirely. They don't get to the NFL approval point without the legal process started. Cuomo will immediately initiate action at any hint of relocation. And those hints are out there. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 Will Cuomo be Governor in 2019? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 Will Cuomo be Governor in 2019? Relevance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 He would be powerless to do anything if an owner wanted to move in 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 He would be powerless to do anything if an owner wanted to move in 2020 Who is going to buy this team without (a) presenting a stadium plan or (b) making their intent to move known from the start? Come on...you're smarter than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 I think we agree on at least this-- as a practical manner, the NFL would basically have to approve of Rogers, approve of his plan to move the team to the Toronto, and approve of the potential risk of some litigation-- something that seems unlikely, at least to me. If the NFL does all that, then if I am Rogers, I make the $400 m payment. JW's point is that the NFL doesn't review it for approval until after any litigation is resolved. The timing is important, because new ownership will have broken the terms of lease by even broaching the subject of relocation, without any guarantee that the NFL would approve a move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) Who is going to buy this team without (a) presenting a stadium plan or (b) making their intent to move known from the start? Come on...you're smarter than that. The guy who wants to announce in 2020 he will move them as soon as his just revealed stadium plans are complete. All are assuming that a new owner will buy the team this year and then unveil some plan for a local stadium. I won't happen that way. Any new owner has 6 years to think about where he wants to take the team Edited June 8, 2014 by Mr. WEO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 The guy who wants to announce in 2020 he will move them as soon as his just revealed stadium plans are complete. All are assuming that a new owner will buy the team this year and then unveil some plan for a local stadium. I won't happen that way. Any new owner has 6 years to think about where he wants to take the team So you think that the identity of the owner won't be the writing in the wall? You think that we won't know the fate of the team from the moment a sale is agreed upon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 So you think that the identity of the owner won't be the writing in the wall? You think that we won't know the fate of the team from the moment a sale is agreed upon? How will you know the fate of the team based solely on the buyer? Every team that has moved from a city has done so because the local municipality would not build them a stadium. Why would you assume ANY owner would stay if there is no new stadium built by 2020? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazie Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 Great post TX, those are TE things that never get mentioned. It is not a fair fight for sure. When the Bills leave they are doing it in the middle of the night like the old Baltimore franchise to Indy. It will be over before it starts, and everyone here will be left sputtering with impotent rage. That is the way I see it being done. then whatever owner did that, will deal with the consequences afterwards, like Modell did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 How will you know the fate of the team based solely on the buyer? Every team that has moved from a city has done so because the local municipality would not build them a stadium. Why would you assume ANY owner would stay if there is no new stadium built by 2020? Please WEO; you know perfectly well that any new owner with intent of keeping the team here will get the support of the State and County. Local buyer = team stays...there really isn't much reason to complicate it further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 When the Bills leave they are doing it in the middle of the night like the old Baltimore franchise to Indy. It will be over before it starts, and everyone here will be left sputtering with impotent rage. That is the way I see it being done. then whatever owner did that, will deal with the consequences afterwards, like Modell did. That is not going to happen. This is not an after school special. There are so many legal hurdles that need to be cleared to move this team. There is WAY too much money at stake for the state to go quietly. How will you know the fate of the team based solely on the buyer? Every team that has moved from a city has done so because the local municipality would not build them a stadium. Why would you assume ANY owner would stay if there is no new stadium built by 2020? I will give you the list:Team stays if: -Golisano -Pegula -Rich -Jacobs - most likely Trump Team leaves if: -Rogers -Evil Troll Any other contender who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oman128 Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 Just think if a new owner goes to court gets the lease declared null and void with some fancy lawyering he pays a fee, not a bribe and moves the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) Just think if a new owner goes to court gets the lease declared null and void with some fancy lawyering he pays a fee, not a bribe and moves the team. I'm sure that they will have a really easy time doing that in Erie County Court. Okay; thanks. I think I understand that point. If the NFL approves the sale to Rogers with the understanding that he will move the team at some point, I am not sure whether the league would really care that there is litigation over whether the move could happen immediately (ie, Rogers tries to pay the buy out), or in 2020 (lease expires). The reason that the league may hesitate to approve Rogers (or any Canadian buyer) is the lingering threat from Schumer of challenging the anti-trust exemption. The money that will cost the owners is WAY more than they will make in a new market vs. WNY. Edited June 8, 2014 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) I told people from very beginning there was a chance a buyer would just pay the $400mm and move the team. Math is simple, for example: If buyer thinks bills are worth $1.7b somewhere else, they'd be willing to pay 1.7-0.4 = $1.3B If $1.3B is more than the highest bid from buffalo buyer, trust has an obligation to sell to the $1.3B bidder. Edited June 8, 2014 by Joe_the_6_pack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zazie Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 I'm sure that they will have a really easy time doing that in Erie County Court. The reason that the league may hesitate to approve Rogers (or any Canadian buyer) is the lingering threat from Schumer of challenging the anti-trust exemption. The money that will cost the owners is WAY more than they will make in a new market vs. WNY. does not make sense to me, this argument. these guys are long thinkers not short thinkers, if they can make 200m per season somewhere else, and it costs them a 400m fine plus plus, they will do it. Because 200m over 30 years or 50 years, adds up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 does not make sense to me, this argument. these guys are long thinkers not short thinkers, if they can make 200m per season somewhere else, and it costs them a 400m fine plus plus, they will do it. Because 200m over 30 years or 50 years, adds up. The $400m is not an option. That is what you are missing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 I told people from very beginning there was a chance a buyer would just pay the $400mm and move the team. Math is simple, for example: If buyer thinks bills are worth $1.7b somewhere else, they'd be willing to pay 1.7-0.4 = $1.3B If $1.3B is more than the highest bid from buffalo buyer, trust has an obligation to sell to the $1.3B bidder. With only having looked at the last 3 posts, I'm sure people have pointed out that its not something they can just pay 400 million, they have to win in court and then IF they win, they can pay 400 million to move the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) With only having looked at the last 3 posts, I'm sure people have pointed out that its not something they can just pay 400 million, they have to win in court and then IF they win, they can pay 400 million to move the team. Thank you!! The odds of winning in court are about 1 in 1,000,000. Edited June 8, 2014 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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