Malazan Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/jeff-simon/for-an-event-as-significant-as-ralph-wilsons-death-nothing-can-compare-to-print-media-20140330 Since we can have a thread kvetching about a Toronto writer and his classless article about the future of the NFL in toronto....how about one about the Buffalo News....trumpeting it's coverage of Ralph Wilson's death. I saw this on the front page of TBD and did a double take. Then I saw it was the Buffalo News... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 http://www.buffalone...-media-20140330 Since we can have a thread kvetching about a Toronto writer and his classless article about the future of the NFL in toronto....how about one about the Buffalo News....trumpeting it's coverage of Ralph Wilson's death. I saw this on the front page of TBD and did a double take. Then I saw it was the Buffalo News... I thought the same at first; it's just kind of a bad headline (usually the editor's job). It's also not a sports writer, but entertainment columnist / film critic Jeff Simon. Simon is kind of a dinosaur, but I think he makes some points worth considering about the validity of the traditional mass media in the era of multi-media news. I can't say that 24/7 news has made my life better or even made me better informed. It has sometimes helped me get the story more quickly, but I also see the value in good reporting, longer reads and taking time to consider one's words. The day that it takes to get a newspaper out vs. packaging something for the 6:00 news can make a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I have no problem with this. I don't believe traditional media like newspapers toot their horn enough about how they're typically better than the rest. Sure, you can complain about the timing of such a column, but when is a good time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I read that not knowing what to expect and not knowing what the hell he was talking about as I read it. He jumped around from downing the Bills, the instant media popularity, to boasting about life in Buffalo before 1950 (which in sure he wasn't here to speak about). It jumped everywhere and in the end it sounded like nothing more than a way of hating social media and boasting about the print of the Buffalo News on paper, which ironically you can bring up on your computer or personal device in seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I have no problem with this. I don't believe traditional media like newspapers toot their horn enough about how they're typically better than the rest. Sure, you can complain about the timing of such a column, but when is a good time? For tooting your own horn? My mama taught me never. Half the "stories" in the media these days are self created bullsh-- designed for nothing but cross promotion of other media/entertainment entities. This one (LAMP!!!) is just pathetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I read that not knowing what to expect and not knowing what the hell he was talking about as I read it. He jumped around from downing the Bills, the instant media popularity, to boasting about life in Buffalo before 1950 (which in sure he wasn't here to speak about). It jumped everywhere and in the end it sounded like nothing more than a way of hating social media and boasting about the print of the Buffalo News on paper, which ironically you can bring up on your computer or personal device in seconds. No doubt. I work in broadcast media and I think what we hope for is that we can adapt to the ways people consume (podcasts, digital apps, etc) while maintaining and improving the practices that make for good journalism / storytelling. So, while BN has its root in paper (and Simon is touting the paper experience for the ability to have a spread, above/below fold stories, etc), the best stuff hopefully translates. I think you and I can agree - it doesn't, always. I don't hate social media - I think it'd be like hating a line of fiber-optic cable. I hate the way a lot of people use it and over-rely on it, and I do want to see people who do a really good job in any media compensated well enough to make it worth their while - people tend to think that because of social media the role of journalist is more obsolete, where I think it's the contrary. People who can help readers / listeners parse through the BS are more important than ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 For tooting your own horn? My mama taught me never. Half the "stories" in the media these days are self created bullsh-- designed for nothing but cross promotion of other media/entertainment entities. This one (LAMP!!!) is just pathetic. I agree when it comes to broadcast media, but not newspapers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) I actually thought the article was pretty good...and I really didn't find it disrespectful to Ralph Wilson in the slightest. I think those who are finding it offensive in some way, are taking it out of context a bit. It is a far cry from the Toronto Star article posted the day Wilson passed away. I read that not knowing what to expect and not knowing what the hell he was talking about as I read it. He jumped around from downing the Bills, the instant media popularity, to boasting about life in Buffalo before 1950 (which in sure he wasn't here to speak about). It jumped everywhere and in the end it sounded like nothing more than a way of hating social media and boasting about the print of the Buffalo News on paper, which ironically you can bring up on your computer or personal device in seconds. Yeah, no offense mrags, but I think you are missing the point. Edited March 31, 2014 by Buftex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I actually thought the article was pretty good...and I really didn't find it disrespectful to Ralph Wilson in the slightest. I think those who are finding it offensive in some way, are taking it out of context a bit. It is a far cry from the Toronto Star article posted the day Wilson passed away. Yeah, no offense mrags, but I think you are missing the point. no. I got the point. It jumped all over the place. It didn't enforce it's reasoning very much. Others have stated that a well. I don't take offense to it at all regarding Wilson's death. I don't think it was really disrespectful (not much) it just wasn't a well written piece IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Wait, there was just a thread where posters here praised the Buff News: http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/166663-buffalo-media-giving-credit-where-it-is-due/ So when they take a bow, they lose all that credit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 no. I got the point. It jumped all over the place. It didn't enforce it's reasoning very much. Others have stated that a well. I don't take offense to it at all regarding Wilson's death. I don't think it was really disrespectful (not much) it just wasn't a well written piece IMO. Okay, I guess I can agree that it may not be the best column ever written. But, I think the sentiment came through, that a story like with the scope of the death of Ralph Wilson, especially on the local level, can get the respect it deserves in old-fashioned print media, as opposed to modern journalism. I happen to agree with him. Forgive me if I jumped the gun, for saying you didn't understand... I guess i am just puzzled as to why somebody started a thread about a "classless" article about Mr Wilson, from the Buffalo News. As I said, and it seems you agree, at least on this point, the column wasn't at all disrespectful to Mr Wilson. It was simply harkening back to the days when journalists had time enough to think about what they were writing, rather than just running stream of consciousness with whatever comes across the twittersphere...as has been pointed out, all too often, the source of a piece of news becomes as big as the story itself. Simon has been writing for the Buffalo News for close to 40 years, I would guess. For as long as I can remember. He isn't a sports guy. Perhaps he is guilty of tooting his own (or the Buffalo News) horn to a degree...but don't forget, his column is about media and entertainment... I guess I just find it odd that people find this so offensive. I suspect Ralph Wilson might have agreed with Simon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted March 31, 2014 Author Share Posted March 31, 2014 Wait, there was just a thread where posters here praised the Buff News: http://forums.twobil...here-it-is-due/ So when they take a bow, they lose all that credit? It's not a bow. They take shots at other media outlets, randomly talk about life in other eras. I guess I'm of the class that if you do a good job, you don't need to talk about it and you certainly don't need to bash other local news outlets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) Oh boy... we are a hyper-sensitive lot aren't we? If you read the column, Simon clearly extolls the virtue of current electronic media as well...it seems like panties are in a wad over absolutely nothing. Comparing this to the Toronto article about Wilson (as somebody did here) just shows that people really have lost the abiltiy to keep things in perspective. Simon isn't even patting himself on the back, but giving a nod to fellow columnists at the Buffalo News. Edited March 31, 2014 by Buftex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 its a national media story. just what many were asking for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I agree Buftex. And although I don't believe it was at all really disrespects to Mr. Wilson, it was however in bad taste of the timing of the story maybe. It gives it that feel that it's disrespectful. He does go on to tell the highlights of social media while "touting his and the Buffalo News' own horns" but he doesn't exactly do it tactfully. I guess that's the best way I could describe it. Maybe I just thought it was a bad story altogether for the time. Or maybe it was his tacky way of showing it. It didn't feel like he needed to bring Mr. Wilson's name into the discussion of selling people on how the old fashioned news outlet can be better than the new social media way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 It's not a bow. They take shots at other media outlets, randomly talk about life in other eras. I guess I'm of the class that if you do a good job, you don't need to talk about it and you certainly don't need to bash other local news outlets. It is a bow. See below. Buftex explains it better than I can... Oh boy... we are a hyper-sensitive lot aren't we? If you read the column, Simon clearly extolls the virtue of current electronic media as well...it seems like panties are in a wad over absolutely nothing. Comparing this to the Toronto article about Wilson (as somebody did here) just shows that people really have lost the abiltiy to keep things in perspective. Simon isn't even patting himself on the back, but giving a nod to fellow columnists at the Buffalo News. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLFan Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 No doubt. I work in broadcast media and I think what we hope for is that we can adapt to the ways people consume (podcasts, digital apps, etc) while maintaining and improving the practices that make for good journalism / storytelling. So, while BN has its root in paper (and Simon is touting the paper experience for the ability to have a spread, above/below fold stories, etc), the best stuff hopefully translates. I think you and I can agree - it doesn't, always. I don't hate social media - I think it'd be like hating a line of fiber-optic cable. I hate the way a lot of people use it and over-rely on it, and I do want to see people who do a really good job in any media compensated well enough to make it worth their while - people tend to think that because of social media the role of journalist is more obsolete, where I think it's the contrary. People who can help readers / listeners parse through the BS are more important than ever. Very well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted April 1, 2014 Author Share Posted April 1, 2014 Oh boy... we are a hyper-sensitive lot aren't we? If you read the column, Simon clearly extolls the virtue of current electronic media as well...it seems like panties are in a wad over absolutely nothing. Comparing this to the Toronto article about Wilson (as somebody did here) just shows that people really have lost the abiltiy to keep things in perspective. Simon isn't even patting himself on the back, but giving a nod to fellow columnists at the Buffalo News. I think it's interesting that people jumped all over a Toronto reported for speculating on the future of the Bills while the Buffalo News is writing an article about how well they covered someone's death. What is the point of the article? It feels like someone walking up to you and saying, "Hey, I'm relevant." The praise for his colleagues is a nice gesture, but why was it necessary to point out that they did so well? If the manager of a restaurant came up to you to tell you how awesome your waiter was to you...it would be strange. It's not less strange here in my opinion. Does this absolve the absolutely horrendous track record of them covering the team? He also has some interesting ideas like somehow you can't watch things in real time on the internet or that someone would only be following tweets of a game without some reason for not watching it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 (edited) I think it's interesting that people jumped all over a Toronto reported for speculating on the future of the Bills while the Buffalo News is writing an article about how well they covered someone's death. What is the point of the article? It feels like someone walking up to you and saying, "Hey, I'm relevant." The praise for his colleagues is a nice gesture, but why was it necessary to point out that they did so well? If the manager of a restaurant came up to you to tell you how awesome your waiter was to you...it would be strange. It's not less strange here in my opinion. Does this absolve the absolutely horrendous track record of them covering the team? He also has some interesting ideas like somehow you can't watch things in real time on the internet or that someone would only be following tweets of a game without some reason for not watching it. I guess there really isn't a point in going back and forth on this... go be offended then... it seems that many here can't understand the difference between a news reporter, and a columnist. You are right, the point of the column was to illustrate that the old fashioned newspaper still has a place in the world of "news". Seems like you are really reading way more into in than that. He clearly says that you can't beat television coverage for live events, that are unfolding in front of you ... but for putting a story into its' larger, more significant context, print journalism is still the best. And again, you are making some false equivalency between the hatchet job that somebody did on Ralph Wilson, in a neighboring city, the day he died, and somebody extolling the virtues of journalism in covering an story as significant as the passing of Ralph Wilson. You really can't see a huge difference between these articles? Really? Simon isn't a sports writer, he is an arts entertainment writer. He is doing his job, of critiquing the local media coverage of the passing of Ralph Wilson. Edited April 1, 2014 by Buftex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 Buftex is right as usual. What is the problem with this? I agree with Jeff Simon that print media covers certain things better. For me, I have to read the paper every day to kind of hit the reset button. Especially when it's a big story...........The bigger the story, the more information out there - the less I know the story.............There's this thing online talking about this part of the story. This one about how many are missing. Etc. Etc.............And, I'm always like "What is the timeline of this !@#$ing story?!?" The paper usually does a better job of resetting the whole thing for you..........And, it did a great job with that full section on Ralph Wilson. I don't know if Jeremy2020 is Jeremy White, because although I'm a big fan of Brad Riter, he did some social media stuff on this today and it's getting tiring. Jeremy2020 thinks the News has a horrendous track record of covering the Bills? Larry Felser was the #1 Bills writer, then passed the baton to Vic Carucci, who then passed it to Mark Gaughan.............They are/were all GREAT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Flutie Band Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 AWFUL headline their blatant self-aggrandizement is in very poor taste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted April 1, 2014 Author Share Posted April 1, 2014 Jeremy2020 thinks the News has a horrendous track record of covering the Bills? Larry Felser was the #1 Bills writer, then passed the baton to Vic Carucci, who then passed it to Mark Gaughan.............They are/were all GREAT I would have to disagree that Mark Gaughan is on the same level as Felser and Carruci. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 I do think Mark Gaughan is great. IMO, what he writes - you can take it to the bank. I remember the first time I noticed that was when Peerless Price was considered a bust in his 2nd year. He used to have a great Q&A column on Fridays that I thought would be hokey, but it turned out that he would give serious opinions in that..........Somebody asked about PP and he said don't worry about him. He's going to be very good. The next year, Price busted out big time. The latest example was when he mentioned that the Toronto series looked doomed soon after the game, I knew it was done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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