Captain Caveman Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 (edited) Everyone's dancing around the question like Ali. Would you prefer that your son is gay? Yes or no. I have three daughters and I'm pretty sure I won't be having anymore children. My 14 and 12 year olds appear to be straight. The little one is only two so I'm not sure about her yet. If any of them were gay I'd obviously still love them. I won't be happy about it, though. Not dancing around the question at all. I don't actively want my son to be straight or gay. I want him to be who he is. If he's gay I will not be disappointed, and I'll be proud if he feels comfortable being himself. If you don't understand that then it's not worth explaining further. Edited February 12, 2014 by Captain Caveman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 (edited) I know that this wasn't directed at me, but I hope my son lives in a world where he can be himself, as long as he treats others as he would want to be treated. I get tired of hearing this. Don't you think we have a little too much "being oneself" as the most important quality people want out of the world. What if he likes to be treated like crap and disrespects himself? Would you be accepting of that? Of course, he is then (by you account) free to do the same to others. Are there any rules applied to what you said? Isn't everybody, by what you are saying, free to make up their own set of social rules then? What's next then? I am not usually a slippery slope guy, but where does one's sole purpose to be themselves end? Are the plural marriage people going to start pressing. You know, they are just being themselves. Edited February 12, 2014 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Juronimo – Dear Lord.. Tim- Go ahead. Explain your motivation for the post about how "ole Sam", an openly gay college athlete, isn't so courageous after all and the "cynic" (not to be confused with the now reformed homophobe in you) is skeptical that ole Sam would have come out after the draft. Where were you going with that one? I'm sure that post emanated from a place of love seeing as you've changed your ways. Your complete 180 on the issue in only 2 short years is nothing short of remarkable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I get tired of hearing this. Don't you think we have a little too much "being oneself" as the most important quality people want out of the world. What if he likes to be treated like crap and disrespects himself? Would you be accepting of that? Of course, he is then (by you account) free to do the same to others. Are there any rules applied to what you said? Isn't everybody, by what you are saying, free to make up their own set of social rules then? What's next then? I am not usually a slippery slope guy, but where does one's sole purpose to be themselves end? Are the plural marriage people going to start pressing. You know, they are just being themselves. You're reaching real !@#$ing far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Not dancing around the question at all. I don't actively want my son to be straight or gay. I want him to be who he is. If he's gay I will not be disappointed, and I'll be proud if he feels comfortable being himself. If you don't understand that then it's not worth explaining further. I understand that. But, where do you draw the line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numark Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I understand that. But, where do you draw the line? What line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I understand that. But, where do you draw the line? I draw the line at treating other people poorly. It's an easy line to draw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 What line The one which demarcates unconditional parental love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 What line probably spiraling towards a beerball intervention again or possible move to PPP... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I understand that. But, where do you draw the line? You teach your kids to act ethically, and to respect others and expect the same from them, and you let them be themselves by discovering their own identity including whom they love, what they have gifts for, and how they can best make contributions to the world. The sh-- is hard but this isn't a real Rubik's cube of a puzzle here that you're making it out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 You're reaching real !@#$ing far. IMO, not really. It has always been my stance. You want that societal line just pushed far enough that it benefits what you feel is important and then have it stop. Where are the limits? You've expressed belief in a society that appears to have no limits. Just an unlimitless ability to make oneself feel that they can be themselves. IMO, that is a dangerous, open ended road to go down. A road that cares only about oneself and doesn't think of others in society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 IMO, not really. It has always been my stance. You want that societal line just pushed far enough that it benefits what you feel is important and then have it stop. Where are the limits? You've expressed belief in a society that appears to have no limits. Just an unlimitless ability to make oneself feel that they can be themselves. IMO, that is a dangerous, open ended road to go down. A road that cares only about oneself and doesn't think of others in society. That is not at all what he is saying. And as a close personal friend of CC believe me you are really reaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 (edited) I get tired of hearing this. Don't you think we have a little too much "being oneself" as the most important quality people want out of the world. What if he likes to be treated like crap and disrespects himself? Would you be accepting of that? Of course, he is then (by you account) free to do the same to others. Are there any rules applied to what you said? Isn't everybody, by what you are saying, free to make up their own set of social rules then? What's next then? I am not usually a slippery slope guy, but where does one's sole purpose to be themselves end? Are the plural marriage people going to start pressing. You know, they are just being themselves. If my earlier post needs elaboration, here's why I think you're reaching real far. I hope and assume that my son and any other future offspring will grow up without wanting to be treated poorly. Because that's not a thing. I'm not saying it can't happen, I'm saying it's far down the list of things I'm worried about. Far, far !@#$ing down. Edited February 12, 2014 by Captain Caveman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numark Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 IMO, not really. It has always been my stance. You want that societal line just pushed far enough that it benefits what you feel is important and then have it stop. Where are the limits? You've expressed belief in a society that appears to have no limits. Just an unlimitless ability to make oneself feel that they can be themselves. IMO, that is a dangerous, open ended road to go down. A road that cares only about oneself and doesn't think of others in society. How about humans? That's an easy line to draw. Marrying another human is the line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 IMO, not really. It has always been my stance. You want that societal line just pushed far enough that it benefits what you feel is important and then have it stop. Where are the limits? You've expressed belief in a society that appears to have no limits. Just an unlimitless ability to make oneself feel that they can be themselves. IMO, that is a dangerous, open ended road to go down. A road that cares only about oneself and doesn't think of others in society. bull ****. The limit is, don't cause harm to others. Hopefully, do one better and help others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Therein lies the problem. You people believe it's normal. I don't. Maybe it's because I never dealt with the problem first hand. I don't have any gay friends or family members and I come from a very big family. My views may be outdated, but that's just me. I'm old school and I believe old school morals are better than today's, except for the racism. Homosexuality, to me, is a sickness that can't be cured. People are born with various conditions and that's just one of them. That's how I look at it. It still ain't "the norm". PS. Speaking for team hetero, I'd like to thank all the straight people in my past for my very existence. I'm glad you were who you were and made me what I am today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Yeah, this is definitely going into PPP territory. So, as a tweener, which team does Sam have the best chance of excelling on? Seattle? NE? What about a team that isn't already good? Could the Bills use him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 You teach your kids to act ethically, and to respect others and expect the same from them, and you let them be themselves by discovering their own identity including whom they love, what they have gifts for, and how they can best make contributions to the world. The sh-- is hard but this isn't a real Rubik's cube of a puzzle here that you're making it out to be. I disagree. It is a real Rubik's Cube puzzle. Take a close look @ all the drama people go through. Playing devil's advocate here, many people believe certain sexual relationships are disrespecting. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sodbuster Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 (edited) Let me ask you this one question. If you had a first born child on the way would you want him to be gay? If/when I have kids, as long as they are Bills fans, I want them to be happy. As happy as a Bills fan can be. Edit-No fat chicks though. I draw the line there. Edited February 12, 2014 by sodbuster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Yeah, this is definitely going into PPP territory. So, as a tweener, which team does Sam have the best chance of excelling on? Seattle? NE? What about a team that isn't already good? Could the Bills use him? I hear you and I will stop pressing. Mods, please delete my posts if I crossed the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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