Dibs Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Convinced they like to screw the Bills over by putting guys in the Pro Bowl who do not deserve it like Dareus and Kyle Williams. Not even close, they can't stop the run, and Kyle Williams is most overrated player in football. He is awful. In the 8 years he has been on the Bills the highest against the run the Bills were was 24th, and usually they are 28 and higher. He is so overmatched. He would not start for any other team. His production you see has the smallest impact of any player I can think of. If you had a WAR stat like in baseball his would be ZERO!!! No impact at all. He does not deserve it either. Neither did Peters on some years here, or Ruben Brown too from years back. For all that you say,he still has NO impact at all on a game, He is an insignificant player for the Bills. He means nothing at all in reality on the field when it comes to stopping the run and winning. Longest tenured player, and a representative of a losing history. Might as well trade him or cut him, and I know he would not be a starter elsewhere. Stop sucking on that lemon & put your teeth back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 No mention of Byrd not deserving of it? He's the guy in the middle of a contract nightmare and gets voted after missing 1/3 of the season. While his statistical ranking according to many websites might have him a bit overrated, the other remarks are just ridiculous. Byrd in the PB is a joke. And it assures us that his agent will pull him out of town for even bigger $$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armchair GM Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) Hate to say it, but the OP is right...to a point, regardless of how much he comes off as a d-bag troll. The fact of the matter is that our run D gets gashed wayyyy too often and, to the only point that has any merit, a great run D starts with the DL. Don't get me wrong, I'm not agreeing wholeheartedly as I believe the opposite of KW. He IS, in fact, a very good DL. The problem is that we have 2 guys that are essentially the same type of player. We lack that big body in the middle to demand a double team so as to free up the other man. If you plug that type of player into our DL KW and MD are even better. With that said, OP, if you "know" so many things "for a fact," why aren't you employed in the NFL? Seems to me that anyone with your kind of "knowledge" would be in high demand in many NFL circles. Edited January 22, 2014 by Armchair GM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipster19 Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Um, aren't I the OP?? Lol! Seriously though, one thing that I liked hearing, and I can't ever remember hearing a Bills' coach say this, is what Marrone said the other day in an interview. He stated that we are in position to draft the best player available due to our roster situation. If that means that we would be willing to draft a space eating DT to help our poor run defense then so be it. Marrone said that he's a offensive minded guy but then gave a little chuckle like he doesn't expect to draft for offense only leads me to believe that he is expecting to draft for defense. Either way I'm finally regaining hope that this franchise/team is trending in the right direction. I 'm hoping and expecting good things for this upcoming season, hence "The Stampede is on!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armchair GM Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Um, aren't I the OP?? Lol! Seriously though, one thing that I liked hearing, and I can't ever remember hearing a Bills' coach say this, is what Marrone said the other day in an interview. He stated that we are in position to draft the best player available due to our roster situation. If that means that we would be willing to draft a space eating DT to help our poor run defense then so be it. Marrone said that he's a offensive minded guy but then gave a little chuckle like he doesn't expect to draft for offense only leads me to believe that he is expecting to draft for defense. Either way I'm finally regaining hope that this franchise/team is trending in the right direction. I 'm hoping and expecting good things for this upcoming season, hence "The Stampede is on!" My bad...i got flustered reading that puke and forgot about anything anyone else said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Not even close, they can't stop the run, and Kyle Williams is most overrated player in football. He is awful. In the 8 years he has been on the Bills the highest against the run the Bills were was 24th, and usually they are 28 and higher. He is so overmatched. He would not start for any other team. His production you see has the smallest impact of any player I can think of. If you had a WAR stat like in baseball his would be ZERO!!! No impact at all. WOW sounds like a Jets fan to me !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Security Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 WOW sounds like a Jets fan to me !! Bills fan that is sick of losing, and I do not support the keeping of overrated players and paying them. WAR - Wins against replacement. 49-79 is the Bills record in 8 years Kyle Williams has been here. That is 6 wins a year. He is not a valuable player at all. The Bills average being 28th against the rush during that time. He adds ZERO value to this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckinny Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Bills fan that is sick of losing, and I do not support the keeping of overrated players and paying them. WAR - Wins against replacement. 49-79 is the Bills record in 8 years Kyle Williams has been here. That is 6 wins a year. He is not a valuable player at all. The Bills average being 28th against the rush during that time. He adds ZERO value to this team. by that logic we should purge the whole roster and start from the ground up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkAF43 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Security has to just be a troll out to stir up garbage. K. Williams made the pro bowl because his PEERS deemed him to be worthy of it. so unless you have some inside position with the NFL that none of us know about, this is just irrelevant nonsense from someone just spouting off at the mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Security Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 by that logic we should purge the whole roster and start from the ground up! No, it just means you have no logic understanding at all. Seriously, 1 guy, here 8 years, on the DLINE, and the DLINE stinks, and you can't make any kind of a logical differentiation? It is not even close to saying everyone else stinks. It is saying he is overrated, and his performance in the field is insignificant, and he is EXTREMELY replaceable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dog Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Convinced they like to screw the Bills over by putting guys in the Pro Bowl who do not deserve it like Dareus and Kyle Williams. The Forum Name Security, because you have your back to the game all the time and can't see what's happening? Um, aren't I the OP?? Lol! Seriously though, one thing that I liked hearing, and I can't ever remember hearing a Bills' coach say this, is what Marrone said the other day in an interview. He stated that we are in position to draft the best player available due to our roster situation. If that means that we would be willing to draft a space eating DT to help our poor run defense then so be it. Marrone said that he's a offensive minded guy but then gave a little chuckle like he doesn't expect to draft for offense only leads me to believe that he is expecting to draft for defense. Either way I'm finally regaining hope that this franchise/team is trending in the right direction. I 'm hoping and expecting good things for this upcoming season, hence "The Stampede is on!" Agreed, GO BILLS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir andrew Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Spags, is that you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsurdam Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Not even close, they can't stop the run, and Kyle Williams is most overrated player in football. He is awful. In the 8 years he has been on the Bills the highest against the run the Bills were was 24th, and usually they are 28 and higher. He is so overmatched. He would not start for any other team. His production you see has the smallest impact of any player I can think of. If you had a WAR stat like in baseball his would be ZERO!!! No impact at all. YOU ARE DELLUSIONAL... KYLE WILLIAMS WOULD BE A STARTER ON MOST ANY TEAM IN THE LEAGUE... STOP BEING A HATER !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) Bills fan that is sick of losing, and I do not support the keeping of overrated players and paying them. WAR - Wins against replacement. 49-79 is the Bills record in 8 years Kyle Williams has been here. That is 6 wins a year. He is not a valuable player at all. The Bills average being 28th against the rush during that time. He adds ZERO value to this team. Here's your metrics: According to Football Outsiders’ game-charting numbers, only Geno Atkins and Ndamukong Suh had more quarterback hurries among defensive tackles, and only J.J. Watt allowed fewer average yards on run tackles among defensive linemen in 2012, working with Wanny. Edited January 22, 2014 by TakeYouToTasker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jukester Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 and Kyle Williams He would not start for any other team. That statement alone invalidates everything else you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Security Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Bills still were awful against the run.............AGAIN!!!! Were they not? THey also played 8 games, half of them, against god awful running teams! Saints were 25th in the NFL at 92.1 yards a game! You know who averaged less per game? Almost everyone the Bills played!!! Saints 25th Dolphins 26th Dolphins 26th Steelers 27th Browns 28th Ravens 30th Jaguars 31st Falcons 32nd WHatever advanced metrics someone showed that the Bills were actually good against the run, take a look at the that!! They played crappy teams, and STILL sucked at stopping the run, and Kyle Williams is an overrated non factor in the middle like he has always been. That statement alone invalidates everything else you say. Prove the proven stats I have shown to be wrong, like this years stats, and the fact that the best the Bills ever were against the run while he was on the team was 22nd, his rookie year, where he did not play as much. The Bills averaged about 28th against the run with him in the middle. He is a non factor. He would not start on any team.................THAT CARES ABOUT STOPPING THE RUN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) Bills still were awful against the run.............AGAIN!!!! Were they not? THey also played 8 games, half of them, against god awful running teams! Saints were 25th in the NFL at 92.1 yards a game! You know who averaged less per game? Almost everyone the Bills played!!! Saints 25th Dolphins 26th Dolphins 26th Steelers 27th Browns 28th Ravens 30th Jaguars 31st Falcons 32nd WHatever advanced metrics someone showed that the Bills were actually good against the run, take a look at the that!! They played crappy teams, and STILL sucked at stopping the run, and Kyle Williams is an overrated non factor in the middle like he has always been. Prove the proven stats I have shown to be wrong, like this years stats, and the fact that the best the Bills ever were against the run while he was on the team was 22nd, his rookie year, where he did not play as much. The Bills averaged about 28th against the run with him in the middle. He is a non factor. He would not start on any team.................THAT CARES ABOUT STOPPING THE RUN Again, I just provided you with the advanced metrics used to evaluate defensive line play. Kyle Williams allowed the second fewest yards per run play, run in his gap assignments, out of all defensive linemen in 2012, behind only JJ Watt. While dominating in the run game, he also managed to rank third amongst DTs in QB pressures. Your counter argument has nothing at all to do with individual metrics, and instead focuses on a blanket examination of total team statistics, and seeks to blame Williams for defensive breakdowns on plays that weren't run at him. How does that make any sense at all? Edited January 23, 2014 by TakeYouToTasker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Security Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Again, I just provided you with the advanced metrics used to evaluate defensive line play. Kyle Williams allowed the second fewest yards per run play, run in his gap assignments, out of all defensive linemen in 2012, behind only JJ Watt. While dominating in the run game, he also managed to rank third amongst DTs in QB pressures. You're counter argument has nothing at all to do with individual metrics, and instead focuses on a blanket examination of total team statistics, and seeks to blame Williams for defensive breakdowns on plays that weren't run at him. How does that make any sense at all? JJ Watt is a defensive tackle, you know very little to even try to compare the two. Your Interior defensive lineman are obviously the key to stopping the run, your stats don't even make sense. Try again. Kyle WIlliams has proved to be a non factor, he has no impact at all. You list things about him that have no impact on the game at all. In 8 entire NFL seasons, he has 3, THAT IS THREE, forced fumbles. Turnovers and 3rd down stops make the NFL work, and stopping the run, and he sucks at all those things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 JJ Watt is a defensive tackle, you know very little to even try to compare the two. Your Interior defensive lineman are obviously the key to stopping the run, your stats don't even make sense. Try again. Kyle WIlliams has proved to be a non factor, he has no impact at all. You list things about him that have no impact on the game at all. In 8 entire NFL seasons, he has 3, THAT IS THREE, forced fumbles. Turnovers and 3rd down stops make the NFL work, and stopping the run, and he sucks at all those things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) JJ Watt is a defensive tackle, you know very little to even try to compare the two. Your Interior defensive lineman are obviously the key to stopping the run, your stats don't even make sense. Try again. Kyle WIlliams has proved to be a non factor, he has no impact at all. You list things about him that have no impact on the game at all. In 8 entire NFL seasons, he has 3, THAT IS THREE, forced fumbles. Turnovers and 3rd down stops make the NFL work, and stopping the run, and he sucks at all those things. Good grief... JJ Watt is a hybrid defense tackle who gets moved around the line, exactly like... wait for it... Kyle Williams. As for what the job of interior linemen is, that depends, like everything else in football, on the scheme. Kyle Williams' coaches, after evaluating Kyle, have decided not to use him to soak up blockers. This is a concious decision his coaches have expressed in many interviews. The reason for this being that the ability to consistantly dominate a man 1-1 in a gap is so rare, that when you find a player who can do exactly that, you create schemes which free him up to do so. You don't waste the talents of a Kyle Williams, and turn him into Tony Siragusa, whose only "skill" was being fat and strong. As for the things I have listed having no impact? Really? Pressuring the quarterback has no impact? Being among the best in the league at stoping running plays in your gap assignment has no impact? His Career Weighted Approximate Value ranks him 41st amongst all players in the NFL over the course of his career. So here's what it boils down to: I have the advanced metrics you were clamoring for earlier in the thread. When examinded they decimate your argument. Your argument is based on feelings rather than numbers. Edited January 22, 2014 by TakeYouToTasker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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