BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 As usual, an emotionally charged situation brings out those who are all about enhancing their "freedom" at the expense of "yours". "The Second Amendment is outdated". In a place where ridiculous statements are made EVERY day, there are few that could possibly trump this one. I'm not surprised it was made by someone with so little life experience. Your children are FAR more likely to be killed by a drunk driver or in a bicycle accident than they are with a firearm. Not that the mass media will ever tell you that. Nor are they likely to report the 3,000-8,000 times EVERY DAY (depending on whose figures you believe) that a private citizen protects their property using a privately owned handgun. Instead, they concentrate on stories of that will whip you into a frenzy (not unlike the Randy Moss faux pants dropping) and you buy into it hook, line, and sinker. Currently there are about 2000 citizens per police officer in this country. You don't want to own a firearm, that's fine - good luck with "Dial a Prayer". Just don't tell me the 2nd Amendment is less relevent because it's quite the contrary. The right to protect ones' self and property is fundamental. If you don't believe me, go watch Hotel Rwanda. Big picture people. Leave myopia to the bureaucrats. 201785[/snapback] I agree. I do however feel that there needs to be a better background check system in place. It's too easy for someone to buy a gun that shouldn't have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 As usual, an emotionally charged situation brings out those who are all about enhancing their "freedom" at the expense of "yours". "The Second Amendment is outdated". In a place where ridiculous statements are made EVERY day, there are few that could possibly trump this one. I'm not surprised it was made by someone with so little life experience. Your children are FAR more likely to be killed by a drunk driver or in a bicycle accident than they are with a firearm. Not that the mass media will ever tell you that. Nor are they likely to report the 3,000-8,000 times EVERY DAY (depending on whose figures you believe) that a private citizen protects their property using a privately owned handgun. Instead, they concentrate on stories of that will whip you into a frenzy (not unlike the Randy Moss faux pants dropping) and you buy into it hook, line, and sinker. Currently there are about 2000 citizens per police officer in this country. You don't want to own a firearm, that's fine - good luck with "Dial a Prayer". Just don't tell me the 2nd Amendment is less relevent because it's quite the contrary. The right to protect ones' self and property is fundamental. If you don't believe me, go watch Hotel Rwanda. Big picture people. Leave myopia to the bureaucrats. 201785[/snapback] Alaska, I agree with a lot of this....I will not be....nor will my family be...victims hoping that the police arrive in time to save us......everyone except for my 9 year old daughter knows how to handle a firearm (and she will to when she gets older) I have a ADT system on my house, a "safe room" that basically is my own bedroom with very strong oak door and one window that cannot be accessed from the outside without great difficulty (this is also where my firearms are kept) I also have large dogs who love my family but are not overly fond of anyone else (unless we choose them to be) I take my families security very seriously....it is too bad that there are folks out there that simply are not smart with HOW they handle their weapons.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Alaska, I agree with a lot of this....I will not be....nor will my family be...victims hoping that the police arrive in time to save us......everyone except for my 9 year old daughter knows how to handle a firearm (and she will to when she gets older) I have a ADT system on my house, a "safe room" that basically is my own bedroom with very strong oak door and one window that cannot be accessed from the outside without great difficulty (this is also where my firearms are kept) I also have large dogs who love my family but are not overly fond of anyone else (unless we choose them to be) I take my families security very seriously....it is too bad that there are folks out there that simply are not smart with HOW they handle their weapons.... 201801[/snapback] You sound like you live in a friggin bunker waiting for Charlie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 You sound like you live in a friggin bunker waiting for Charlie. 201806[/snapback] Chance favors the prepared man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 I agree. I do however feel that there needs to be a better background check system in place. It's too easy for someone to buy a gun that shouldn't have one. 201798[/snapback] Not many criminals or unstable people buy guns legally. The world is awash in guns and criminals don't care much about laws - or they wouldn't be criminals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ofiba Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Chance favors the prepared man. 201809[/snapback] Kevin McCallister didn't even need a gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Not many criminals or unstable people buy guns legally. The world is awash in guns and criminals don't care much about laws - or they wouldn't be criminals. 201812[/snapback] Well let's put it this way. A friend of mine loves guns and owns several, but he's the type of guy that will go out at night and shoot stop signs and stuff. He's not a criminal, but let's be honest, should someone like that really be the owner of handguns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Kevin McCallister didn't even need a gun. 201816[/snapback] Please tell me you're not talking about "Home Alone". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Well let's put it this way. A friend of mine loves guns and owns several, but he's the type of guy that will go out at night and shoot stop signs and stuff. He's not a criminal, but let's be honest, should someone like that really be the owner of handguns? 201820[/snapback] I'm sure you've reported his behavior to the proper authorities, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Chance favors the prepared man. 201809[/snapback] I agree, but that doesn't mean I need to do all that on the 1 in a million shot that something ever does happen. Owning a handgun and knowing how to use it is enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 I agree, but that doesn't mean I need to do all that on the 1 in a million shot that something ever does happen. Owning a handgun and knowing how to use it is enough for me. 201826[/snapback] Everyone has their limit. Most change as their lives go on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 I'm sure you've reported his behavior to the proper authorities, right? 201825[/snapback] I've never been along and actually saw him do it. He's just told me about it. I won't report something I didn't see with my own two eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ofiba Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Please tell me you're not talking about "Home Alone". 201822[/snapback] Haha, yes I am, but I'm not actually suggesting that people should stock their homes with paint cans and hot wheels cars instead of guns. Your quote about being prepared simply reminded me of the movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Haha, yes I am, but I'm not actually suggesting that people should stock their homes with paint cans and hot wheels cars instead of guns. Your quote about being prepared simply reminded me of the movie. 201829[/snapback] Fair enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Fair enough. 201831[/snapback] Hey I think he did use a BB gun though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Hey I think he did use a BB gun though 201833[/snapback] If he'd been trained with his dad's 12 gauge, it'd have been a VERY short movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 If he'd been trained with his dad's 12 gauge, it'd have been a VERY short movie. 201836[/snapback] And little kids everywhere would still be having nightmares of the Wet Bandits getting blasted They would end up like the star of the movie. Now that kid is one screwed up adult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ofiba Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 If he'd been trained with his dad's 12 gauge, it'd have been a VERY short movie. 201836[/snapback] Yeah but we'd all have to live without Home Alone 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Yeah but we'd all have to live without Home Alone 2. 201842[/snapback] Waiting for the downside... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 You'll live to be 90. 201768[/snapback] Actually, barring unnatural death (suicide, war, car accident, etc.) no one in my family has ever died before their 90th birthday, going back to my great-grandparents on both sides. Save for the whole mental-illness thing, I've got great genes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 I agree, but that doesn't mean I need to do all that on the 1 in a million shot that something ever does happen. Owning a handgun and knowing how to use it is enough for me. 201826[/snapback] You dont need to BF...that is just my own decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Actually, barring unnatural death (suicide, war, car accident, etc.) no one in my family has ever died before their 90th birthday, going back to my great-grandparents on both sides. Save for the whole mental-illness thing, I've got great genes. 201847[/snapback] Good. Buy a revolver. I recommend a .38 special, 4 inch barrel. No nighttime flash blindness like a .357. No jams like a semi. Buy Cor-Bon or Mag-Safe ammunition. Don't wave it around like a wand if you have need to bring it to battery. Keep it close. Don't point it as a threat. Point then shoot. Ya never know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Syracuse Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Tens of thousands of crimes are prevented each year by people having tha ability to defend themselves. If your concern is tragic, accidental death, support the reduction of the National speed limit to 20 mph. Much much larger saving of life. Ban buckets of water. We have a kid's bike helmet law here. But more kids die simply walking on the pavement and falling down. Ban childhood walking. 201656[/snapback] How many kids and innocent people need to die in the name of crime prevention? If we prevent 5 buglaries, is that worth the death of a 9 year old. I'm curious to know what your ratio of dead kids to crimes prevented is. This is the most idiotic justification for gun ownership I've ever heard. An no, I'm not anti-gun. I started hunting when I was twelve and have owned every type of gun imaginable. NONE OF THEM, ever sat in the house loaded. You want to stop this nonsense, prosecute the father. He's as guilty as his child. Morons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 if they didnt have access to guns, and only a VERY few, well background checked, well psychologically tested few could buy guns, how many people would still be alive? You mean if we severely restrict legal gun sales to a priveleged few, then the bad people won't be able to get guns any more!? If I may quote you directly "Your idea is great, if only it was the way things are" I'm not eager for the day when the only people who have guns are those with criminal connections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper13 Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 The story in the first post of this topic happened three blocks from my house. In the 10 years that I have lived here, not one house has been ever broken into in the entire neighborhood. So having a gun in this area to protect against buglars is 100% ridiculous. Second, the guy is a prosecutor for Erie County. The Erie County Sherriff's Department provides anybody with child proof locks for guns kept in a house, will store a persons guns for up to 10 years free of charge or will come to your house and remove any guns free of charge. This was a horrible tragedy that could have easily been prevented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 The story in the first post of this topic happened three blocks from my house. In the 10 years that I have lived here, not one house has been ever broken into in the entire neighborhood. So having a gun in this area to protect against buglars is 100% ridiculous. Second, the guy is a prosecutor for Erie County. The Erie County Sherriff's Department provides anybody with child proof locks for guns kept in a house, will store a persons guns for up to 10 years free of charge or will come to your house and remove any guns free of charge. This was a horrible tragedy that could have easily been prevented. 201924[/snapback] Everyone who doesn't own guns or think that it's OK to regulate how other people own theirs should simply place a sign in their yard. Something to the affect of "Attention Criminals: There are no guns in this house" should suffice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 How many kids and innocent people need to die in the name of crime prevention? If we prevent 5 buglaries, is that worth the death of a 9 year old. I'm curious to know what your ratio of dead kids to crimes prevented is. This is the most idiotic justification for gun ownership I've ever heard. An no, I'm not anti-gun. I started hunting when I was twelve and have owned every type of gun imaginable. NONE OF THEM, ever sat in the house loaded. You want to stop this nonsense, prosecute the father. He's as guilty as his child. Morons 201899[/snapback] Faulty logic, Mike. We're not talking about preventing simple burglaries. Believe it or not, when they say privately held firearms are used to prevent between 750K and 3,000,000 crimes annually, they aren't always talking about some homeless guy who wants a little spare change for hooch. Sometimes it's a rapist, pedophile, kidnapper, murderer, etc. The world is a screwed up place. This guy isn't the enemy and not all "tragedies" are preventable. Given a choice between only the bad guys being armed and occasionally having something like this happen, it's pretty darn easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Fergy Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 I'm kind of torn on the issue of gun control. On one hand I don't want to see the right to bear arms taken away, but on the other let's face it, a lot of people are too stupid to have a firearm. 201623[/snapback] I agree. Thousands more have been killed by auto's, knifes, alcohol, bathtubs etc GET IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Good. Buy a revolver. I recommend a .38 special, 4 inch barrel. No nighttime flash blindness like a .357. No jams like a semi. Buy Cor-Bon or Mag-Safe ammunition. Don't wave it around like a wand if you have need to bring it to battery. Keep it close. Don't point it as a threat. Point then shoot. Ya never know... 201877[/snapback] Judging the relative risk of me shooting myself versus someone else killing me because I didn't have a gun...I'm safer not owning one. That's not a condemnation of guns, just a simple risk analysis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dundy249 Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Oh, come on, how often does THAT happen?!?! And who's to say that if the father's gun didn't have a lock on it, one of the kids wouldn't have already shot someone with it. I'm all for the right to bear arms, but gun safety has to be first and foremost to those gun owners. 201647[/snapback] The statistics are to say. Only 48 deaths of children related to guns last year??? Its not the guns that are unsafe but the parents lack of discipline and safety training with their children. I grew up in PA with a Gun cabinet full of guns. We kept the key on top of the cabinet. I was taught the safety rules of handling guns and by some amazing act of God am still alive!!!Geesh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Judging the relative risk of me shooting myself versus someone else killing me because I didn't have a gun...I'm safer not owning one. That's not a condemnation of guns, just a simple risk analysis. 201960[/snapback] Then that's the best direction. I'm counting on you to re-found (is that a word?) the Algonquin Club, anyway.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 You dont need to BF...that is just my own decision. 201860[/snapback] Oh I totally agree it's personal preference, it was more of a joke (the original comment about charlie) and we just got to discussing personal preference. I don't even own a handgun nor do I feel I need one, but some people do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 Oh I totally agree it's personal preference, it was more of a joke (the original comment about charlie) and we just got to discussing personal preference. I don't even own a handgun nor do I feel I need one, but some people do. 202113[/snapback] I wasn't offended by the charlie comment.... That is even before my time.....in my ware it was those damn Iraqi's I actually keep having reoccuring dreams of the end of the world and having to fight off the massive undead horde from eating all of my K rations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 I wasn't offended by the charlie comment.... That is even before my time.....in my ware it was those damn Iraqi's I actually keep having reoccuring dreams of the end of the world and having to fight off the massive undead horde from eating all of my K rations 202117[/snapback] HAHAHAHA you just gave me a good laugh John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussiew Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 If teaching gun safety to children were all that is neccesary to keep them safe in their home - then how is it that experienced adult hunters still manage to injure or kill themselves (and each other) every hunting season? I think the parents are responsible for this one. I would NEVER leave a loaded gun accessible anywhere in my house with 4 kids unde 17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 If teaching gun safety to children were all that is neccesary to keep them safe in their home - then how is it that experienced adult hunters still manage to injure or kill themselves (and each other) every hunting season? I think the parents are responsible for this one. I would NEVER leave a loaded gun accessible anywhere in my house with 4 kids unde 17. 202141[/snapback] The same reason people still fall off ladders, back over their children, hit themselves with hammers, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin in Va Beach Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 The same reason people still fall off ladders, back over their children, hit themselves with hammers, etc. 202151[/snapback] The 'Schit Happens" Theory. Not to worry though, government programs and legislation can save us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 11, 2005 Share Posted January 11, 2005 The 'Schit Happens" Theory. Not to worry though, government programs and legislation can save us! 202174[/snapback] I really wish they wouldn't. Like it's not obvious the herd needs culling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashfruit Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 i could see havin a loaded gun handy if they lived on fillmore but lancaster? i blame no one but the parents. how do you not teach your 16 year son the danger of a rifle, look keep the gun if you feel safe with it but now what happened because you didnt take the time to do it right, a dead girl and a kid whos life is gonna be screwed up forever. they should also interrogate the sh*t outta him too in case this wasnt an accident, its not unheard of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 i could see havin a loaded gun handy if they lived on fillmore but lancaster? i blame no one but the parents. how do you not teach your 16 year son the danger of a rifle, look keep the gun if you feel safe with it but now what happened because you didnt take the time to do it right, a dead girl and a kid whos life is gonna be screwed up forever. they should also interrogate the sh*t outta him too in case this wasnt an accident, its not unheard of. 202197[/snapback] How do you know they didn't teach them? You do EVERYTHING your parents ever told you when they weren't around to put a foot in your ass? Yeah, I didn't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts