OK....its obvious to me where we go with that first pick

[bisonbrigade]

Sorry, but I couldn't disagree with you more. Fitz is absolutely the reason we lost today. Besides the fluke extra point.

 

His two interceptions were horrible throws at a time when the game should have been put away. He also missed a wide open long TD to Nelson in the final 6 minutes. You can't ask a guy to be perfect, I get that. But there were 3 very specific plays, where any average QB in the league would have made those throws, and the Bills win.

 

I'm not a Fitz basher and he is our best choice right now. But he lost this game.

The defense is the problem, not Fitz. No pass rush, no picks, no turnovers, can't stop the run. Totaly worthless. Fitzpatrick and Steve Johnson was the whole team basically, otherwise the score would be 22-0.

[akm0404]

And there a good number of posters here who blindly believe that the only position of value on an NFL team is the QB.

 

They ignore the fact that the defense can't generate a pass rush, can't stop the running game, and can't cover TEs.

 

They also ignore the value of a QB who can throw under pressure, can convert 3rd downs, and can acutally read a defense (something that has been lacking in Buffalo QBs since Jim Kelly).

 

Give an honest answer, if Cutler had to face the pressure that Fitz faced in this game, do the Bears win?

Um, Cutler plays behind an offensive line that is widely regarded as WORSE than the Bills line, and yet he actually wins some games.

 

While the value of converting third downs and keeping a team in a game exists, there is more value in not consistently choking away game after game with blundering turnovers.

 

And yes, quarterback is the literal most important in any organized team sport. Period. The teams that compete for championships consistently are, with hardly any exceptions, the teams that get elite-level play from their quarterback.

 

Not 'good enough to convert a third down and keep the team in the game until a crippling interception'. Elite.

 

Spritzy is fine to keep the seat warm until we draft his replacement. He will be a wonderful backup. But unless we want to rebuild back to 7-9, we need the potential to get elite-level play from the most important guy on the field.

[Lofton80]

I agree Fitz is not the problem but I would have to take Luck if he comes out. Further if Luck comes out, he is the guy another team is going to trade up to get. If he doesn't come out, target Marcel Dareus or Da'Quan Bowers. Take the UCLA LB Ayers at top of second.

[jad1]

Um, Cutler plays behind an offensive line that is widely regarded as WORSE than the Bills line, and yet he actually wins some games.

 

Um, you are aware that Cutler threw something like 26 interceptions last seasons, and that Mike Martz offenses put a low priority on protecting the QB? Chicago isn't wining because of offense, it because of their defense. Teams that can pressure Cutler beat the Bears. The Bills couldn't apply the necessary pressure.

 

While the value of converting third downs and keeping a team in a game exists, there is more value in not consistently choking away game after game with blundering turnovers.

 

I've been a Bills fan a long time; take a look at Jim Kelly's '86 season. He choked away several games, trying to carry a pretty talentless team.

 

When the defense can generate some sacks, and hold the opposing team under, I don't know, say, 140 rushing yards a game, you won't need to rely on the QB as much in crucial situations, and then the value of converting 3rd downs and reading defenses will become more valuable.

 

And yes, quarterback is the literal most important in any organized team sport. Period. The teams that compete for championships consistently are, with hardly any exceptions, the teams that get elite-level play from their quarterback.

 

Not 'good enough to convert a third down and keep the team in the game until a crippling interception'. Elite.

 

Spritzy is fine to keep the seat warm until we draft his replacement. He will be a wonderful backup. But unless we want to rebuild back to 7-9, we need the potential to get elite-level play from the most important guy on the field.

 

I really don't know what you're saying here, because just about every 'elite' QB in this league has thrown a crippling interception (see Manning in the SB last season).

 

There has to be more to judging a QB than his interceptions. For the first time since Kelly, the Bills have a QB that can read defenses. He's not stymied by the cover 2 or the 3-4. He can make throws under pressure, which has made a bad line look decent. He gets the ball outside to the receivers. And he's actually throwing TDs.

 

No doubt the interceptions are frustating, but basing the entire evaluation on these picks considering that the team has had no running game, no pass rush, no rush defense, missed field goals and PATs, and few turnovers is unfair.

[John from Riverside]

Um, Cutler plays behind an offensive line that is widely regarded as WORSE than the Bills line, and yet he actually wins some games.

 

While the value of converting third downs and keeping a team in a game exists, there is more value in not consistently choking away game after game with blundering turnovers.

 

And yes, quarterback is the literal most important in any organized team sport. Period. The teams that compete for championships consistently are, with hardly any exceptions, the teams that get elite-level play from their quarterback.

 

Not 'good enough to convert a third down and keep the team in the game until a crippling interception'. Elite.

 

Spritzy is fine to keep the seat warm until we draft his replacement. He will be a wonderful backup. But unless we want to rebuild back to 7-9, we need the potential to get elite-level play from the most important guy on the field.

 

Excuse me but what kind of defense does he have backing him up? The Bears are VERY GOOD on defense.

 

You can "win some games" when your defense keeps giving you the ball?

 

God some fans are so fricken blind....I know that losing brings them out but for christ sake

[Special K]

That is IF they keep the pick

 

I dont know it was just something about that phrase Nix used after the draft about saying he wished he had 3 picks in every round.....

 

By the way....I dont hate Luck....might be the smart way to go....but I hope to god if they DO draft Luck they are active in free agency on offensive linemen and defense.

 

I hope they don't trade out of the number 1 pick if Luck is there....that might just cause me to give up on the Bills. That would just be disasterous, IMO.

 

I know you are a Laker fan, so think of it this way: Remember when the Hornets traded the rights to Kobe Bryant to the Lakers on draft night for Vlade Divac because the Hornets said they were in desperate need of a center? How did that work out for the Hornets?

 

I know the Bills need defensive front 7 help, but you don't pass up a franchise QB to do it.

 

I just can't imagine any team trading out of number 1 if Luck is in the draft.

[ConradDobler]

Um, you are aware that Cutler threw something like 26 interceptions last seasons, and that Mike Martz offenses put a low priority on protecting the QB? Chicago isn't wining because of offense, it because of their defense. Teams that can pressure Cutler beat the Bears. The Bills couldn't apply the necessary pressure.

 

 

 

I've been a Bills fan a long time; take a look at Jim Kelly's '86 season. He choked away several games, trying to carry a pretty talentless team.

 

When the defense can generate some sacks, and hold the opposing team under, I don't know, say, 140 rushing yards a game, you won't need to rely on the QB as much in crucial situations, and then the value of converting 3rd downs and reading defenses will become more valuable.

 

 

 

I really don't know what you're saying here, because just about every 'elite' QB in this league has thrown a crippling interception (see Manning in the SB last season).

 

There has to be more to judging a QB than his interceptions. For the first time since Kelly, the Bills have a QB that can read defenses. He's not stymied by the cover 2 or the 3-4. He can make throws under pressure, which has made a bad line look decent. He gets the ball outside to the receivers. And he's actually throwing TDs.

 

No doubt the interceptions are frustating, but basing the entire evaluation on these picks considering that the team has had no running game, no pass rush, no rush defense, missed field goals and PATs, and few turnovers is unfair.

 

Spot on. Please post more often.

[NaPolian8693]

For the first time since Kelly, the Bills have a QB that can read defenses.

 

Really? Bledsoe couldn't read a defense? Fitzpatrick probably won't even to a Flutie, but he's miles away from the caliber of player Bledsoe was.

 

Fitzpatrick can make some nice throws when he gets hot, but is inconsistent and seems to perform at his worse when the game is on the line.

[John from Riverside]

I hope they don't trade out of the number 1 pick if Luck is there....that might just cause me to give up on the Bills. That would just be disasterous, IMO.

 

I know you are a Laker fan, so think of it this way: Remember when the Hornets traded the rights to Kobe Bryant to the Lakers on draft night for Vlade Divac because the Hornets said they were in desperate need of a center? How did that work out for the Hornets?

 

I know the Bills need defensive front 7 help, but you don't pass up a franchise QB to do it.

 

I just can't imagine any team trading out of number 1 if Luck is in the draft.

 

So many other things go into the lakers winning equation......their owner pays for the top coach....the best players in free agency.....etc etc. But I do understand the Kobe reference when it comes to this.

 

I am not talking about trading out if Luck is there. I would only do that for a kinds ransom in picks which most likely would not be offered. I understand the luck pick if we have the top pick.

 

Just understand that just drafting luck will not fix the bills problems......we wont magically be better on offense with him in there...he is going to need PROTECTION or he will look just like every other QB we have put back there since Kelly....

 

Really? Bledsoe couldn't read a defense? Fitzpatrick probably won't even to a Flutie, but he's miles away from the caliber of player Bledsoe was.

 

Fitzpatrick can make some nice throws when he gets hot, but is inconsistent and seems to perform at his worse when the game is on the line.

 

I disagree...

 

The only thing Bledsoe has over Fitz is that cannon of an arm.....and people forget that he couldn't throw a screen pass to save his life.

 

Fitz also adds the undeniable ability to be able to make things happen with running ability over Bledsoe. AND if Bledsoe was behind this line he would have nowhere near the numbers Fitz is putting up.

[Wilson's Ears]

the smart thing to do here is trade out of the number one spot. we need players, and a lot of em'. one guy will not make the difference. i just don't see a clear cut guy that is deserving of the number one pick.

[ajzepp]

Really? Bledsoe couldn't read a defense?

 

Why do you think the Pats would 1) choose to go with an unknown 2nd year QB with NO experience in the playoffs during their SB run in the 2001 season, and 2) not only get rid of the guy, but trade him WITHIN THE DIVISION? It's because Belichick had no fear of Bledsoe's ability to beat him.

[akm0404]

Delusional Bills fan alert.

 

In this thread we are now seeing posters compare RYAN FITZPATRICK, a career journeyman backup to Hall of Fame quarterback Jim Kelly and potential-Hall of Famer Drew Bledsoe.

 

All while winning literally zero games, and making key game-killing blunders in several.

 

I know that it has been tough sledding over the years with some terrible quarterback play. We've seen some really bad stuff, but don't think that because Fitzpatrick may be a bit better than J.P. Losman, that he is the second coming of Joe Montana.

 

Even in his 'miracle run', Fitzpatrick is now in the bottom half of NFL quarterbacks in terms of QB Rating, the statistic that the Spritzy-lovers ran wild with when he was near the top. We are now seeing what the rational folks insisted would happen - there would be statistical correction that would end up leaving him right around his career averages when all is said and done.

 

And trust me, getting his career average performance over time isn't nearly enough to win with in the NFL, which his former teams already know.

 

Don't cut him or fire him, we all like him as a person and a player - just understand that you can't compete for championships year after year with a quarterback that consistently 'Goes on the Fritz' in the clutch.

[Bill from NYC]

The problem is that some people are under the misconception that Ryan Mallett is an "elite QB"

 

Some people lol? I suspect that millions of fans are under this impression, as well as most NFL GMs.

Almost all college QBs need to be coached up to NFL level. Mallett has extremely rare talent. He will need work, and is probably more of a gamble than Luck, but the kid is winning games in a real conference, and making throws that others are not capable of.

 

Yep....I'll call him "elite."

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

LT, LB, LB, LB, RT as first 5 picks

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

Delusional Bills fan alert.

 

In this thread we are now seeing posters compare RYAN FITZPATRICK, a career journeyman backup to Hall of Fame quarterback Jim Kelly and potential-Hall of Famer Drew Bledsoe.

 

All while winning literally zero games, and making key game-killing blunders in several.

 

I know that it has been tough sledding over the years with some terrible quarterback play. We've seen some really bad stuff, but don't think that because Fitzpatrick may be a bit better than J.P. Losman, that he is the second coming of Joe Montana.

 

Even in his 'miracle run', Fitzpatrick is now in the bottom half of NFL quarterbacks in terms of QB Rating, the statistic that the Spritzy-lovers ran wild with when he was near the top. We are now seeing what the rational folks insisted would happen - there would be statistical correction that would end up leaving him right around his career averages when all is said and done.

 

And trust me, getting his career average performance over time isn't nearly enough to win with in the NFL, which his former teams already know.

 

Don't cut him or fire him, we all like him as a person and a player - just understand that you can't compete for championships year after year with a quarterback that consistently 'Goes on the Fritz' in the clutch.

Agree with your points Fitz is not the franchise QB however there are many more serious concerns with this team right now than the play of the journeyman QB. Follow what StL did they addressed the lines and than drafted Bradford this year. Drafting a QB and putting him behind this set of tackles and he is unlikely to learn anything. Fitz plays hard and is gritty give him some protection and a defense that can hold down the other opponent and we may be able to win a couple. We probably need 2 years in the top 5 draft spots to clean up the roster we currently have.

[The Wang From Sang]

I know exactly where the Bills should draft- Best Player available reguardless of position. We really got away from this

[Tsaikotic]

I realize that Luck is the "given" #1 for the Bills if he declares this year...does anybody have any idea who the Bills should take if Luck doesn't declare?...I don't see any other QB in the next draft being a #1 talent...first round maybe, but not the #1 pick...well I guess my last statement would depend on how many other underclassmen QB's declare for the 2011 draft...but anyways, as far as I have seen by reading a few draft sites, the top rated players are mostly DE's...does anyone see Buffalo taking a DE like say, Marcell Dareus* (DE/DT, Alabama), Adrian Clayborn (DE/DT Iowa) or Allen Bailey (DE/DT, Miami)?...few draft sites I frequent have these guys rated as top 10 picks.

 

 

I'm thinking (yes that's dangerous) that one of these 3 DE's with Williams and Carrington next year might be a really nice front 3...either take Ponder in the 2nd or wait till 2012's draft for one of the top 4 QB's that year (Luck, Mallet, Gabbert and Foles)...of course those four depend on who does and doesn't declare this year.

Edited November 8, 2010 by Tsaikotic

[34-78-83]

Um, you are aware that Cutler threw something like 26 interceptions last seasons, and that Mike Martz offenses put a low priority on protecting the QB? Chicago isn't wining because of offense, it because of their defense. Teams that can pressure Cutler beat the Bears. The Bills couldn't apply the necessary pressure.

 

 

 

I've been a Bills fan a long time; take a look at Jim Kelly's '86 season. He choked away several games, trying to carry a pretty talentless team.

 

When the defense can generate some sacks, and hold the opposing team under, I don't know, say, 140 rushing yards a game, you won't need to rely on the QB as much in crucial situations, and then the value of converting 3rd downs and reading defenses will become more valuable.

 

 

 

I really don't know what you're saying here, because just about every 'elite' QB in this league has thrown a crippling interception (see Manning in the SB last season).

 

There has to be more to judging a QB than his interceptions. For the first time since Kelly, the Bills have a QB that can read defenses. He's not stymied by the cover 2 or the 3-4. He can make throws under pressure, which has made a bad line look decent. He gets the ball outside to the receivers. And he's actually throwing TDs.

 

No doubt the interceptions are frustating, but basing the entire evaluation on these picks considering that the team has had no running game, no pass rush, no rush defense, missed field goals and PATs, and few turnovers is unfair.

 

All excellent points!

[KOKBILLS]

Offensive Line and linebacker

 

- Fitz was NOT the problem today......he converts 3rd downs and makes this offense actually look NFL caliber. While he throws a bad ball her and there we also have WR's who DROP balls that hit them in the hands still. Also....he was under duress all game.

 

- I support D. Bell.....but he got his @ss handed to him today....he really did.

 

Fitz was not the problem today? Well maybe, maybe not...But the REAL question HAS to be whether or not Fitz is the ANSWER long-term if you're talking about the #1 overall Pick...Of coarse that's assuming Luck and Mallett are coming out...That's the #1 Overall Pick...You simply cannot Pass on a QB worthy of the #1 Pick when Ryan Fitzpatrick is your Starting QB...If Luck or Mallett go on to excel in the NFL and The Bills pass on BOTH of them...Oh man that's going to sting...Especially if this turns out to be Fitz's career year...

 

And Fitz may not have been the problem today, but that INT with 9 mins left and a 5 point lead sure as hell did not help...I mean...On the surface I don't necessarily disagee with you...The Bills have bigger problems than Fitz true enough...But what you HAVE to ask yourself is the same thing Buddy Nix and Chan Gaily are going to ask themselves this coming April...If Fitz can look this good in this Offense how much better will Luck or Mallett be in the same Offense...

 

This Team is looking for a new face to build behind...I promise everyone on this board the Bills don't pass on Luck at #1 Overall...It's not going to happen...Mallett maybe, but I doubt it...Every time that Kid throws the Ball Gailey probably gets goosebumps...Watch both Stanford and Arkansas...Watch the way those 2 inspire their teammates...Those two Schools are not necessarily NCAA Football powerhouses...The Bills will be looking for that kind of spark at QB IF they have the #1 Pick and IF one of those two comes out...I've been wrong plenty of times before, but I don't think there is any possible way the Bills are going to choose Fitz over either of those two young QB's...And if they do, they deserve what they get...

[Bill from NYC]

RW will order Nix to take a QB plain and simple. And that'll occur even if Luck doesn't come out.

 

I totally agree with this. Didn't Mr. Wilson order Nix to scout QBs? A high profile QB will sell tickets galore.

The thing is, this time I think Ralph is on the right track even in terms of winning football games. I think that Ryan Mallett is a literally perfect fit for this team but of course, this is simply my opinion.

[ajzepp]

Some people lol? I suspect that millions of fans are under this impression, as well as most NFL GMs.

Almost all college QBs need to be coached up to NFL level. Mallett has extremely rare talent. He will need work, and is probably more of a gamble than Luck, but the kid is winning games in a real conference, and making throws that others are not capable of.

 

Yep....I'll call him "elite."

 

He wins games, yes. But not BIG games

[drinkTHEkoolaid]

the smart thing to do here is trade out of the number one spot. we need players, and a lot of em'. one guy will not make the difference. i just don't see a clear cut guy that is deserving of the number one pick.

wow thats a pretty short sighted attitude...

 

a few problems with your logic. it takes 2 teams willing to make a deal, and the stakes are so high for the #1 overall pick it is very difficult to make a deal.

 

really one guy doesn't make a difference? how about peyton manning? tom brady? these guys singlehandedly carry their teams.

 

Have you ever seen Indy play with and without manning? the same team looks completly different by changing the QB.

 

there are other ways to get more players. make trades. make good draft choices in rounds 2-7. sign free agents. put your scouts to work

Edited November 8, 2010 by drinkTHEkoolaid

[Steve0022]

I think if you have the top choice of all the available college players, then you take the best one regardless of position. I certainly wouldn't want to limit the best player to one position, even if it is a position of need. And I wouldn't draft for potential like a JaMarcus Russell or Maybin. I just watched Julius Peppers play at a dominant level yesterday at about 30 years-old and can only imagine how the Texans history would have been different if they would have taken him over Carr.

[tennesseeboy]

I think if you have the top choice of all the available college players, then you take the best one regardless of position. I certainly wouldn't want to limit the best player to one position, even if it is a position of need. And I wouldn't draft for potential like a JaMarcus Russell or Maybin. I just watched Julius Peppers play at a dominant level yesterday at about 30 years-old and can only imagine how the Texans history would have been different if they would have taken him over Carr.

If there is a Julius Peppers, Bruce Smith, John Elway caliber player there for goodness sakes get him. If not, then trade down to get help for our pathetic offensive and defensive lines.