sven233 Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 The Bills could switch to a 3-4 if they wanted to and I think it wouldn't take as much work as some fear. The first thing they would need to do is go out and get.........and I can't believe I am saying this because he is so dirty........VINCE WILFORK. I know he won't come cheap, but he is just heading into the prime of his career at 28 or so. Yes, the Cheatriots* may re-sign him, but that is not a guarantee by any means. The Cheatriots* have a history of letting guys like this go at this point. So, this would be the first step. With this signing, I think we would actually have the starting pieces in place on the D-Line. Stroud would make a very good 3-4 DE with his size and athletic ability. He would be fine on 1 side. Williams, while not the tallest guy out there, still has good size and could play the other DE I believe. They can always draft another DE in the 2nd or 3rd rounds that might work as well. But I think Stroud and Williams could play the DEs in a 3-4. Then, the no-brainer move. Maybin moves to one of the OLB positions in the 3-4. From there, the first pick in the draft could go a bunch of different ways depending on who is available. While the chances are maybe slim, if we could pick up either McClain or Spikes with the first pick, I think we will be OK in terms of our starting LBS. We would have Poz and McClain/Spikes in the middle with Maybin and Mitchell on the outside. So, the starting positions would be all set at this point. Depth would be a problem so they would have to do some work in FA and the draft, but in a 3-4 system, our starters would look pretty good, I think. STROUD WILFORK WILLIAMS MAYBIN POZ MCCLAIN MITCHELL Add in our great secondary (I believe our secondary is one of the best in the league already) and I think you starting 3-4 defense would be pretty good. So, while it would take a little work, i think it is possible to put a 3-4 defense on the field that is pretty good.....at least on paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sllib olaffub Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 I'm glad someone brought this up. I was wondering what we'd have to do to go from ours to a 3-4 unit. We could get that Cody DT in the draft. He'd be there at 9, I think. We probably have guys that could go to 3-4 ends - Sroud, maybe, and Williams, or Ellis... So, we'd have to draft a few guys for it, and pick up some F.A.'s, but the from seven is all we're really talking about having to change - and really, we'd only need to add two or three guys, right? A N.T., and two linebackers, and, maybe also another DE. Still, three or four guys in an offseason isn't unrealistic. The Broncos lit it up this year defensively after making quick changes. I wouldn't be surprised to see some hybrid defense installed. Who wants to be the team switching over to the trendy 3-4 right when teams are figuring out how to beat it (as the Bills usually do with football trends). Our new coach mentioned the need to know that defense on account of playing it in our division so much, but, he also mentioned fitting schemes with personell, and even a hybrid, kind of no name type scheme that just plain works with what we have. So, what do we need to do to make an effective switch? (I think Green Bay has a few capable F.A. available this coming year on the D-line, too.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 The Bills could switch to a 3-4 if they wanted to and I think it wouldn't take as much work as some fear. The first thing they would need to do is go out and get.........and I can't believe I am saying this because he is so dirty........VINCE WILFORK. I know he won't come cheap, but he is just heading into the prime of his career at 28 or so. Yes, the Cheatriots* may re-sign him, but that is not a guarantee by any means. The Cheatriots* have a history of letting guys like this go at this point. So, this would be the first step. With this signing, I think we would actually have the starting pieces in place on the D-Line. Stroud would make a very good 3-4 DE with his size and athletic ability. He would be fine on 1 side. Williams, while not the tallest guy out there, still has good size and could play the other DE I believe. They can always draft another DE in the 2nd or 3rd rounds that might work as well. But I think Stroud and Williams could play the DEs in a 3-4. Then, the no-brainer move. Maybin moves to one of the OLB positions in the 3-4. From there, the first pick in the draft could go a bunch of different ways depending on who is available. While the chances are maybe slim, if we could pick up either McClain or Spikes with the first pick, I think we will be OK in terms of our starting LBS. We would have Poz and McClain/Spikes in the middle with Maybin and Mitchell on the outside. So, the starting positions would be all set at this point. Depth would be a problem so they would have to do some work in FA and the draft, but in a 3-4 system, our starters would look pretty good, I think. STROUD WILFORK WILLIAMS MAYBIN POZ MCCLAIN MITCHELL Add in our great secondary (I believe our secondary is one of the best in the league already) and I think you starting 3-4 defense would be pretty good. So, while it would take a little work, i think it is possible to put a 3-4 defense on the field that is pretty good.....at least on paper. On paper, there isn't a team in the league that might not be excellent next year. Off paper, in the real world, anytime you say "Yeah, he's never played that position before, and granted this would be a brand new system for him but I think he'd be a big success ..." you are most likely wrong. Seriously. And IMHO, the Pats knew they wouldn't have money to keep both Wilfork and Seymour. They wanted to keep one. That's why Seymour is gone. Wilfork is going nowhere, IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afl0226 Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 I don't think it is an easy move for us to make, but I do think that it is the right move. The tampa 2 clearly doesn't work in our environment. I love the issues that a 3-4 causes for opposing offenses, and from the sounds of it, Gailey, god that already sounds terrible, is for it because of that very fact, lets hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgrid Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 agree w/ sven's posting. It all would depend on getting a NT in free agency. Cody doesnt play every down in college, so I assume couldnt in NFL as a rookie. So NT would have to be found in free agency for this to work. Stroud and Williams at DE should work, with Kelsay as bkup only. Solves the Schobel retirement issue. Drafting McClain, or Spikes, for MLB a must in rnd 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 Why is everyone so enamored with the 3-4....if you have personnel to play it you play it. If you have personnel for a 4-3 you play it. Most people have no clue what they are talking about it and if sounds fashoinable so they talk about it. You do realize those in a 3-4 play cover 2 all the time don't you? You also realize the Bills played cover 2 only about a third of all snaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgrid Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 One advantage would be that the offense would face it in practice, which would help them on gameday vs division opponts, who all use it. If you can't get the NT, then of course stay w/ 4-3. It is easier to get the 4-3 DT's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 bills are switching to 3-4.... http://www.buffalosportsdaily.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 bills are switching to 3-4.... http://www.buffalosportsdaily.com/ I don't doubt the credibilty of the source, okay...maybe I do, but until I see 3 down lineman and 4 upright LB's, I'm doubting this. That would mean an overhaul on defense of epic porportions. Schobel, Kelsey, Ellis and possibly Denney are no longer on the team. They need to aquire at least 2 NT's. Stroud, Williams and Johnson all playing 3-4 DE's for the first time. Maybin playing LB for the first time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 For future reference in all such conversations, please bookmark this post: http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2010/1/26/...scheme-will-the Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FistingBot Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 We already have two potential nose tackles on the roster: Lonnie Harvey (6'3 350) and Rashaad Duncan (6'2 320). Both guys were signed to the practice squad mid-year last year, and both were given contacts (resigned) a couple of weeks ago. I assume they'll be given a shot at the nose tackle spot. http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-3...73-247654f7659c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Would a move to a 3-4 be as tough as first thought? Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 We already have two potential nose tackles on the roster: Lonnie Harvey (6'3 350) and Rashaad Duncan (6'2 320). Harvey is a biiiggg dude...wonder if he can play... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 we could technically move to a 3-4 tomorrow. the question is, will it be effective. And the answer is: no..at least not immediately. Mitchell is not best suited for a 3-4lb. Stroud Wilfork Williams? Who's pass-rushing? That is the main problem with the Jets D (for as great as it is), is that they can't generate a pass-rush w/o blitzing 2LBs every play. And what happens to Schobel/Kelsay? Do we just cut them? A lot of money on those two..they have to start. I think our secondary is probably the best equipped for the 3-4 b/c McKelvin and McGee are so athletic we'd be playing to their strengths..however, we could do the same in a 4-3 w/o cover 2... I'm really not sold on having to switch to a 3-4...I'd much rather change our philosophy re: the 4-3 and play a more aggressive defense with less zone coverage...get the right personnel in here for our defense (another pass-rusher and another LB)..and I think we'd be set. Remember, our defense was not the problem last year..i don't know why everyone is just dying to switch to a 3-4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in STL Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 We already have two potential nose tackles on the roster: Lonnie Harvey (6'3 350) and Rashaad Duncan (6'2 320). Both guys were signed to the practice squad mid-year last year, and both were given contacts (resigned) a couple of weeks ago. I assume they'll be given a shot at the nose tackle spot. http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-3...73-247654f7659c My neighbor goes 6'3' 325. Can he get a shot too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 My neighbor goes 6'3' 325. Can he get a shot too? LMAO. seriously. People think you can just plug in a fatboy at NT and he'll be effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FistingBot Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Harvey is a biiiggg dude...wonder if he can play... Harvey is an intriguing prospect. He was recruited by all of the major east coast schools coming out of high school, but didn't have the grades so he went to Morgan State in his hometown of Baltimore. Panthers, Colts, Bucs, and others were high on this guy as a raw prospect. He doesn't fit a 4-3, but certainly is worth a look at the nose in a 3-4. http://cdsdraft.com/profile.php?id=3624 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthICE Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 3-4 starts with the NT and we don't have one. We need at least 2-3 on this roster in case of injuries. Stroud would be nothing but a LDE in a 3-4. LB's? Maybin might be one, other than that we need 3 more and NO I am not sold on Poz period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Rob Johnson Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 I agree with you that the move to the 3-4 wouldn't be all that difficult, the problem is that in your scenario above you have likely spent all of their free agent dollars and their 1st round pick. Therefore leaving them no resources for fixing the real problem with the team, their offense. The fact is the defense looked bad last season due to an ineffective offense (defense on field too long). I would prefer to bring back the same defense from last season, perhaps with a replacement for Ellison, and utilize their offseason resources to fix their issues on the offensive side of the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 I agree with you that the move to the 3-4 wouldn't be all that difficult, the problem is that in your scenario above you have likely spent all of their free agent dollars and their 1st round pick. Therefore leaving them no resources for fixing the real problem with the team, their offense. The fact is the defense looked bad last season due to an ineffective offense (defense on field too long). I would prefer to bring back the same defense from last season, perhaps with a replacement for Ellison, and utilize their offseason resources to fix their issues on the offensive side of the ball. My thoughts exactly. Our defense was pretty damn good last year..considering our LB corps was all injured and we lost our 2nd best Corner in McKelvin. Our offense needs the most work by far...why waste so much time and effort overhauling something that isn't really broken? We should be focusing on overhauling teh offense instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 3-4 starts with the NT and we don't have one. We need at least 2-3 on this roster in case of injuries. Stroud would be nothing but a LDE in a 3-4. LB's? Maybin might be one, other than that we need 3 more and NO I am not sold on Poz period. Yep - those NT's are hard to find and can cost a ton. The teams that have them, prize them. The collegiate ones get snapped up, and there is always the questions about if they can play the pro game. As well as the types of LBs and DEs you need to have. I wish'em luck if they are going to make that change. They better flash the big cash... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfaningeneseo Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 I still do not get the love with the 3-4. Both super bowl teams and 3 of the 4 conf. champ. teams were 4-3. Ok, so switching would let our O see it during the week. Big woopee, they have all seen it at least 6 times this past year, they should know what to expect. I think we need to get away from the Tampa-2 version of the 4-3, but that doesn't mean that we have to switch completely. I really think we are maybe 2 players away from a very good 4-3 defense (a better MLB that can move Poz outside, and another DT/DE assuming Schobel doesn't retire). We are MUCH MUCH further away than that if we want to move to a 3-4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Yep - those NT's are hard to find and can cost a ton. The teams that have them, prize them. The collegiate ones get snapped up, and there is always the questions about if they can play the pro game. As well as the types of LBs and DEs you need to have. I wish'em luck if they are going to make that change. They better flash the big cash... It's a really good thing we have Donte Whitner and not Haloti Ngata. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 I think the 3-4 also has implications for the strong safety which may need to be addressed. Maybin kind of seems like a 3-4 OLB to me, but completely unproven, beyond that it seems like there is a lot of work at DE NT and LB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbills17 Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Why is everyone so enamored with the 3-4....if you have personnel to play it you play it. If you have personnel for a 4-3 you play it. Most people have no clue what they are talking about it and if sounds fashoinable so they talk about it. You do realize those in a 3-4 play cover 2 all the time don't you? You also realize the Bills played cover 2 only about a third of all snaps? And you have a clue what you're taling about? Teams in 3-4 do not play cover-2 'all the time'. At the end of the day it's called football, you get good players and play. Thanks for your brilliant insight though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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