FireChans

Brother, the post I was responding to was claiming the 2023 Bills was the best offensive grouping Josh has played with lol. I think you are arguing with the wrong person.

I agree that Diggs and Davis weren’t good enough. that’s why I REALLY don’t agree with trotting out a worse group this year lol.

Somehow it wasn’t as difficult the 3 years before. Global cooling?

This is very funny because this is evidence it’s more about Allen running than the OC resulting in wins. I don’t think they are gonna start slow. Huh

I would argue he needed to be Superman last year. Go look at the anomalies in the passing game.

I think that had a lot to do with Josh rushing 9 times a game. I’m not sure that’s a sustainable season long pace to win a Super Bowl, personally. Which I care a lot more about. I’m not worried about them starting slow. I’m worried about forcing Allen to be Superman from the jump.

Was that the Chiefs plan though? They have drafted Worthy, Moore, Rice in the last 3 years. Signed Juju, Brown, MVS etc. Traded for Toney. Traded for Hardman. I’d argue the Chiefs WR room the last two seasons did not go according to plan, at all. They failed to execute their plan. Intentionally copying the result of an execution failure is certainly one strategy lol.

That’s all well and good, but do you think it’s reasonable to say that Shakir is going to continue to be a rising star because he was pretty good under Brady post Denver, and also ignore that Josh Allen was a much worse passer under Brady post Denver? Like I said, I’m not killing Brady because I agree it’s not really reasonable to expect a whole new offense midseason. But is there any concern there at all? Josh was basically posting 2018/2019 numbers during that stretch.

That’s not really production though. I think there’s a good chance that dollar for dollar Keon Coleman does more for less money than Diggs did in 2023 but that’s really easy. If he has a $2M cap hit, that means he’d have to hit like 171 yards on the season to outproduce Diggs from a yards/dollars ratio. If he hits 200 yards, I certainly won’t say he’s wildly out producing Diggs lol. If Coleman has a more productive 2024 than Diggs did in 2023 I would be wildly surprised and it would be awesome. If he has an 800 yard season, I don’t think I’m gonna say he outproduced Diggs 400%.

I don't think having less yards, TD's or first downs is outproducing, personally.

1974 offense? I don't think QB's were running all that much. I think the vision for the 2024 Bills is the 2020 Pats lmao. The run Cam run offense where the leading receiver is Jakobi Meyers with 700 yards.

The TD's don't bother me much because Josh Allen is a red zone threat and if he runs it in or throws it in, it's still a TD. And in general, those can be sneaks or scrambles and he may not be taking hits. What concerns me is: Passing numbers fell off a cliff when Brady took over and we "spread the ball around." Running Josh at a 153 carry pace which would be a career high in a season for CAM NEWTON. I just feel like we lost the plot a bit. I commend Brady for making some adjustments and involving Cook notably more. I won't hold too much of 23 against him personally, because I believe its very difficult to make any big changes to an offensive system mid-season. But if we are gonna talk Shakir's numbers post-Brady, then we should also talk Josh's. Because from a passing perspective, he was MUCH worse. Pre-Brady Josh had a 70% completion percentage, threw 19 TD's and 11 picks and had a 96 passer rating. Spreading it around and going more run heavy with Cook and Josh himself didn't really help Josh IMO.

So are we just ignoring that Josh Allen played much worse when we did this? Pretty much every passing number fell off a cliff.

Having a bunch of good to great players to throw to is not a bad thing.

You know that's not outproducing Diggs right? Diggs had almost 1200 yards last year.

The offense was so talented in 2023 that Allen had to rush 9 times per game for the last 7 games to save the season and get us in the playoffs. For those keeping score at home, that’s a 153 carry pace on a full season. That would’ve ranked 37th in the NFL last year. Elite RB2 type numbers. And as much as Shakir and Kincaid “came on” during Brady’s reign, Allen had a putrid completion percentage of 60%, threw 10 TD’s to 7 INT’s, with a passer rating of 85. If this is Josh Allen released with Kincaid and Shakir as the focal points, it sounds like it’s gonna be a disaster lmao.

Another clear sign the position is going the way of the running back. Just forget this contract is almost $20M more than Derrick Henry’s career earnings.

yeah Allen has been absolutely elite in the playoffs since 2020. Can’t expect those numbers to be better. Honestly, I don’t expect those numbers to even continue with how incredible they are. IRT the “also ran” it’s because the margin for #1 seed and bye is pretty razor thin. Costing us 1-2 regular season games with TOs can result in not getting the 1 seed, which as we saw last year meant that Bernard got hurt in the wild card round and missed the next week.

Yeah but nobody thinks Tyrod is as good of a QB as Allen, despite the TO difference. The question is does Allen need to be middle of the pack in TOs to produce a ton of TD’s? Would you trade 2 less TD’s for 5 less TO’s? Maybe.

The OP was the person I was responding to who certainly seems to think there’s at least a remote possibility

I will continue to scoff. Multiple receivers have gotten paid this offseason. Multiple others are still waiting. Last month, 35 more were drafted — including nine in the first 34 selections. As more and more competent receivers enter the NFL via the low-cost rookie wage scale, it's fair to wonder if/when more and more teams will decline to pay a receiver and look for a replacement instead in the draft. First of all, huh? By this logic, QB's are going the way of running back. After all, 6 went in the top 12. Hell, 36 CB's were drafted this year. Is CB going the way of the running back? Two years ago, three teams did it. The Titans traded A.J. Brown, the Packers traded receiver Davante Adams, the Chiefs traded Tyreek Hill. (Tennessee used the first-round pick it got for Brown on his replacement, Treylon Burks. The Packers opted for quantity, drafting Christian Watson, Romeo Doubs, and Samari Toure. And the Chiefs went with a low-cost committee approach that has helped deliver every Lombardi Trophy awarded since Hill was traded.) Ah, yes. We all know how well the Titans' trading of AJ Brown has worked out for them. Packers trading Davante of course was the last straw to losing their HoF QB. And the Chiefs' decision worked I guess, but who knows if they don't win 2 SB's with Hill? The reason why this premise is so silly is because there's an apparent lack of understanding of WHY the running back market is the way it is: #1 - Less elite athletes are running backs now than ever before because its the crappiest skill position to play (this is not happening to WR's, its the opposite) #2 - Because less elite athletes are running backs, the delta between a solid RB and a great RB has never been smaller (this is not happening to WR's, its the opposite) #3 - The shelf life for an RB has never been lower, which makes them poor DRAFT investments (this is not happening to WR's, its the opposite) Seriously. This is like Titans fans saying, "Maybe our team is on to something investing garbage at the QB position, they aren't paying franchise QB money, they are ahead of the curve!" Your favorite teams' crappy decisions aren't some super secret masterful strategy. They are just crappy decisions.

Player: TJ Graham i don’t care about Graham over Wilson. Sure it sucked, but QB’s are notoriously hard to scout. But Graham over Hilton hurt my brain. Hilton had two THOUSAND more receiving yards in his college career Sure, he played at FIU but if they were looking for a speedy WR to add another element on offense, I couldn’t believe they picked the dude who was a return man who couldn’t catch and couldn’t play WR. Coach: REXIT. this one is easy. One of the worst Bills coaches of the drought. He should’ve been fired in 2015 before the season ended. Once they gave him 2016, he was a lame duck. Ofc, they wasted a draft trying to get his dudes who all sucked. Lol. The meme of Trent Edwards being ruined by that concussion is so funny. There are certain inaccurate things that just get passed down in franchise lore.

I don’t even know how to respond to this. Here’s a topic I made in November. Josh Allen was smack dab in the middle from a TD/TO ratio below Dak Prescott and above Ryan Tannehill. It’s not nit-picking. He turns it over too much.

Um, there are like 100 page topics about how he doesn’t throw more picks than Brett Favre