Phil The Thrill

Maybe... I just don’t think you can give Ralph a pass for making a for making one of many poor decisions with coaches and GM’s. It’s not a comparable situation. IMO firing Polian hurt the franchise It’s an insult which people usually fling when they’ve been exposed in a debate. I’m good with that

I think they’ll get a deal done

I don’t take any of this stuff personally. It’s fun to come in here and debate. If we all had the same opinion, this place would be like One Bills Live Are we name calling now? Very nice. Maybe we can debate the meaning of “getting a sniff” some more? I don’t know - I think that in business you find a way to work it out with people who have been successful. Ralph seemingly had a conflict with any coach (outside of Levy) or GM that has had success in Buffalo. Not an isolated incident.

It’s exactly like I called it...speculation. You have no idea but are presenting your opinions as facts. The same thing that @GunnerBill accused me of. Atleast you didn’t try to argue the term “not getting a sniff” with semantics. I’ll give you credit for that! Yeah I wasn’t around for Knox but it seems like firing Knox and hiring Stephenson was a huge mistake. Thankfully he lucked into the hiring of Levy/Polian shortly after

Ironically the person that you can argue was response for finding the core of the Super Biwl teams which would be good for a decade (Polian) was the same one fired over a petty squabble with Ralph. His successor (Butler) was also fired over a conflict with ownership. That’s when the major dysfunction started

Right but the teams record under the Nix/Whaley combination was awful. Worse than the much maligned Jauron/Levy combo which everyone lauds as they worst ever. They actually had a better W-L record Presenting that McDermott was involved in not resigning Gilmore. That’s speculation on your part that you present as a fact

Yeah this is a fact. Of course, when I bring this up all people want to do is to say how Ralph kept the team in Buffalo and helped the Raiders 5 decades ago. I view Ralph as having somewhat of a conflicting legacy for Bills fans. For as good as he’s done for the community, he really hurt this franchise toward his last 2 decades of ownership

Just like the false narratives that exaggerate the ability and performance of Whaley as GM, the likes that you are spreading?? Keep exposing those false narrative, truth seeker

I’ve him credit for some of the things he did with free agent signings. But ultimately I think he was just as bad as Buddy Nix whose teams put up a worse record than the Marv/Jauron years.

I would put his work on par with the job Buddy Nix did here - below average

I just think you have to be fair. Many of the comments from @C.Biscuit97 seem to trash the current administration and pine for Doug Whaley. Many times these comments are just not accurate. This is what gets me - propping up fake accomplishment of Whaley to trash the current administration who has been way more successful than Whaley ever was

There’s a lot of truth with what the Doc is saying. Whaley fans want to give Whaley all the credit for the Jerry Hughes deal which was a steal. But when it comes to EJ, it was all on Buddy. Theres a theme here - any good move under the Nix/Whaley regime was all Whaley. All the bad moves are on Buddy. I think that was Dawk was saying is that Whaley likely had a lot of input on the decisions and many here did tout him as the future GM. So you can distance Whaley from moves like EJ and give him credit for bringing players like Hughes on board. It doesn’t work that way...

I’m no Whaley fan but I will say he made the right decision with Karlos. He didn’t take working in the NFL seriously and couldn’t perform anywhere near at the level he did as a rookie. He threw away a promising career and I think Whaley made the right call releasing Karlos, as he did the year before by releasing Fred Jackson

I love Freddy and still have his jersey. But Whaley made the right call. Karlos was awesome his rookie year But then you’d have no excuses for the bad decisions!?!?!?!?

This is truth. Hence, why the term “Whaley apologist” is legit

Psst....it’s because he wasn’t a very good GM. You and @GunnerBill are the only ones who don’t believe this. Now put that framed Whaley 8x 10 picture in the trash where it belongs.

Yeah but they also couldn’t stop a rookie Derek Carr and a 2-12 Oakland team. McDermott doesn’t lose to teams like that. Bills would win 20-10 and C. Biscuit would be crying his #97 jersey. (Great role model, By the way) Well said Doc!

LOL even my comments on Whaley weren’t this this strong! But me and Karlos have a lot in common. We’re both: - out-of-shape and overweight - love to eat chicken wings and late night food - think Doug Whaley was a bad GM (Despite many Whaley apologists in the Bills fan base) In all seriousness, Karlos was a f’n beast his rookie season. He looked like he was going to have a tremendous career and then he threw it all away. I can’t even blame Whaley for this decision. I mean, Karlos does have a point about the double-standard but it’s all his own doing. Whaley actually made the right decisions cutting ties. But man, this kid has potential

Check out Andy Provin on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdQsvGZHJTGL8cpB_6Ki_0g Tons of Bills archives from broadcast games

Roscoe was pretty dangerous as a punt returner. This is a huge “if” but if he could only stay healthy, he’d be a great option for a WR4 or gadget type of player.

I think a lot had to do with EJ. Many people have pointed out here - EJ was probably had a 3rd or 4th round grade. The QB’s in the 2013 class were horrible. He might have been the best option but the Bills put themselves in a position where did they had to draft a QB so they wanted to take the one they liked best even if it meant reaching. Bad decision but a bad administration. EJ’s ceiling was a backup QB and you can debate whether he realized that. He was out of the league pretty quick after his time in Buffalo I will defend the selection of Mike Williams. Not definitely was a huge miss, but the pick was very safe at the time. If the Bills didn’t take Williams at #4 another team would have selected him shortly after. Williams was projected to be a franchise tackle. Donahoe thought he was getting a 10-15 staple on the OL. He’s definitely a bust but it’s not like there were red flags like there were with other players that are on this list. It was a good pick at the time and a horrid return

Here’s a crazy and somewhat scary idea. New England was rumoured to be interested in Josh Rosen in 2018. Some people had mocked them making a big move to trade up into the Top 5 and draft him. Would Belichick consider trading a 4th round (or less) to Miami to see if Rosen has anything left? If he doesn’t, he always has Stidham.

fair enough... I just felt like you were really splitting hairs just to argue: Cap hell vs. Bad cap situation Not getting a whiff vs. Getting interviews Its all semantics

Forget the offseason. Good players are Suzhou resigned before they hit the market. Whaley had an entire to get a deal done before he was fired. Why didn’t it happen? Either way....it a moot point. My main point is - I don’t get the fierce support for a GM that largely underachieved.

I think we all hoped he’d be a good QB but I’d be surprised if any of us would honestly put money on it. Where’s your proof? Who’s peddling lies now?