CincyBillsFan

Marino's comments are sloppy IMO. He calls out the O line and Cook's issues with picking up the blitz, factors know to create havoc with even the best QB's then lays the blame on Allen. I suspect that Bellicheat looked at the tape and saw that Cook can't pick up the blitzer (something both Moss & Moter were very good at) and then ruthlessly exploited it. I also suspect that with a few games tape in hand D coordinators are seeing some weaknesses in our new guards play and exploiting that. And of course they already know where Brown can be exploited at RT.

Are you seriously suggesting that Allen is nearing the point of being on the ropes in Buffalo? First off by every QB/team metric available Allen is having a very good year. Is he playing as well or as consistently as 2020 & 21? No. But he's still a top 10 and in most metrics a top 5 QB. Second,with all due respects to Joe Marino I'll wait to hear from a couple of other analysts like Greg Cosell & that guy who runs the QB University before I uncritically accept Marino's criticisms as being true or not overstated.

And don't forget that if Shanahan was the "God of Offense" the Dolphins have TWICE (after the Bronco's game and again after the Panthers game) been named the Archangel Micheal of offense.

None of this is true. You're just throwing crap at the wall like monkeys do in the zoo. Allen hasn't been a TO machine since week 1. And a more accurate description of Allen is that he's a TD producing machine. Allen doesn't actually read defenses? Really? So that 17 play 81 yard TD drive against the Giants was improvisation? Throw the ball when he hits his drop? What the hell does that even mean with a DT in his face? Sounds like your throwing football jargon around to impress people. That might work at Fishhaven. Allen doesn't prioritize moving the chains? Where do the Bills rank in getting first downs? Doesn't seem to be a problem when you look at the actual data and not just make stuff up. And how many first downs did Allen produce in those long TD drives the last couple of weeks? Allen is doing a lot of "flashy hero ball" is he? I think you're mistaking Allen making spectacular plays that only he can make with hero ball.

He is missing open guys all over the place? Really that is what your film study showed? And how do the TO's at the end of LAST SEASON and the Jet's game impact what is happening now? Do you think that awful 3 INT game Allen had against NE in 2019 may have had an effect to? Can you explain Allen's lack of trust in the first half but not the second half of the last three games? Seems odd if that really is a thing.

So you're just a whiny baby complaining about Allen on a Bills message board for some weird reason. Got it. Hey and I wouldn't want to put in writing that the Bills should get rid of Allen because it would capture forever that you made one of the dumbest posts in the history of 2BD.

So answer the question of what should the Bills do with the albatross of Josh Allen hanging around their necks? Given that most of the NFL would part ways with an enormous number of draft picks to acquire Allen shouldn't we put him on the trading block ASAP? After all if he continues to "suck" as you say his value will drop. So tell us what you would do. Real Bills fans have no problem proposing solutions to the teams problems. We do it all the time on 2BD.

The guy is a troll.

So obviously in your opinion the Bills need to part ways with Allen as he's not very good. So how should they do it? Should the Bills trade before the up coming trade deadline or wait to the off season? Come on every one of your posts whines about how bad Allen is. Hell you seem to think that Allen even sucks in limited play during meaningless exhibition games. Well we can't have that can we. I would love to hear what you would do with Allen if you ran things.

So what do we next given that you obviously consider yourself knowledgeable about the game of football. Clearly in your opinion Allen is not very good. This must mean you favor parting ways with him so how would you propose we should do it?

What garbage. You're throwing out the fumble on the last desperation play of the game. Again what should we do about what you consider our big problem with Allen? Come on let us know what we should do. Obviously anyone as negative as you have been about Allen must have a plan for what we should do. So when do we put him on the trading block?

What a hack. Ever since the Pitt game. Are you talking about a freaking EXHIBITION GAME? Your acting as if a couple of series in an exhibition game is indicative of anything. Jittery! Especially in the Red Zone! Have you seen Allen's stats in the Red Zone? Are you aware that the Bills are the 2nd best team in Red Zone offense? Of course you're not because you don't even watch the games troll.

So Flutie is equal to Allen now? So what do we do with Allen? If he's really not that good which is what you're arguing then you must want to move on from him right? You know that they could get a minimum of 3 first round picks & 3 second round picks for Allen. Probably more then 25 teams would make this trade in a heartbeat. Imagine what the brain trust could do with that much draft capital. So put your money where your mouth is. You trash Allen and those that support him so give us your vision going forward of a life with Allen on another team and the Bills swimming in draft picks. This is total garbage and doesn't reflect what we're seeing this year. It's straight up trolling.

I think this is our only chance for the season.

For the record Allen hits most of his open throws. That is not the problem. The drop in the O lines pass protection effectiveness is the problem. And don't you think Allen would look better if the OL could block to? After all Allen is the immediate recipient of the O lines problems in both a literal and figurative way.

Not Dorsey, McD has put him on a leash. Dorsey being a new hire with a long career ahead of him is likely a lot more pliable then DaBoll was. This is more evidence that what Cowherd and others have been saying about the problems with defensive coaches in an offensive league is true. I'm sure McD believes reigning in Allen and the O is good for the team. But in reality it might be good for the D but it is not good for the team. And this is a distinction that McD as a defensive coach is unable to make.

I suspect that 13 seconds took a deeper toll on Allen then people suspect. How many QB's playing the way he was at the end of that season and in those playoffs would not have a bitter place in their heart over the gross negligence and incompetence exhibited by the organization during those few seconds? Then after 2021 Allen loses DaBoll and the Bills double down on the Defense with the high profile signing of Miller. They keep trying to fix a bad O line with bargain basement FA signings and mid round draft picks while expending higher picks & FA signings on the D line. Contrast this with the focus & effort KC and Cincy put into fixing their O lines not to mention the offensive talent being assembled by the Eagles, 49's and Dolphins. Meanwhile, Allen raised by his parents to behave in a certain way will not throw anyone under the bus and takes all the responsibility on himself. I may not be a psychiatrist but damn that doesn't sound healthy over the long haul. The only way to fix it IMO - change directions 180 degrees. What that means specifically I'll leave to other people with more knowledge f the situation. But with DaBoll gone I see Bean/McD making mistakes with Allen on par with the mistakes they made his rookie year.

The 49's & Eagles definitely win Super Bowls with Allen at QB. Ditto for the Dolphins. IMO only KC would not see their Super Bowls chances improved by swapping out their current QB with Allen. The issues with Allen, if there really are any, are entirely related to this franchise screwing up being gifted by the football gods with a generational talent at QB. Five plus seasons with bad O line play is going to wear on any QB. Allen has actually withstood it's negative effects longer then most would have. Throw in a group of skill players who most of the time can't make contested catches and Allen may well be worn out mentally. BTW, I like Allen but depending on how the rest of this season plays out I'm starting to feel sorry for him being a member of the Bills franchise. Folks talk about how the Bills "developed" Allen and handled him so well but any honest look at Allen's rookie year would show that Bean & McD completely screwed it up and were saved by Allen's ability to make lemonade out of lemons. I'm beginning to have uncomfortable thoughts that maybe the best thing for Allen would be to move on from the Bills. That way Bill's management can get a boatload of draft picks and use them to build a new 1985 Bears D. At least Allen would get a real shot to show what he can do in latter round playoff games and Super Bowls. The Bills would likely just revert back to lost years of 2000 - 2019.

Your lack of comprehension here is startling. The only choice the Bill's O has is to go on those long drives based on what the D is giving them. You know the things that you and your fellow travelers repeatedly claim Allen won't take. The point then is that it's on the D to force more 3 & outs as a way to give the Bills O a couple of more possessions. When the D was forcing a lot of TO's earlier in the season it covered up the problem of opposing offenses converting to many 3rd downs and chewing up clock and gaining field position even on non-scoring drives.

IMO this is a defensive based approach illustrating to me that with DaBoll gone and the more controllable Dorsey running the O McD can shape the offense to a form that he prefers. I suspect that McD & DaBoll went at it a few times over the offenses approach.

This is a huge and underappreciated factor in the Offenses problems. The opposition is forcing the Bills offense to take long, time consuming drives. So when the D allows the opponents O to go on long drives that chew up time that leads to a couple of less offensive possessions and scoring opportunities. Against the Giants didn't we have only 3 possessions the whole 2nd half?

You are simply trolling here. Allen has lifted the team. Without him I doubt we win even one division title over the last 3 seasons. I also doubt we go to the playoff more then onece in the last 4 seasons. So if that isn't the definition of "lifting a team" I don't know what is. Sure, THIS YEAR KC's weapons are about equal to the Bills and they also have had some issues with offensive consistency and production. But you're ignoring three important things: * When comparing Allen & Mahomes you have to look at their CAREERS not just this season. Now when you do this Mahomes & the Chiefs have clearly outperformed the Bills with multiple Super Bowls. But no sane football fan could say that over that stretch Mahomes and Allen's skill players were equally talented. Mahomes & the Chiefs have had a huge advantage over Allen & the Bills on this front. There is no rational disputing of this. * While the Chiefs & Bills may have similar talent at the offensive skill positions THIS SEASON the Chiefs enjoy a substantial advantage in offensive coaching. * Ditto the huge advantage the Chiefs have on the Offensive Line.

But the key here is what defines a "collapse"? To me not making the playoffs would potentially count as a collapse depending on the circumstances. But if Allen stays relatively healthy and we win less then 10 games and miss the playoffs I would call it a "collapse" from where we have been the last 4 seasons. In that situation I would support Pegula taking the very risky move of firing McD & Bean and placing the franchise under the control of offensive minded coaches & GM. We may only have peak Allen for 5 more years.

Did you read my post? I addressed the discrepancy between the lack of 1st half production and the excellent 2nd half production. I don't have enough info to say what is causing this but I don't think it's Allen. Not when I can see how the Bills have structured their offense over the last 5 seasons. Buffalo is a defensive minded franchise that believes that surrounding an elite QB with less talent is the way to focus resources into creating an elite D. This WAS a Super Bowl winning template from the 1970's to early in the 21st century. I don't believe it's the template to win a Super Bowl TODAY. Sure it has been successful in lifting the Bills from 20 years of average to bad football to Division titles and playoff appearances but it's not enough to lift us to the next level. You seem mad at Allen because he can't lift his game to a point where the Bills O is overpowering with the talent at hand. IMO NO QB in the NFL could take this current Bills offensive talent & coaching philosophy and make it a consistently potent force. And for the record McD & Bean have NOT been able to create a consistently great D. The stats look good but every season this defense has failed the team at the most critical moments. Meanwhile, the Bills are squandering a generational talent at QB. This is what pisses me off.

We are over thinking this. What is hamstringing Allen is a bad O line and mediocre play makers not named Diggs. Watching what other teams put around their elite or just very good QB's clearly highlights just how poorly the Bills have been at doing this. Maybe the reality is that what we're seeing is the best Allen and this offense can be as currently structured & coached. A top 10 unit by the stat measures that count (points & yards) but never fully realizing the potential of the great QB at the helm. Allen & the Bills offense is looking more and more like Herbert & the Chargers. It's plain to see and we all know the common denominator.