ChiGoose

It would be stupid not to indict someone who intentionally stole government secrets and obstructed the investigation into his conduct. Didn’t think that would be controversial, but here we are.

You need to get a hobby

Obstruction of Justice is stupid? Stealing defense secrets is stupid?

I fundamentally do not understand how you can believe the following is cooperating: -Refusing to return them when asked -Returning some documents and lying to the government by saying he had returned them all We are talking about a guy who, upon learning that his lawyer would be reviewing the documents in the storage room for government documents, had someone go into the storage room and remove documents before the lawyer could find them. If he truly and honestly thought that he wanted to keep personal documents, he could have cooperated with NARA from the start. Their remit is only for presidential records, they would not take his personal documents. If there was a dispute over a particular record, it could have been resolved. Instead, he literally obstructed the investigation and yet people someone see obstruction as cooperation.

Ownership means that they belong to NARA, not Trump or his office. To possess them, he would need an exemption from NARA, which he did not obtain.

The president doesn’t personally retain any presidential records once they leave office. They become the property of the government. The president can work with NARA to access the records or put them in a presidential library, but the president does not own them, nor do they have a possessory right to them.

Well, they’re not supposed to throw anything out either. I have a very, very low opinion of our politicians but even still I find myself surprised there isn’t a bipartisan movement in Congress to address controls for sensitive documents and presidential records.

I think it’s shady that there were documents in so many places. As of right now, the simplest explanation is that our document controls are so bad that movers seem to just be grabbing everything and throwing it in boxes. I’ll allow for the possibility that there was something intentional there, but I’d need more hard evidence to draw that conclusion. There certainly hasn’t been anything we’ve seen so far that would prove intent.

It shouldn’t be surprising given the source, but this is a gross misunderstanding of the case.

I think there’s still a question about how the documents got there and whether he knew about them. It’s definitely not a good look that he had so many documents around but I am not going to jump to conclusions until there is more hard evidence. Nothing we know now would support a charge but the investigation is ongoing so that could change. As I have repeatedly stated, you apply the facts to the law. That’s why neither Pence nor Clinton were charged while Trump was.

There’s a difference between thinking someone may have done something shady and someone definitely broke the law. On the one end is Biden, and on the other is Trump.

The problem is that, given the currently known evidence, you probably can’t prove “knowingly” in court. If Biden had been a government employee or contractor, he would have been fired. But that’s not a mechanism available for electeds. As I’ve stated basically infinity times, no prosecutor would bring a case with what we know about Biden because they likely wouldn’t even make it to trial. That being said, there’s probably a reason the Pence investigation closed while the Biden investigation is ongoing. If new facts emerge, it can change the equation.

Saying something is one thing. Proving it beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law is another.

Actually it is when you consider all of the instances, even beginning with Clinton. That is, if you actually read the investigation findings instead of listening to people who maybe don’t have the best reasons to be truthful.

It’s actually a pretty consistent application of the law if you actually look at the facts and apply them to the law.

Do you know every single thing that’s on your garage? Have you ever moved and not finished unpacking all the boxes? Even a MAGA jury wouldn’t convict on this. You would think that if he knew they were there, you would be able to get someone to testify to that effect. Find a hooker who will testify under oath that Hunter told her about the documents or showed her. Or a maid who saw them while cleaning. Or literally anybody who can testify that it was known that the documents were there. I love how explaining how the law works is “twisting like a pretzel.” Says a lot about you. If Biden did something wrong, he should face the consequences. But you absolutely cannot sustain a charge based on what we know. There’s no precedent for it and it probably wouldn’t even make it to trial.

Buddy, I’m sorry, but you’re just wrong. No prosecutor would bring a case with that as the evidence of intent because there’s about a zero percent chance of securing a conviction.

That’s simply not enough to sustain a charge. It just isn’t. You need hard evidence that he knew he was taking it. He can just point to the government docs that ended up everywhere like with Pence and state that accidental spillage is very common.

Seems like you have some gaps in your case there. You still need hard evidence that he knew and facilitated the taking. Here, let me help you by providing some types of evidence that might prove Biden took them intentionally: -He says so publicly -He refuses to return them when asked (you can ask the jury to infer that if he had them accidentally he would have turned them over the second he was asked). -He returned some and lied by saying he had returned them all -He personally held the documents and showed them to people and you have either their testimony under oath or a recording of this happening. Any of those would really help your case. If you had them all (which probably isn’t possible because who could possibly so stupid?) you’d have a slam dunk of a case.

Yeah, Trump only killed hundreds of thousands of his own supporters. No biggie.

And his defense will be: ”Do you think the Vice President of the United States packs up his own office? Of course not. He has movers pack everything up. In this case, the movers just grabbed everything from his office and put it in boxes indiscriminately. Those boxes sat in Biden’s properties without him knowing that there were things in there that shouldn’t have been. The moment he learned about this, he called the authorities and cooperated fully with the investigation, turning over every document that was wrongfully placed in his possession.” Now tell me, do you still think you’d get 12 jurors to convict? I’m not sure you’d even get to that point as you likely wouldn’t survive a motion to dismiss with the evidence that’s currently public.

Only if you can prove intent

LOL. RFK Jr is a joke and has zero chance of beating Biden in the primary. Most of his support comes from right wing grifters, not Dems.

The double standard here is on the right, not the left. When people close to Trump and people who worked for him and have first hand experience say anything negative about him, they dismiss it as biased and not credible. But when random people say anything negative about someone on the left, they believe it straightaway with no skepticism. Random person says Biden is taking bribes with no evidence? Must be true. FBI whistleblower has the inside scoop on the investigation despite not working for the FBI for years? Has to be real. As anonymous source has a whistleblower that’s going to bring down the Biden’s but then loses the whistler blower? Definitely credible. If there is hard evidence that Biden committed crimes, then he should face the consequences. He is already under investigation for the documents at his house. If he was using them for personal gain, we’ll find out about it. So far, it just looks like his son is a loser influence peddler. Gross, but not necessarily illegal (unfortunately) and not necessarily involving his father either.

Middle of the night and you still can’t stop thinking about me 🥰🥰🥰