transplantbillsfan

No every other industry HASN'T figured these things out, hence the explosion in cases across the country and some of these industries on the brink of a 2nd shutdown.

Yep. This is exactly what our school is doing. And we'll progress to 50% capacity if it's possible and so on. And our state opens the public school system in 3 weeks. We're the test subjects.

From page 4: You're right. You idiots probably would have been more appropriate

Ummm... No we aren't. This thread is just revealing so much ignorance with regards to teachers it's ridiculous. You brought up one of the most common misconceptions of how we're paid. We're 10 month employees who get paid over a span of 12 months because a percentage of our pay is withheld during the 10 months so we can be paid over the Summer. I've heard of some districts where you have the option to get your full pay through the 10 months, but then you aren't paid through the Summer. There are 12 month employees at schools like Registrars and Librarians who are paid more on the whole because they work 2 extra months, but their wage isn't higher.

Wow you must have had TERRIBLE teachers in grade school! I feel bad for you. All my best teachers were from elementary to High School, not college. That includes the teacher who inspired me to come into the profession. I've seen discount teachers come and go. They get swallowed and eaten up by the demands of the profession and often by the kids they teach themselves. Your extreme ignorance as it relates to the profession is so pathetic I hope all you're doing is playing some ridiculous Persona. If you are, you're doing it well. I have no clue what your situation, but 2 things: Sounds like your Confirmation bias of a comparatively minute number of teachers you've interacted with are what you are using as the foundational belief you clearly have of teachers. I will say that in my 16 years of experience teaching it is often the know-it-all parents who view their kids' teachers as "complete boobs" who are the biggest problems for that child and his/her learning. It just won't happen. Not the money to pay for this happening.

Well I've learned a lot about you in our dialogue in this thread. Unfortunately, none of it is good.

Nah. It's crazy. Biden looks like a brilliant choir boy when juxtaposed next to Trump, who will be looked at in the history books as one of the worst Presidents in US history.

Yes

Guessing you never got beyond that... Massive watering down of the education system is what you're essentially proposing. You realize that, right? Instead of mostly highly qualified teachers your asking for mostly semi-qualified teachers. And that's better to you because all those semi qualified teachers will have smaller classes? Man, you guys really are clueless.

"Adequate instructors at bargain barrel prices." Honestly you guys amaze me. With education as a whole, much like with everything else in life in general: You get what you pay for Bingo. This is what is and will happen. In other words: It's not students going fully back to school. And bigger schools like mine are staggering it so they come once every 4 classes rather than 2. Because you're using what happened in your workplace as an argument for why teachers need to go fully back to work.

You haven't heard this come up with publicly because it's not feasible. You're going to have to pay for these extra hours. You seem wildly clueless on this. Was waiting for it... there it is I'm still waiting on what you do for a living. I'm guessing you stand at your desk by choice because you have one of those standing desks since sitting is apparently the new smoking. You're full of so much goddamn hot air it's ridiculous. Then you clearly haven't been paying attention. If you think I'm being negative, maybe you should recognize the situation our Country is currently in. But I did NOT say don't open schools without a vaccine. If you appreciate a good honest debate, at least pay attention to what I've said. I'm so sick of the binary choices you guys limit yourselves to in this forum.

Ooooooohhhhh that'd be fantastic! Good idea. I'm willing to do it. Just pay me for my extra hours and extra work

Agreed, He has no clue, but I'll address it anyway. Nice thought. Again, if we could ignore parents and their complaints and wishes, believe me teachers would be much happier in their profession. Parents are often stupid, plain and simple. Unfortunately, as the previous poster stated... pigeon the sky brah. Wait, we're teachers. Now we're health providers and potential arts and crafts experts, too? Pie in the sky... This sounds like your job accommodated you and your coworkers quite well, maybe you should consider that teachers should be accommodated similarly. No every desk. Kids aren't immune and the moment there's a Coronavirus sickness, hospitalization or death, all hell breaks loose. And yes, kids get sick, too. Oooooooooohhhhhhhhh!!!! Yeah you're wonderful freedom has been lookin really promising. 362 deaths in a 4 day span that ended July 11th. Yeah, you're definitely living in the region the rest of the Country should be looking towards At least at this point you clearly establish you're either being sarcastic or you're a moron. And just to let you know, I sincerely think there's a 50/50 chance you're one of these 2 things and I truly hope it's the former. Sarcastic it is. No not excuses. Look back in this thread. I said I think my school has the right idea for a model of how to start school. However, much to the chagrin of you and others here, it involves a combination of in school learning and distance learning to start the year. This is especially a necessity for schools with larger student bodies. So whatever misery you're suffering under, I hope you can actually understand some of the complexities of this issue and that it's not teachers who have been the ones creating the plans, it's administrations and, unfortunately, politicians. I think I've placated you enough at this point.

I'm sure you're a smart man, but you seem relatively clueless about the massive beurocracies that schools are--Public, Charter AND private. You know how many interviews I've heard already from parents saying their kid has some underlying health condition that won't allow them to wear a mask all day? Some from private schools. And as much as you'd like to think if those private school kids won't wear masks, they're that much easier to kick out. Except they aren't. It all depends on who their parents are in many cases. "Provide them" is a wonderful idea if we're actually provided with those things to provide the students. That's the issue public schools run into more than Private schools. I've heard some private schools investing in the very things needed to get ALL teachers back. Pay for those things for Public schools--you willing to pay for that Mr. Taxpayer?--and you likely won't get nearly as much pushback. Again, what do you do? You said you work in an office. How many people are in your office at a time? How big is your office? Is it a cubicle like setup with walls between everyone working? Please describe it if you're willing. Where do you live? My Mom had to wait in a line for 20 minutes outside of Wegmans last week because they were doing just that. Yes, plexiglass/plastic partitions for every desk, hand sanitizer for every student and cleaning supplies for every teacher along with extra masks for an enforceable "every student must wear a mask in class" policy. Oh wait, but then you also mentioned the social distancing thing. How do you get your 6 ft apart for all 30+ students in anywhere from a 400-800 square foot box? No. Not 6 weeks. Students come back August 4th here. And it's not ultimately the teachers driving these decisions.

We have been demanding that dummy. Ya know what the problem we run into is? Parents who refuse to make their kids wear masks and a DOE that accepts 3 ft as acceptable social distancing. Among other things. Your 1st 2 sentences are completely at odds with each other. Teachers want to get back into the classroom. But safely. For everyone. May I ask what you do for a living? Is your username instructive as far as your profession goes? Every grocery store I've gone to for months limits occupancy in the store to 50% or below typical occupancy, provides every employee with sanitizer and clerks with cleansers to clean the conveyor belt after each customer along with a clear plastic shield between clerk and customer.

Well for one, teachers are, on average, older than workers in a grocery store https://datausa.io/profile/naics/grocery-stores https://datausa.io/profile/soc/elementary-middle-school-teachers 5 years is a pretty significant difference. And you're absolutely right. Look at all the precautions they've taken! If teachers were provided the same protections a grocery store clerk gets with clear plastic barriers set up between every single desk in their classroom, hand sanitizer for himself/herself as well as every single student along with disinfectants provided for consistent cleaning, that would be a great start and I bet you'd have a lot less pushback from teachers. So tell me, who pays for that? That wouldn't be cheap. Thanks for the flattery with a side dish of sarcasm. See my response above to @Doc Brown about this. Grocery stores made quick adjustments with everything they implemented in part because they operate for profit, unlike schools. Too many cooks in the kitchen who don't even know how to operate an oven when it comes to schools.

So that's the answer? Push out the old and in with the new? (And again, it's not just "old" teachers who are at risk. I have a coworker with type 1 diabetes who is in her 30s... you sayin she should be forced out, too?) And who replaces all these teachers with these waves of retirements? I know here in Hawai'i there's a teacher shortage and, in turn, a sub shortage. There has been for years... I was hired on the mainland myself. Where are all these teachers-in-waiting ready to take over with this wave of retirements? This is one of the most predictable and fallacious arguments circulating about so easily starting up schools. "Europe did it, we can, too!" Ya know what else Europe has done that we haven't come close to doing? Flattened the curve. This "let's be like Europe" argument with education is a hilarious contradiction to the arguments that boil down to "we're not Europe, we're 'Merica!"I've heard constantly over here for many months of why we can't have a stronger nation-wide response to get the virus under control and the curve flattened Huh? It's going to be trial and error but it's not an option to keep the kids home. What does that even mean? 100% agree They are. How many of those professions center specifically around close physical social interaction for 6 or 7 hours a day where they are in a single room with around 100 people throughout the day and 20-35 people at a given time? Can you name those professions and tell me which ones have fully gone back to work as usual?

And as I have argued multiple times and is displayed poll showing what's motivating a huge plurality of Biden voters out in the Fall, Donald Trump is doing all Biden's campaigning for him, and he's serving the Democratic party well, though it's unfortunate that's because he's serving our country poorly as an awful President. The fact that so many of you here still so ardently support Donald Trump would be just pathetic if it weren't so hilariously bizarre.

See I'm not actually afraid. Other teachers are, though. And I think those teachers are going to want to get the heck out the classroom fully once there are a few cases that pop up in our school.

I teach English, not History. Are you saying you sit in every single classroom across the country with liberal teachers and are aware of how they teach and what they teach?

Weird question. And no that wasn't what I meant. You sound insecure.

I'm 39 and love my job more and more every year. It's a job I knew I wanted to go into from 9th grade and I never wavered. I'm also in great health because eat well, I surf a few times a week on average and I exercise. So I appreciate the heads up on my physical and emotional well-being, but I'm good, thanks. And what the hell are you ranting on about at the end there? Did Donald Trump personally hand you his talking points?

It's the broad sentiment on this board and considering your posting and often heightened animosity towards me, I probably just lumped you in with the rest. I apologize. It's more than that with your proposal though. Weapons and drugs are easy because they're visible and tangible and require no judgment call from anyone. You propose that teachers gauge the intention of the students, not the action. Even I'm not comfortable doing that and I really do feel I have a good barometer for student intention in the classroom. With your proposal: Student accidentally sneezes in direction of another student. No consequence. Student Intentionally sneezes in direction of another student. Student is suspended. But first teacher has to determine intention and then Admin has to hear both student and teacher story (because I don't know what kind of Admin you have but this is the way my school works, even if the Admin nearly always backs the teacher) and then Admin determines action. You don't see the serious problems with that?

Can't read your tone here very well, but our school alone had a small Summer School with some in-class learning and there was a Covid-19 case in that session that was big news in the community. In the news today it said that about 1 in 4 teachers fall under the "at-risk" category. This is going to likely be an extreme slow-walk. What a fear-mongering moron. Less than 4 months til he's voted out No, he's not. He's an idiot.

Why would I know you're a teacher? If you're a teacher, then you know that no matter how attuned a teacher is with his/her classroom and students, everything outside the classroom are obstacles to your proposal. Admin is one. Parents are another. It's not just coming up with good ideas, it's can you implement them without severe liability risk or risks of being sued, which is certainly what Admin will be thinking of.