GunnerBill

Yea Benford's numbers in man are very good, just not elite. I don't think he is exclusively a zone guy.

Oh at his best he absolutely was. He was a top 3 left tackle when he signed his last deal. He has barely played between then and this past year when it is fair to say he wasn't the same dominant player.

Yea that last point is a good one that I confess I am sometimes guilty of missing. Part of the Bills culture is do the right thing, earn it on the field, be a good pro and get your rewards. And that matters. And is likely why they can win 13 games in a re-set season. I want more elite talent, but it is fair to point out the importance for a team like Buffalo of that messaging to players and agents around the league. We are not Philly or Dallas or LA or one of the Jersey teams with NYC on the doorstep. We have show we are a desirable location.

Reminder from the start that although the cap sites had us c.$10m over at the Combine Beane said his calculations were more like $4m over.

My problem with that play wasn't that he misdiagnosed it. It was that he gave up. And he 100% did. Whatever he tries to say. Reid ran 5 plays against the Bills they hadn't run all year. And 0 against the Eagles even when they couldn't move the ball. You better believe the Chiefs play the Bills differently than they play other teams.

But he had his worst game as a Bill in the biggest game of his career. It is fair to say that.

He is not a better player. He IS a better pass rusher.

I don't deny the overall is bad business. Beane has not done well enough with the dline. But I don't think that changes whether this deal was market value or not. They are separate points.

See I mind this less than Bernard. I like the Shakir deal. I would have waited on Groot but I don't think this is an overpayment. I do think Bernard was. The overall strategy - paying a DE2 when you don't have a DE1 - and going for what looks increasingly like a run it back strategy is what I like less than any of the individual deals specifically.

Greenard had a season best 12 sacks the year before he signed the deal. But his production over the four years total was in line with this. Sure, he backed it up. Remains to be sign whether Groot can justify the deal. Highsmith had one big year otherwise is right in the Groot range production wise. They are the DE2 market and Groot is a DE2.

When do you guys reckon Beano last saw his family?

Tbf at $20m AAV he doesn't need to be a star DE. If he is an 8 sack a year guy every year of this deal, with maybe one double digit year thrown in and it will be worth it. Just needs to be consistently the best version of what he has been. It is high end edge #2 money. In the Greenard / Huff / Highsmith area. That isn't to say I love it as an idea - paying a #2 DE when you don't have a #1 and as I have said before I thought his AFCCG performance was arguably his worst game as a Bill. But these are high end #2 numbers which is kinda what I see Groot as.

Yea the comparisons on Spotrac are somewhat useful. The actual projection numbers often way off.

Agree but the only thing I'd say is they did Brown coming off his, to that point, best year. He was clearly on the upswing. I know TB had injuries last year but it was definitely a step back on 2023 for him. Does make it a tad riskier IMO.

He shoulda sent a save the date. I'm in Copenhagen then.

I'm 100% with you on everything except Grable's ceiling. I love Grable. I suspect if he ever got on the field you'd never get him off again. But there is no need to mess with the chemistry of the current Oline right now. And Edwards wasn't the weakest member of the starting group anyway - Cybo was. So to take a good guard off the field to put a year 2 tackle who has never played guard in his place? Doesn't make a ton of sense. I am with you on those 9 locked into their spots going into the season. The only serious roster question for me is do they keep a 10th? If they do it will be instead of an extra tight end of DL or LB not instead of one of those nine guys.

He's actually our 3rd. He was the swing tackle when healthy last year. Van Demark was actually OT4. I agree with you on making him a guard though. Technically as well I worry a bit whether he has the knee bend for it. He plays a bit upright which is easier to get away with at tackle.

But remember Beane said they were only around $4m over at the Combine when a lot of the sites were projecting $10m over. So there might not be as much work to do as some expect to just get cap compliant. Now getting to a place where they have space to make moves is different. But based on what Beane said last week if they cut Von today they are there.

We'll see. Maybe not.

Seattle is tanking for Archie. Get the deal done for DK.

I sort of agree although I do think they have a bit more flexibility than that. I'd be surprised if they sign all 4 of the 2022 cohort. Now looks like Cook is the odd man out. They may well wait a year on Benford given the concussions. I think Groot is the one I'm increasingly leaning towards not signing. I'd argue that the thing that has actually held them back from adding difference makers from outside more is the middling vets (FA or Trade) they have signed. The likes of Settle, Harty, Samuel, Douglas, Edwards... I'm missing some. But I think signing all four/five including Groot of their own guys would be too much of a settling move.

Nope

Agree. If 2023 TB this is his market rate, maybe even a little below. At 2024 level TB I think this is an overpay. Not a massive one but an overpay all the same. He'd have been 4th on my list of 4 from that 2022 class to get done.

I think that is pretty much right. I would often say to people in the drought era when they couldn't countenance any credit to any player or any thing..... just because the Bills are bad does mean every player is bad an every decision is wrong. Equally now when the Bills are good it doesn't mean every player is good and every decision they make is right. Both of those positions are major over simplifications. And agree we have had some talented rosters in the past. I think the 2022 roster going into that year looked pretty stacked (possible except for offensive line). But then Tre came back and wasn't the same guy, Von tore his ACL, Micah had the neck injury, Josh got banged up and had some off the field distractions and they were never quite the dominant force they had been the first 6 to 8 weeks. The 2024 roster I think overperformed expectation by a regular season win or two and probably by a round in the post-season. That isn't to excuse the AFCCG loss, because the Bills had opportunities to win that game that they missed. But that was a year of small overachievement. And even within that, to bring it back to the OT Kincaid was a disappointment. I have said I'd be open to trading him. Not for pennies in the pound or anything, I don't want to give him away.... but this is a deep tight end class - I think Knox is a better fit for the offense we want to run and if there was a good deal out there for Dalton that got us a day 2 pick back? I'd definitely consider it. I don't think it will happen mind you and on the basis he is still here 2025 is massive for Dalton. They have to take the option decision at the end of next year and right now, I'm pretty sure they would decline it. He needs to move the dial. p.s. - just one point on the "if you remove Allen" thing 'cos it gets thrown out a lot... I think there is such a range within removing Allen. Are we removing him and starting Mitch Trubisky? Because that is only happening with an injury and if any team loses their franchise QB for most of the year they are pretty sunk. Let's say Josh's broken hand week 1 was a broken wrist (thank the fates it wasn't).... I think we'd have ended up maybe a 5 win team.

You mean Daboll