White Linen

What is one reason Bruce would be there?

To me the idea of DEPENDING on a guy like Easley is what kept the bills in their 12 year hole. I don't mind letting him compete for the roster and then playing time, but relying on unknowns is not what good teams do. Take the steelers they don't get rid of guys until they see their backups perform.

I don't think the question is how much Chandler cost although it's included obviously. As you said we were 30 Million under the cap. Stevie got an average of 7.25 as you know, I don't know how that breaks down in regards to front to back of the contract, but for simple math purposes we'll use 7.25. So that's 22.75 left from Stevie, Say Chandler got 3 million - that leaves 19.75. Beyond the cap being raised next year, assuming we will spend all the way to the cap we have 19.75 to work with. How do you suggest we extend Jackson, Wood, Levitre, and Byrd - and sign a pass rusher, LB, WR, Bell, sign our rookies drafted this year, and any other free agent (i.e Morrison)? Obviously you'd have to subtract the salaries of Wood, Jackson, Levitre, and Byrd (already counted in our number) vs what their impending raise would be. Just say they all get $2 million per year raises, that's another $16 million for just those players. No doubt players will get cut between this year and next that will fluctuate things, but my point is we don't have the money to just say hell sign everyone we want we have $30 million dollars. I honestly think it's prudent to consider the idea of not signing Jackson. I love the guy, one of my favorites for sure, but with Spiller there and bringing in another guy to go after the tough yards Spiller can't (ie Choice) to me is something to consider. Especially when we have a lot of areas that money can be used for. I think Spiller proved what he could do, even with a plethora of team injuries. I think we need to understand that extending Fred plainly translates that we won't be able to do very important other things. So again what would you concede to, in order to have two able RB's?

Ok signing Fred won't stop us from signing anyone we need either currently on our team or free agents. I guess we have unlimited funds. You're not understanding my point, maybe in hindsight you will. Pun intended.

Of course not, but I do believe having 12-13 million per tied up in 2 running backs has to stop us from doing something. You don't get 25-30 million every year, that's just what we are under the cap now. How can we sign Stevie, Chandler, Bell, free agent pass rusher, free agent LB, free agent #2 wide receiver, and extend Fred - without it effecting our ability to extend Wood, Levitre, or Byrd within the confines of 25-30 million. We can't just say cut Kelsay and Merriman and there's the money. Good teams loose good players every year. There's just a point where you have to say goodbye to players in order to stay viable.

I wasn't drawing comparison's to their decisions, only to say when you get in trouble with money you have to cut players like Wimbley. What player would you be willing to part with to sign Fred? Levitre, Wood, or Byrd?

Yep and the Bills will be right there with them if they do crazy things like extend Fred Jackson.

Perfectly said.

Here's the two parts I agree with.

You mean like the second round where Troup was drafted?

I don't know that there are legit pass rushers that would be happy to come to Buffalo, so I think we all need to get used to the idea of a rookie, Kelsay and Merriman for our pass rush.

I want to start by saying I absolutely love everything about Fred Jackson. I'll get killed for saying this, but I just believe it to be true. I think it would be bad business to sign Fred to an extension. You have a 1st round draft pick in Spiller that your paying big money to, and then if you give Fred 5-6 million you'd be among the league leaders for the position. Do any of you really want to tie that kind of money up at that position? Let Fred play next year, let the kid take over, and say thank you very much for running the ball for us. I know that sounds cold, but that's the NFL. We can't afford to set this franchise back even further just to be nice to Fred Jackson.

I guess they'd trade him for a 4th round pick and watch him get cut the next season.

Makes sense, comparable to the money Peppers got. My guess is it may be more like $16 million per year. I however think there's 0% chance he comes to Buffalo.

I'm definitely not "some people". I feel like I've been pretty fair. And my comment was towards Fitz and not Stevie. I just can't totally embrace Fitz enough to feel like we have the guy. I realize he's our guy and hope he emerges. Are you saying you have little doubt that he's good enough to get totally excited about?

Yes he is.

Of course franchising him is out of the question. But as many have stated the issue is what is he worth to the Bills vs the open market. Most believe that he will garner much more money in free agency, but I'm not sure. I think teams that have a need at LT will look at Bell but won't shell out big money (I.E. 7.5-8 million per year), but he will get enough attention that he'll get more than the Bills will spend. Ultimately I think Bell has most likely played his last game as a Bill.

Boy do I wish I could get excited about this relationship. Problem is Fitz just isn't that good so it seems more goofy than cool for me.

Yeah good call. I was way off. I thought it would be closer to 5 years $48 Million.

My prediction was 6 years $58 million, $21 million guaranteed. With it being reported to be a 5 year deal I'll go with the similar numbers 5 years $48 million and $16 million guaranteed.

Whether they're interested in Ward or not will have nothing to do with Stevie Johnson.

That's not what you said, you said we're all wrong for not thinking we should take Claiborne.

I actually sort of agree if you're talking about Stevie being among the elite receivers right now. The answer is no. If you're comparing skill for skill he is not elite. But I don't think that's the argument. The argument is that he's 25 and all the stats that I looked up prove that WR's peak between 25 and 31 (Rice, Reed, Owens, Fitzgerald, etc). The fact that he's produced the last 2 years, shows that he deserves and will get elite money on the premis that he will emerge as one of the games elite. The argument that he won't ever emerge is just as speculative as the argument that he will, no one knows. But the Bills as an organization can't afford to allow the opportunity to let this young man become that for them leave.

why do we keep coming back to this same question?