OldTimer1960
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Posts posted by OldTimer1960
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3 hours ago, FireChans said:
If next years WR at #28 was going to be a better prospect than a WR at 41+ this year, this would be a good point.
You don’t know that next year’s pick will be #28, could be in the teens if the season doesn’t go according to our wishes.
And we don’t know that the guys available at 41 are any better than they could get next year in the first. Who is the special star they can get at 41 that is sure to be better than a first round one next year? But, I am fine with addressing WR this year at 28 and maybe even 60, just recognize they are likely to need a starting DE next year to replace Miller and a starter at CB to replace Douglas who will be 31 then.
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10 minutes ago, nosejob said:
I'm for keeping 28 unless someone like Latu, Thomas or Murphy are there 24-28.
But, I am all for trading next years 1st to maybe GB for 41 and 88....unless there's a better deal to be made.
Point is we need 4 picks in the first 100 and our later picks can be used to jockey around if need be. We still have 2 2nds next year.
Next year’s first might not even be worth pick 41 in this draft. You are unlikely to get 41+ more for it. It’s poor business overall trading future picks.
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3 hours ago, Solomon Grundy said:
Let's revisit the games last year that the Bills lost because of dropped passes at crucial times or not being on same page as QB.
I am not disputing that the Bills need WR help.
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8 minutes ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:
No draft rounds in this; just how a prospect would fit on the team.
I think Cooper could be potential ROTY in this scheme.
I agree that he would be a great addition.
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3 minutes ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:
Thank you!
Robinson, Latu, and Verse: Crazy enough, probably DE3/4 unless Von looks horrible. High potential though and would all still see plenty of snaps in the rotation with opportunities to rush the passer.
What does Cooper Dejean look like at Safety?
I think DeJean would make an outstanding S, but I think Late first is a bit early for S.
Back to the DEs, I think any of those 3 are likely better out of the gate than any DE currently on the roster, but Miller likely still starts, at least early season out of deference to his great career. As you can tell, I’m not optimistic that Miller can bounce back from last season - I of course hope that he can.
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2 hours ago, HappyDays said:
Where there is smoke … oh wait that was just Beane coming back from the dispensary.
I’m with many here - if they like him, ok in the 2nd, but still not what I would do. I just don’t see him as a receiver worth even a late 1st. I don’t think adding Coleman gets the Bills any more wins than they would get without him.
1 hour ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:In my mind, there are five WRs who seem projected to be WR1s: Harrison, Oduze and Nabers sound like slam dunks. Brian Thomas has one year that shows that he could be. Adonai Mitchell has the physical gifts, but sounds like a project.
After that? Everyone sounds like a situational piece. Now, is there a decent chance that one of those 5 is a bust, and we are talking about a gem that all the others teams missed? I'd say so. But it seems that if he misses out on Thomas, Beane want to be in position to have his favorite of the 2nd tier and have the ammo to take him somewhere in the 2nd round.
I’d go a bit higher than “situational pieces”. I think there are several more who have potential to be solid or better starters.
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4 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:
There are SO many possibilities in the draft, some realistic and unrealistic, I thought maybe it would be fun to play a little game to explore the different potential impacts. The title is a work in progress.
Here is how this will work, I’m going to start off naming 1 prospect. You will tell me how you this that prospect would impact the roster if drafted by the team.
After, name another prospect and another poster will reply with what they think their impact would be on this team.
I think this is a good exercise to get us thinking about all the impactful players that could get drafted here, even if it’s not someone we expect.
It doesn’t matter if the Bills acquiring said talent is realistic or not.
I’ll start us off: WR Troy Franklin
Troy Franklin obviously interests the Bills, but I don’t think he is worth a late first round pick. He would certainly have a chance to help the Bills passing offense right away, but I have a lot of reservations about him. I think the number of visits and workouts he has had with the Bills means that they are still not sure what to make of him. Is he what he looked like on film or is he what he looked like at the Combine? I think at minimum he can be Gabe Davis - better in the passing game, but nowhere near the blocker Davis is. I’m concerned about inconsistent hands, his thin stature and whether he can become a more refined route runner. If he reaches his potential, he might become a good deep threat who can make plays at the intermediate level as DBs will have to respect his deep speed. I don’t think he will be dominant, but he could be good+.
4 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:No one? 👎🏻
No one has an opinion on what Troy Franklin or Marvin Harrison would look like on the Bills?
Kool-aid McKinstry?
I think McKinstry would be interesting. I don’t think it’s out of the question that he could beat out Douglas or Benford. CB is a much bigger need than many think.
I’ll play: how would Chop Robinson, Laiatu Latu or Jared Verse impact the Bills?
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9 minutes ago, julian said:
So what is it.. 12 picks now ? That’s crazy
Most of that currency is nickels and pennies. Counting the number of picks without regard to the total value is pretty meaningless. The media hyped the whole “11 picks” thing. In reality, the 11 picks they have combined are worth less than some other team’s first round pick on its own.
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4 minutes ago, Virgil said:
I agree that we may not be as good as last offseason, but I also think most teams took a step back and the playing field will be level.
What's tough for me is there's not a lot of good value between picks 20-60. So you are either going to reach, or lose to teams who reached.
Agree - for me, I would take the best BPA at WR, DE, DT, CB in round 1 (or after trade down), then repeat the rest of the way while expanding the positions to choose from as it gets later in the draft. Smaller trade ups using later picks to nail guys they like, if there are any that late.
I could possibly see them being in the race for division or wild card this year, but I don’t think they are really challenging for the Super Bowl this season. So, no need to stress about filling one specific need.
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41 minutes ago, nosejob said:
2025 Picks be damned. We need pieces in place this year and it just so happens to be a good year to do it.
For example: If somehow Murphy or Latu make it to 24, IDK if I can pass that, so that means throwing a 2025 1st, 26-32 pick and a 2nd in that area to get right back in the game. I'd turn that 1st into a 2nd and 3rd and that 2nd for a 3rd.
I'm not worried. We can get a WR at 28 then whatever at 60 and sit on our thumbs for 68 more picks. Does anyone really think that's what will happen?
Beane's gonna have an amazing draft!
Looking at the roster, this team, in my opinion, needs a lot more than 2 WR and they are not going to address those gaps in one offseason. Nobody wants to admit that this team probably will not be as good as it has been the last few years.
I think that the front office saw that as an opportunity to do a mini-rebuild, especially on defense. They have seemingly improved their cap situation going forward in the process.
i know that I am in the minority of fans, but I am fine with that approach. But, if we recognize that is what is going on and that they need at least 1 starting WR and another young one, a pass rusher to replace Von Miller, another starter at CB for after 30 y.o. Douglas is done and hopefully 2 better safeties than they have now, then it lessens the urgency to get both WR this year.
Keep next year’s picks and use them when they have full value unless there is an opportunity to get a definite star in a trade up. 35 years of following the draft tells me that none of these prospects are absolutely sure things, so I don’t think giving up future picks at less than face value is wise in most circumstances.
To your last point, I think they will try to use their excess 4th, 5th and 6th picks to make small moves up.
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22 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:
I guess I would trade back (out of the first) at this point. Regarding trading that 2025 second rounder, I'm looking at this - https://walterfootball.com/draft2025charlie.php - and noticing a lot of pass rushing talent going early. I could see the Bills being all in on that position come 2025 and will want the draft capital to move up. They'll need to replace Von Miller.
I would not want to trade next year’s picks this year. Going in, you are accepting $0.50 on the dollar when you do that. The 2025 picks are worth a round more next year than they are this year.
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I voted trade down if possible. There are still a number of WR left and most could help the Bills if they pan out. I don’t know that I’d be tempted by Nate Wiggins, but I would have had to think hard if Verse, Latu or even Robinson is left.
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3 hours ago, Mat68 said:
If they trade down and pick up an extra day 2 pick I think he could be part of a double dip. Coleman paired with Worthy, Franklin or Wilson is more palpable imo. Coleman could be a fine wr but need to know what he is and is not. Power slot with some jump ball ability in the redzone. A traditional X I'm not convinced he is.
Coleman seems riskier than others, so I would steer away (unless they are absolutely convinced he is the bomb) regardless who else the Bills pick. In the scenario you pose that Coleman is a big slot and jump ball specialist, it hurts because he is competing them for targets with Kincaid, Shakir and Samuel. I don’t think adding someone else like Worthy or Franklin mitigates that. In spite of that, the role he seems fit for is too specialized (my opinion) to warrant a 2nd round pick.
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2 minutes ago, SCBills said:
I have to back up what is said about Coleman.
I know his testing has him down in the eyes of many, and I'm not sure I love the idea of taking him in RD1, but it's hard to square his testing numbers with how he looked on the field. They don't match up.
I think they do matchup pretty well. He is rarely open vs man and that fits with his testing numbers. Now, can he overcome that with physicality in the league? Maybe, but I don’t want to bet on that early in the draft.
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34 minutes ago, DCOrange said:
I really think a trade back is the ideal play, if they can find a partner and get fair compensation. 1 WR, even 2 are not catapulting this team to the SB while they are doing a reboot on D. As it stands, the presumed starter at LDE had 0 sacks last season and while I like Epenesa and Toohill as backups, I don’t think we want them starting. It’s going to take 2 off-seasons to get 2 WR, likely a starter at CB for when Douglas moves on, backup CB, future starter at 1T DT (Jones is getting up there), and a better S or 2 given their current guys at that position.
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9 minutes ago, H2o said:
Please, dear Lord, DO NOT let the Bills draft Keon Coleman. PLEASE.
Or Kamron Kinchens before round 3 (and they don’t currently have a pick there)
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31 minutes ago, DCOrange said:
Working off of this consensus big board: https://www.nflmockdraftdatabase.com/big-boards/2024/consensus-big-board-2024
I would go with Javon Baker and Jacob Cowing at WR. Both are top 10 WRs in this class IMO.
The consensus big board still has Drake Maye as the #2 prospect in the class, but it feels like a lot of the people in the mainstream media are pushing him down their boards and I think that's a major mistake.
Where do you envision that Cowing would play? He is very short and light.
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On 4/9/2024 at 2:09 PM, Logic said:
Just as the title says. In your opinion, what player is the draft community too low on, that you think will (or at least should) be drafted higher than where the analysts and the draftniks have him going currently?
I'll start:
Troy Franklin, WR, Oregon.
I get it, it's a great WR class. Still, for all you hear about the big three, Brian Thomas, AD Mitchell, Xavier Worthy, Keon Coleman...Troy Franklin tends to be an afterthought. Yes, he's skinny. He's also fast, silky smooth, has legitimate ability to win deep, and posted quality production at Oregon the past two years, including 1383 yards and 14 touchdowns in 2023. To me, he's akin to a Devonta Smith, Chris Olave type, if perhaps a step down (though not a big one) in overall talent from those two.
I think everyone is too low on Troy Franklin. I'm not sure that, after the big three receivers, he's not the next best guy. I like him a lot.
So who's yours? Which player is the draft community too low on?Hi game tape is pretty good to my fan’s eye and Franklin’s athletic testing at the combine was very good, but I just can’t get his field work at the combine out of my head - it stuck out to me as pretty bad for a guy who will never be able to win with size and strength to have that much trouble in the gauntlet and also stumble more than once running patterns with no defender there at the combine.
If they like him, I will get on board, but if he is the best WR available at 28, then I’m betting there will be better prospects at other positions like DE, DT, CB, OT - all premium positions and those defensive positions are all big needs either immediately or in some cases for 2025.
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9 minutes ago, BillsPride12 said:
Yeah I didn't take your original post as you pounding the table for the guy but I was just making a general statement on my thoughts on that situation. I mean I would love to have a monster DE but this guy just makes me nervous and it's just a position we really can't afford to take a risk on. My opinion has been we are really looking at the next two draft classes to totally restock the cupboards and at this point I would prefer for them to wait until next year to go after DE
Completely agree that this is a 2 off-season retooling. From that perspective, I wouldn’t force WR in round 1 if there are better options at other important positions T, DT, DE, CB.
I don’t mean to imply that I am against WR in the first, I just am not “WR is the only option “
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On 4/9/2024 at 8:35 AM, HaldimandBills said:
People don't want to hear this but I personally believe a few receivers are being bumped up into Round 1 and early Round 2 who are big risks.
Xavier Worthy
Troy Franklin
Keon Coleman
These guys provide a ridiculous skill set but have a few more red flags than the
Ladd McConkey and Xavier Legette of the world. AD Mitchell you better be damn sure he's going to reach his potential otherwise that can be bust.
Basically I could comfortably see these guys having better pro careers than the first three mentioned.
Ricky Pearsall
Malachi Corley
Roman Wilson
Brenden Rice
Malik Washington
Jalynn Polk
Jermaine Burton (character questions)
I think we are just realizing that it is a very good WR class with 3 great prospects at the top, 1 Uber talented guy (Thomas Jr) alone on the next tier and then a pack of guys who you might rather take in the 2nd than in the first, plus there are pretty good prospects into probably the 3rd round.
Every one of the guys after Thomas have some question marks (and Thomas does as well, but his physical ability and deep ball prowess present a pretty high floor.
Mitchell - a lot of smoke about not always putting in his best effort
McConkey - durability concerns and is he mostly a slot WR
Worthy - 165-170lbs
Coleman - separation ability and flat out speed
Franklin - rail thin, played in a conference that doesn’t play much D and his field work (not talking 40 time) at the combine was shaky.
Legette - age, 1 year production and we as a fan base seem to be much higher on him than the draft pundits - some of whom are fairly tied into front offices. -
9 hours ago, BillsPride12 said:
The thing that makes me nervous with this guy even if he doesn't turn out to be a complete bust like Maybin but a JAG...we just cannot afford to whiff on another high draft pick DE prospect. If we rolled the dice on him we would need him to pan out as a legitimate NFL level DE and it just makes me really nervous.
I am not pounding the table to draft Robinson, I just think he has a lot of upside - which you correctly point out that he might not reach.
Again, I’m not advocating to take him, but I would argue that no player that they could take there is completely free of potential to be a JAG or complete bust. I know some were against taking Elam in the first, but I don’t think that many thought that he would never see the field and would only be hanging on to a roster spot by a thread because he is a former 1st round pick.
The draft is much more inexact than people want to believe and picking as late as the Bills are makes it that much more difficult.
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10 hours ago, wppete said:
Jacob Cowing - WR - Arizona
5’11 - 180
4.38 - 40 yard
He measured 5’8” and 168lbs at the combine, but he is very fast and quick.
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19 hours ago, Sestak4ever said:
Could be the case with another Penn State player this year, Chop Robinson.
There really is no comparison. Go watch some of Robinson play. He is fast, quick and strong. He is disruptive, but still needs a to develop more pass rush moves. Will he be great? I don’t know that, but he won’t be a flat bust like Maybin.
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11 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:
Gunner, you can't say that the Jets haven't drafted well with the exception of the QB position
When you are picking early in each round, it is a lot easier to draft well.
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What If… Bills Draft Game 2024
in The Stadium Wall
Posted
Sweat seems like an ideal player to replace Daquan Jones next year, except that his recent DUI and frequent weight problems are concerning.
How about: Ladd McAconkey?