weehawk

How quickly we forget some basic facts: 1) No one of any caliber wants to work for RW in the FO or the coaching staff 2) No proven, high-quality players want to come here unless handed insane amounts of money (MWilliams) 3) No up-and-coming players want to come here mainly due to ownership uncertainty, FO, and coaching issues So...let's recap. This team will not change as long as RW owns the Bills. Only after the team changes hands and its long-term residency in BUF is nailed down will high-quality FO and superstar player talent consider coming here. My best advice...find something else to do on Sunday until further notice. Have the radio in the background if you must, but for god's sake dont spend 3.5 hrs actually watching this mess of a team.

KC is hardly an NFL powerhouse and Fitz still sux. If Spiller gets injured, the season is over. So we won a game. Big woop. Do it at least nine more times and make the playoffs. Then I'll be impressed. Until then it was a mediocre win against a mediocre team. MAKE THE PLAYOFFS! That's all that matters. Anything less is just another wasted season.

You used a lot of words and really didn't say much in relation to the title of the post. They're good, but they're really not that good. They might make the playoffs, they might not. The team is the same team you've been watching for the last 10+ years. They're barely even a tease anymore. Fitz sux and the D is bad. No domination by us is taking place this year on either side of the ball. We'll win some games and not make the playoffs. I just summed up your 100+ words in 9 words.

My honest opiniion? No, it wont be terribly missed. 1) WNY is flooded with Canadians buying everything they can get their hands on. There's no shortage of out-of-towners spending money in the area that has nothing to do with the Bills 2) The people that come for games from far enough away to need a hotel is not that large. 3) People tnat will come for a game probably have family in the area and will come and visit (and spend money) whether there's a game or not. If you're ONLY coming for the game, then all the power to you. It's just not that much money in the overall scheme of things. Look, there's money involved. No doubt. I'm just trying to point out that it's nowhere near the amounts that some people talk about. The Bills are an asset. How much of an asset a perennial loser is is open to debate. People talk about the loss of the part-time jobs. It's 8 days a year. Surely people can find other ways to make money. If not, they'll be on the dole at some point either way. I sincerely dont believe that there are that many out-of-towners that come to the games. Sure, there's a few. Let's say 5% of a sold out house. That's 3600 people. Let's say they each spend $1000 (which is a stretch) during their visit. That's $36k a game. Sorry, looking at the big picture, $36k is a just not that much money. No way do those same people come to the two or three December games. So let's say it's $36k for five games. $180k each season? That's not enough money to make the argument that the area needs to mortgage itself to keep the team at all costs. You raise good points. It's really a matter of knowing for sure how many people come from out-of-town ONLY for games and nothing else. No one knows that for sure, but realistically it's not that many people.

Nothing less than a playoff appearance really matters anymore. It does not matter if they go on a 9 game winning streak. If they finish 9-7 and out of the playoffs, what did that prove? The disease was cured long ago my friend. The devil has been exorcized. They can stay, they can go. It just doesn't matter anymore without seeing some winning. Winning means making the lousy playoffs. Forget about winning a SB. That aint happnin. Cant they just win enuf games to get in as a wild card? Just once? I'll always love them and care about them, but I wont turn a blind eye to the travesty that this team has become. As far as the lease goes, I've posted on that before. The area loses nothing if they leave. The money people spend on the Bills will be spent on other entertainment outlets or god forbid saved for college or something. The only real problem would be what to do with the stadium. Other than that, it's a financial wash if they leave. I know, Joe beer hawker will be out of a job. So what? For 8 days a year he doesn't sell beer? Not the makings of a financial crises in my book. Call their bluff and let them leave. Where are they going to go? LA or TO? Spare me.

The bottom line is that good QBs dont want to sign here. It's just like Shane Doan in the NHL. He's ready to bail if the PHO ownership situation is not figured out. What elite QB is going to want to sign here, knowing that the owner is 90+ years old and has left no publicized transition plan in place. This is what needs to change in order for the team to improve. We need new, stable ownership that has deep pockets and a will to win. Right now we none of that. Fine, RW is not cheap, but man he can be frugal. In regards to VY, I can only surmise that he was not an "emotional" fit and hence released. He has the skills, but apparently not the mind-set. No one else on the NFL appears to want him. I had no real confidence in Fitz to begin with, but he has not shown any of the stuff he had early last season. Something's wrong and it be long before this season goes bye bye.

I hate to pile on, but I called this along with a lot of other people. I caught crap for not being a homer fan boi, but there you have it. One guy thought I was a trolling Jets fan. We have some real geniuses on the board that refuse to see this team for what it is...again. 1) I knew the Jets would win and cover the dopey 3 point spread. I'm counting the money now. The Bills will be huge underdogs the rest of the season. This was your chance to cash in. 2) Fitz has shown that he is a second stringer at best. Coaches/GMs come out of Harvard, not first-string NFL QBs. 3) No playoffs again 4) Only a change in ownership will right this ship I've seen plenty of comments about RW is not cheap, is cheap, blah blah. Apparently, we have a deep-rooted culture within the team that is not about winning at all costs, but about making money at all costs. Until this ownership and his minions are out, you can expect this to go on and on and on. Chan is not the man and Buddy is far from a genius. Who makes Fitz their number one QB? No one else in this league, that's who. I still think they go 8-8, but that's about as much optimism that I'll place on this team.

Please re-read my post. IF THEY MAKE THE PLAYOFFS, I'LL WATCH. I dont watch regular season anymore unless I have money down on the game. Look, I know it's a downer and I dont have answers to all of the Bills woes. We have a great fan base and a lousy team. Maybe if we had even ONE playoff game in the last 10+ years I wouldn't have this attuitude. But this team is like the Lions used to be. BTW, nobody's running me off the board because I'm realisitc about chances. You want to live the dream, go for it. I want a winning team (this year and every year). I just dont see where all of the optimism is coming from. The team made some improvements in some areas but are still totally overmatched in others. You listen to every single NFL pundit and they'll tell you this league is about the QB. Fitz is in the lower half of QBs and he's far from elite. Just that one fact alone should have people seriously reconsidering their optimism. When it comes to the Bills...plan for the worst and hope for the best. Hey tardo. I'm 52 and saw games at the Rockpile. I'm more of a die-hard lifelong Bills fan than you can ever hope to be. The team sux and has for countless years. Get over yourself fan boy.

The Jets suck. We should beat them, but we probably wont. I dont think anyone is going to go crazy over who wins this one. Most intelligent Bills fans will say.."that's nice, now go win 10 more so we can make the playoffs." Sorry, maybe I'm too jaded now. The regular season has become an exersize in futility for much too long. A ton of wasted Sunday afternoons and absolutely nothing in return. Most games have hardly been entertaining on route to the loss. Nothing short of a playoff berth will stoke my enthusiasm for this team. I dont care if they go 9-0 to start. If they finish 9-7 and out of the playoffs, then what did those nine wins do for us other than waste a lot of time? Lots of better things to do on Fall Sundays. If they make the playoffs, I'll stop what I'm doing and watch and cheer. Otherwise...a big yawn for the regular season until the Bills can prove that they have a bonafide team.

I'm loud and proud. I have my bet in for the Jets to cover and I already know how I'm spending my winnings. woo hoo Close game in the first half and then the Bills lie down and it's over. Rinse and repeat. Same thing we've seen for over a decade. Nothing's really changed this year. We're using a backup QB as our starter, we have no Oline and therfore no rush, and we have an average D. I suppose this could be one of those years where we rattle off five early wins and then go 6-10 for the year. I truly feel for BUF sports fans this year. No Bills team (again) and a likely hockey lockout. Time to plan for that big indoor renovation project. You'll have the time and money this winter.

Man, I hope we're both wrong about no playoffs. Those ten snaps better result in two TDs. If the most we're going to see of the first string was that steaming pile against PIT, we are in for another long year.

How is it furthest from the truth? Both first teams should be out for the first half. Sure, they'll be getting a last look at some bubble guys, but we'll see the more of the first team than we have all pre-season. They've not showed a whole lot of anything good yet. So this last pre-season game will be indicative of how the first team is going to perform. What happened last November really doesn't matter. Both teams have changed and it's a new season. Citing stats/results from last year doesn't convince me of a thing. Our O is weak. Fitz is average, and unless we smash-mouth them with a lot of running, we're going to lose. Sorry for heaping on more steaming piles. I'm just not seeing a playoff-bound team here. I'm too old to bother with the whole..."it's a new season and anything can happen" mantra. This team is not a playoff contender (once again).

Yes, it is a steaming pile. I think the team is heading in the right direction, but our problems are so deep and wide that it's going to be another season or two before we see the playoffs again. The DET game could be telling. The last pre-season game is usually a true warm-up to the regular season. If they finish strong, it could carry over and then you never know. Personally, I have my doubts about Fitz. He's a good backup, but he's not a playoff-caliber starter. We still need an O-line too. Maybe the D can carry us for a few games.

The Jets are not very good. If we cant mop the field with them, then we are very far away from the 10-6 or 11-5 predictions that many people made for this season. Everyone pretty much had us beating them both times. Now it's going to be a close, low-scoring game? Not a good sign. The Bills appear to be a paper lion with no real teeth on either O or D. Jets will likely be a 3 point fav simply becasue of home field. I'm a Bills fan BTW. Bet on the Jets to cover a 3-point spread at home. Jets 17 Buf 9

I was one that did. Dont worry though, I'm not eating any crow over this. This team looks bad with or without VY. The Oline is weak and Fitz is still going down by week 6. Good thing with have Pig and TJ. I'm sure we'll be ok.

I've got a better suggestion, but probably not a very popular one. Dont take an 8 and an 11 yr old for the entire season. Unless you want your kids to start saying the "F" word and other salty comments, you're better off finding something else to do with them. NFL stadiums are not great places for little kids. In fact most college stadiums aren't either. Lots of drinking, swearing, etc goes on. Not sure why you want to expose your kids to that for 7 games. I would definitely not tailgate with them. Sure the atmosphere is great...for 25 yr olds, not for 8 year olds. Pick a game or two and try it out. Then see if you want to invest in full season tickets for both of them.

Lots of talk about the RWS stadium renovation and the bill that has climbed past $200 million dollars. We dont know who's paying what yet, but we can be assured that the State/County will be kicking in a lot of it. Today Mark Polancarz announced that Erie County property tax hikes are likely coming for various reasons. So...dont bother responding if you're an apt dweller. You have no skin in this game. If you are an Erie County homeowner, are you ok with seeing your property taxes going up AGAIN, while the State/County, etc pitches in for that $200+ stadium reno? Note: I'm all for keeping the stadium safe and viable. I'm also more than confident that this could be done for far less than $200 million. Keep votin' those Democrats into office. The next wave of foreclosures is coming from folks who can no longer afford their property taxes.

Fond memories? Really? I went to some games there as a kid. My god it was awful. Just going from your car to the front gate was like a trip through downtown Mogadishu. The inner city kids trolling for victims on the way in and the broken car windows on the way out. It's why most cities in the 70s and 80s built their facilities on the outskirts of town. No one wanted their new stadium or arena built in the city. No way was a modern stadium ever going to be built at the Rockpile site and there was no way to renovate the existing heap of a building.

Total crap shoot. You could get soaked with beer, punched, cursed at, etc. It all depends on who starts up trouble and whether or not you're near them. I dont buy the notion that season ticket holders are less rowdy or that some sections are better then others. I've seen stuff start up almost everywhere. At the very least, the kid will hear some pretty bad language. At the worst, you'll be in the middle of a donnybrook started by some total loser(s). FWIW, I never took my kids to any games.

This guy was an NFL star for roughly five seasons and is not that old or terribly injured. He's had his issues, but there's not too many squeaky clean QBs anymore. They all have issues. Some teams do a better job of keeping their issues out of the public eye than others. I'll say it here and now that VY will be our starting QB at some point next season. Fitz will implode and VY will eat his lunch. This is a GREAT move but ONLY if VY wants this to be his big comeback. A one year contract says to VY...it's now or never. I think if he gets the chance, he'll be huge for this team.

Are you silently saying that the team would move if not given carte blanch from NY taxpayers. If yes, then you dont appear to be paying much attention to other NFL cities with so-called "stadium issues." It's a simple fact that no NFL team currently has a viable moving option, short of San Antonio and that's a stretch. I'm interested in hearing from anyone that believes that any NFL team has an option to move now or in the next five years. LA and Toronto are not viable options. In the case of Toronto, I dont think they will ever be a viable option as I find it very unlikely that the Canadian govt will shell out for a new NFL-ready stadium. The NFL wont accept a permanent move into the Rogers Dome. The way NY taxpayers are fleeced already, I'm blown away that anyone is ok with this. I'm not advocating that the team be kicked out of town and I'm not advocating that NY State pay nothing. But until the long-term ownership issues are locked down, I think it's just crazy to invest anything more than the bare minimum to keep the facility operating safely in it's current form. We'll see what the lease agreement looks like, but if history is any indicator, the taxpayers will not be protected.

Most of us woke up to the news this morning that RWS renos are trending more toward $200 million! Based on the article the renos are *not* safety oriented and are more along the lines of "modernizing" the facility. Tax increases of some sort will definitely be involved to pay for this. Is everyone ok with that in order to have the gates moved out? Are Bills fans ok with seeing ticket prices go up 20-30% to pay for it? Just curious.

This is just a ploy to take people's minds off of the $100+ million the taxpayers are about to be hit up for for RWS renos. It's pretty basic mind games. Get everyone worked up over a $1 billion stadium that of course is never going to happen anyway. Then when the RWS reno bill comes in, everyone says... "Well that's a lot less than $1 billion for a new building. Sounds like a good deal." Since this keeps coming up, I'll keep saying the same thing... Until the future ownership issues are resolved, taxpayers should ONLY pay the bare minimum needed to keep the stadium safe. The team has no real leverage. They have no where to move to now or in the next five years at least. BUF is not getting a new stadium and until the future ownership issue is addressed, the taxpayers should be investing only the bare minimum in RWS. It could be empty in a few years, so why put $100 million into it if you only need to spend $25 million to keep it safely operating as it currently exists?

A few points: 1) RWS is not archaic in any sense of the word. The State and County have pumped millions into it over the years. I think most people would agree that short of a new billion dollar palace, or a half billion dollar renovation, that RWS is an ok venue. 2) While no one knows exactly what is being contemplated, when I hear $100 million+ being discussed, I think it's pretty obvious that we're not talking about patching up some concrete and adding a few new beer stands. I know I keep repeating myself...I'm good with spending only enough money to keep it safe and that's it for now. I simply dont believe that $100 million+ is required for safety work. 3)Keep it safe for now and then see what happens after RW passes. How does this sound... * We spend $100 million+ now * RW passes in two years * His family says no hometown discount or other considerations for a local buyer * The team leaves I know everyone will jump on the idea that our elected leaders will somehow safeguard our $100 million+ investment through "ironclad" contracts/leases. I dont buy it. There are numerous examples of contract loopholes, court verdicts, etc that make me highly skeptical of anything the govt does in relation to protecting my tax money. Keep it a viable, safe building for now and then see what the future brings. $100 million+ is not required to keep it a safe and viable venue.

The "bluff" is the unspoken assertion that the team will move if the taxpayers dont pony-up big money for RWS. Sure, he can go year-to-year, but if anyone is truly paying attention (specifically to the LA situation), it could be ten years before anything happens there. Considering we're looking at only a ten year lease for them to stay, I say call the unspoken bluff. Keep the stadium safe and relatively comfortable, but dont make taxpayers pay for upgrades/additions to luxury amenities that lines RWs pockets, but bleeds the taxpayers in the process. I like the idea of them going year-to-year right now. Then when RW passes and the family waves the middle finger to WNY, we can look back and say we made the right call by not giving them $100 million+ to stay. Once RW passes and IF someone does buy them and stays, then we can discuss long-term renovations and leases.