weehawk

As usual on this board, people take comments and turn them into something they are not. I dont recall seeing any posts that claim total abandonment of the team. Mine didn't. As far as money goes; I'm out all the way. The Bills came to NC (and won) but we didn't go. Sunday Ticket? No way! New hat, jersey, etc? NO! I'm absolutely done supporting this team financially. I have all the Bills stuff I could want and I certainly wont pay $400 a season to watch them on ST. I think the general consensus on most of the posts I read on any thread is this... OBD, PLEASE do something to resurrect this once fine franchise. Until or unless OBD shows that they are emotionally invested in this team, I will remain a relatively passive supporter.

+1 As a die-hard since the 60's, I have to say that they have pretty much run me ragged. The hiring of any coach would not be enough for me to re-invest emotionally. The needs of this team goes so far beyond a coach that the flurry of messages about CG seems surreal. The coach does not play, and we are seriously lacking in any real talent on the field. If we get a QB and an OL, maybe I'll get more interested. For now, if they're on free TV in NC and I have nothing better to do, I'll watch and root. Otherwise, there's other things to do on Sundays in the fall, especially down here. I'd never root against them, but for now I'm just indifferent. In other words, enough talk. Let's see them make the playoffs and then take it from there.

+1 DirecTV has to give us out of towners an ala carte option. No sense getting it without HD, so $414 to watch teams I dont care about is just dumb. Sure, it's a money maker for them, but I have to assume they have and continue to lose a fair amount of customers over their pricing in this economy. Time for them to give us a "Team Package" and charge way less. I'd sign up to watch even a crappy Bills team if I could get it at a reasonable cost. Watching it on the internet is a joke. How much would you pay to get only the Bills in HD? I'd go as high as $150 a season in HD.

Why is everyone so hung up about people starting new threads about previously discussed issues? Do you really think people are going to search everytime they want to bring up a subject? Cant you just ignore it? It takes more energy to criticize people then it does to just ignore it. You're never going to stop it and it's only going to get worse as the team goes through this reorg. If you think about it, EVERY conceivable topic has already been posted at one time or another. Do you honestly believe that people are going to bother? C'mon. Either add something constructive (even if it has been brought up before) or just ignore it. Life's too short.

Where's that douche Lori? She closed my post about this same subject two hrs ago. This board is turning into Nazi Germany.

Sorry if I missed this, but it's now official that LA will be going after the Jags and the Bills. Jaguars, Bills will be first targets of L.A. stadium builder Associated Press LOS ANGELES -- The company behind a plan to lure the NFL back to Los Angeles said Tuesday that the Jacksonville Jaguars and Buffalo Bills are the first teams it will try to relocate to Southern California. Majestic Realty Co. managing partner John Semcken said the company is still considering at least seven franchises for a new stadium in the city of Industry, some 25 miles east of Los Angeles. They also include the San Francisco 49ers, San Diego Chargers, Minnesota Vikings, St. Louis Rams and Oakland Raiders. Majestic Reality Co. / Associated Press Majestic Realty Co. hopes to lure an NFL team to a planned stadium in the city of Industry, located about 25 miles east of Los Angeles. However, Semcken said the Jaguars and the Bills are at the top of the list because they play in small markets that tamp down their earning potential and because they have little hope of building larger venues in their home regions. "Jacksonville and Buffalo are two teams in very, very small markets," Semcken said. "They are teams that have either outdated stadiums or are having trouble filling their stadiums or both." The Jaguars have struggled for years to fill Jacksonville Municipal Stadium and had seven of their eight regular-season games blacked out on local television this season. The Bills have played some home games in Toronto in an effort to expand their market. Messages were left seeking comment from the Jaguars and Bills. Jaguars majority owner Wayne Weaver and Bills owner Ralph Wilson have steadfastly dismissed any suggestion that they will sell or move their teams. Semcken said Majestic will not approach the 49ers, Chargers or Vikings as long as those teams are seeking stadium plans of their own. He said it wouldn't be fair to interfere with their efforts to remain in their home markets. Semcken also said Majestic chief executive Ed Roski's preference is to find owners willing to sell their franchise to a consortium of investors that he would lead, rather than buying a minority stake in a team that would move with its existing majority owner at the helm.

Supposedly, it has nothing to do with tax issues. When this all started, RW publicly stated that his heirs have no interest in owning the team. They want the money from a sale and nothing more.

look under FAQ

California is in bad shape economically (worse than NY if you can believe that). There's no public money available for any stadium schemes. Again from the LA site... Will you use public money and cause our taxes to go up? Just as we did with our Staples Center Project we will privately finance the stadium, office and retail project. The strength of the LA economy enables us to garner a higher price for naming opportunities, suites, club seats and sponsorships, which will enable us to privately finance the stadium and make the team financially secure. [/i] The Oakland Coliseum is old, but it's not like the Raiders deserve to play in anything better. The City and State put 200 million into it to get Davis to agree to come back in the 90's. I doubt that Oakland or the State will pay to do much more with the Coliseum. SD is pretty much in the same boat. They need public money to do anything and they wont get it. I think Oak or SD is going to end up in LA, with SD a slight favorite. Not sure what will happen with Jax or Min. If you research the net, San Antonio is one of the only viable options for any team looking to move. However, after LA and SA get teams, where would any other team be able to go? I highly doubt that Oak or SD would be able to lure a team without a new stadium in place. If you're the new owner of the Bills, would you risk your own money to renovate an old stadium after its existing team moves out? And in the case of Oak, moves for a second time in 20 years? I'd rather stay in Buf, take my chances with higher ticket prices, and move a second game to TO.

The new LA Stadium project has a website up. Here's what it says about what team might play there... Team Don’t take my Raiders or Chargers. It is our understanding that the National Football League has no intention of expanding, but they do want to be in Los Angeles. State-of-the-art stadiums are required for teams to stay competitive in today’s NFL. We do not control what team will play in the new Los Angeles Stadium, but we do know it will be an existing team that needs to move because they cannot build a new stadium or financially they are not successful in their current market. We can not disclose which teams we are talking with. So they are talking to teams and they have not ruled out snagging Oak or SD. This is getting interesting. If this group takes an existing Calif team and Jax goes to San Antonio before Ralph passes on, that would leave the Bills right where they are, with probably two regular season home games permanently going to TO. A new owner would have very limited moving options if LA and SA dont end up needing teams. http://www.losangelesfootballstadium.com/

He sux. Get rid of him. He's barely backup material. The team will not make the playoffs this year anyway. Give the team to Hamden and see if he's got anything. So far we're 0-2 with TE and RF.

It's easy to have a dedicated fan base when the average ticket price is $35. What happens to that base when they hit the league average of $75? Goodbye Bills, especially after 10+ losing seasons and no hope on the horizon. It's been said many times on this board. People go for the party, not for the Bills. Will people pay $75 simply to tailgate? I doubt it. Here's my take: 1) Ralph dies 2) Team goes up for sale to (probably) the highest bidder who has to borrow a lot of money or leverage a lot assets to afford the team, which is currently valued at $909 million 3) New owner claims that they love the city and the franchise 4) Another losing season comes and goes. New owner cant afford talent. He's paying off the huge loan to buy the team 5) New owner starts claiming that he cant field a winning team without more money 6) New owner raises ticket prices 7) Another losing season 8) New owner claims that the franchise may not be viable in the area even though we sell out every game 9) Ticket prices go up again. 10) Team still sucks and prices are now on par with NFL average of $75 11) Season ticket sales drop to all-time lowest level for Rich/RW Stadium 12) Team comes closer to playoffs, but still not in 13) Ticket sales continue to decline 12) New owner claims that the area wont support the team and he is "exploring options" 13) ??? Simple economics are in play here. * You likely wont get 73000 people to pay an average of $75 a ticket to watch a bad team. * There is no large corporate base in the area to keep the team going during leaner times. * No one is going to pay $909 million to keep the team in an economically depressed area with no large corporate base I predict that the team will be gone within three years of Ralph's demise. I hope I'm wrong. ote name='MaineMoxie' date='Nov 7 2009, 05:55 PM' post='1626765'] That's what kills me. National media people always like to talk about the Bills moving and yet we have one of the most dedicated fan bases in the league. What we don't have enough of is the corporate and luxury box support I guess and in this day and age that seems to be all that matters. Jacksonville will stay put if it can sell those luxury boxes even if they only get 40k fans per game. There's something wrong with a sports league where the fans are no longer one of the key components.

Who says a new stadium is needed? San Antonio has one rarein to go and the NFL Commish has already said that SA is on the NFLs radar. The team will likely move eventually. I simply dont see anyone buying them for a billion and then keeping them in Buffalo for their current average of $35 a ticket. If they do somehow stay, ticket prices will skyrocket and then we'll see what happens. None of this solves the problem of filling all of those luxury seats with high-paying corporations. My guess is that they barter a fair amount of those seats away now in return for various goods and services. A new owner is going to need CASH in order to service the debt that they will assume to buy the team. When it happens, you can thank the State of NY for losing the team. Utterly corrupt politicians and unions have destroyed the state's job base along with any potential for future growth.

The NFL avg is $75. The Bills avg is just under $35. It's one of the main reasons the team will likely leave with new ownership. This area will not support the team as it has at $75 a ticket. Ralph saw to that by fielding a losing team for a decade. Not to mention the State of NY and the unions trashing the upstate economy. Of course if you work in a union, I'm sure you'll argue that last point. Dont bother. It will fall on deaf ears.

Selling out games at $35 a pop (the Bills current average) is peanuts compared what they could get just about anywhere else. You raise the price to the current league average of $75 a ticket and you'll see a bunch of "fans" bail out fast. The Bills make almost $3 million a game less than teams that charge the average of $75 and that's just at the gate. Dont know what the Bills luxury box situation is, but it cant be too good. I remember a couple of years ago when they were begging the few big corporations in the area to buy boxes. They wont have to go begging in TO, San Antonio, or LA. The Bills WILL leave. It's just a matter of when.

The Bills are valued at $909 million. The Rams at $913 million according to Forbes. There will be no fan purchase of the Bills. In fact, it's doubtful that anyone will buy them for anything close to that price and keep them in WNY. Not enough corporations and not enough fans that will pay $100 a ticket. I'm afraid the Bills will leave the area sometime after RW goes.

Media = Center of all lies. Hope and change man, hope and change

Ok. I'll revise to reflect a previous comment I made. Odds are 4:1 against staying. I think their time in WNY is short, but I'll give them a 25% chance of staying as a concession to the possibility that a rabbit will be pulled. Yes, moving the team will cost. However, the overriding concern for any new owner in the area will be... How do I make money on this investment without a solid (and large) corporate base to fill all of my luxury boxes (and pay much more than they are now under RW) and fans willing to pony up almost double what they pay now for a single game ticket? I just dont see it happening. Between the way the State of NY operates and the depressed economy in the region, I cant see anyone taking the risk without a plan to leave. People are screaming now about how bad the team is. Yet, our ticket prices are lowest in the league. That's why the stadium is full. What happens when they double ticket prices and the team still sucks? Attendance will suffer and the new owner will want out at any cost. Just my opinions. I was born the year they entered the AFL and watched games in the Rockpile. Dont want to see them go, but the cards are stacked against them.

Ok. They're still leaving though. No one is going to invest a billion dollars in this team so they can charge $50 a ticket. If they do stay, the new owners will purposely price themselves out of the market so they can move. Pay close attention to whatever new lease is signed by any new owner. Not what the media tells you, the actual lease. Then have a lawyer review it and tell you it REALLY means. The area cannot support this team without RWs subsidy. He may be a jerk, but he is giving you $50 a game NFL football (even if it's crap). That all ends with a new owner.

Facts please. An article citing how much he spent. Simply saying it does not make it true. GO AWAY BILLS!

Here's a couple with quotes from both Goodell and Jones.... http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/cowboys...NFLs_radar.html http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/MYSA050...5d_html183.html More than any other city, SA is ready to go and the NFL has already "blessed" them. In my opinion, it's a matter of who goes first, JAX or BUF. LA is a long shot at this point. They need a stadium before they'll get a team. They're not going to put the NFL back into the Coliseum. I think TO has a better shot at a team vs LA. It's all a matter of timing at this point. I'm not even fully convinced that JAX is leaving. It all depends on how long RW stays in his Depends.

Excluding Trump, these guys are not going to invest almost 30% of their total wealth in the Bills. Also, how much of this total wealth is in ready cash? I'm sure it's far below the totals you quote. Keep digging, I'm sure you'll add Warren Buffet or Bill Gates to the list.

The NFL does not seem to have a problem with it, according to Goodell. Maybe it's one of those easily upgradeable stadiums.

maybe because Golisano cares about the area, but his other investors do not. personally, i dont think that tom is a serious candidate for the team. he cant buy it alone and i dont think he'll find enough buffalo-loving investors to drop over $900 million on the area. it's a really lousy investment. take your fan hat off and put your money hat on. would you spend $900 million on this team (and keep it in bflo) with no hope of ever recouping your money? NFL franchises are not going to double in value in our lifetimes.

99% of what is offered on this board is speculative. take my comments as you will. just google "jerry jones, revenue sharing" and you'll see where i'm coming from.