Ask Tim Graham, version 2.0

[TimGraham]

Comparing them to the Patriots?

 

It's OK for you to mention the Steelers (or the military), but I can't bring up the Patriots?

 

You're usually a much more compelling debater than this.

[TimGraham]

And, I disagree the advantage is "slight". The philosophy of "What's too tough for them, is just right for us" proved to be a major advantage for Bills teams in the past. Look at the Dolphin's historic record outside in December. They have won games outside in the bad weather, but it isn't their legacy.

 

Those teams won because they were great.

 

If being conditioned to play in the weather is such an advantage, why didn't the Bills win for 20 years before Jim Kelly got there? Joe Ferguson didn't have a field house or a practice bubble.

 

Head games are overrated.

[TimGraham]

Not for nothing, but "What's too tough for them is just right for us" was a Levy saying inspired by hot-weather fatigue.

[The Dean]

It's OK for you to mention the Steelers (or the military), but I can't bring up the Patriots?

 

You're usually a much more compelling debater than this.

 

 

The Pats* aren't a typical NFL comparison, IMO. They have relied on an unusually proficient system, built on one of the best coaches and QBs to ever grace the NFL, and or, the beneficiary of cheating and unrealistic aid from the NFL officials. Either way (or both) trying to emulate the Pats* is a fools' errand, IMO. Either they get the best possible breaks imaginable and/or they have a genius at the helm. You really can't decide to copy genius (or hope to copy the recipient of divine intervention), IMO. I wouldn't compare any team to the Colts, either, as they have something most other teams don't...a world class QB. The success of both organizations are a function of their current circumstances.

 

OTOH, the Steelers have been a competitive organization for many years, irrespective of the coach or GM. They play a smash mouth style that suits their hometown, and the conditions that they are likely to face throughout the year. While I'm not sure what Philly and the Packers do (I believe they practice outdoors) as far as I know the Steelers practice outdoors most of the time (if not all the time).

 

And, while I normally eschew the military comparisons, for this example I think it is appropriate, as it involves preparedness, and nothing else. When an organization knows it is very likely to have to operate in foul weather, ignoring the consequences of the weather is to be poorly prepared. Designing a game plan that ignores the probability of bad weather is bad design.

 

Why, when you play outside, would you practice outside on a regular basis? Do hockey teams practice in sneakers? They could get more done, and run their plays in sneakers if they didn't have to worry about that pesky ice.

 

What good is it to know your team can run their plays in perfect conditions, when they almost never play in perfect conditions? IMO it just gives players and coaches an excuse to fail. If you eliminate the excuse of weather in practice, it has less of a chance to rear its head during the game. They've been there, they've done that. The coaches know what the players can do, given the weather, the players have faith the coaches will the call the plays that suit them, and the conditions.

 

As I mentioned earlier, I really don't have an issue with them playing inside now, as they are really looking to get the players up to speed with the playbook. But once training camp starts, and throughout the season, they should let the elements be a factor during practice, as they most certainly will be a factor during the game. But if it were my team, they would be outside now.

[The Dean]

Not for nothing, but "What's too tough for them is just right for us" was a Levy saying inspired by hot-weather fatigue.

 

 

I will take your work for it (although I'd love some proof), but I believe he used it after bad weather games, as well.

[WellDressed]

It has nothing to do with shying away from something that's "hard to do."

 

It's a careless use of valuable time. The CBA spells out specifically how much time a team can be on the field. You don't while away quality practice time on the if-come.

 

you mean whittle away, right??

[berndogg]

I played college football in rochester and we had to practice in blizzards a few times and it was completely useless. Slipping around, fumbled snaps, etc. don't add to your preparedness and put you at higher risk of injury. You're better off practicing indoors and seeing what the other team's plays look like when they're run correctly, watching the scout team trip over themselves does nothing for you. The way that bad weather is going to affect you from one day to the next is so unpredictable anyway. It's not like if a receiver slips on a route in practice it helps you because you know he's going to do it in the game.

[TimGraham]

you mean whittle away, right??

 

No. "While away" is an actual phrase.

 

You might while away a summer's afternoon in the hammock.

 

http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/phra...while+away.html

[TimGraham]

I will take your work for it (although I'd love some proof), but I believe he used it after bad weather games, as well.

 

It was talked about in the America's Game series on NFL Network.

[The Dean]

I played college football in rochester and we had to practice in blizzards a few times and it was completely useless. Slipping around, fumbled snaps, etc. don't add to your preparedness and put you at higher risk of injury. You're better off practicing indoors and seeing what the other team's plays look like when they're run correctly, watching the scout team trip over themselves does nothing for you. The way that bad weather is going to affect you from one day to the next is so unpredictable anyway. It's not like if a receiver slips on a route in practice it helps you because you know he's going to do it in the game.

 

Honestly, it sounds like you had a crappy coach. The practice outside should have prepared you for what you could reasonably run, and what the competition could reasonably do, in those conditions. Had the game been played in bad weather, you should have been far more prepared.

 

Now, if he had you running a fair weather game plan, then I understand why you thought the practice was useless. Good coaches (and managers) use the situation at hand as a teaching moment, to demonstrate what can be done, if/when you encounter the current conditions.

 

Of course, if the whole week sucks outside, I understand doing what Marv did...have some practice inside and some outside. Be prepared!

 

No. "While away" is an actual phrase.

 

You might while away a summer's afternoon in the hammock.

 

http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/phra...while+away.html

 

I could wile away the hours

Conferrin' with the flowers

Consultin' with the rain

And my head I'd be scratchin'

While my thoughts were busy hatchin'

If I only had a brain

[Buffalo_Stampede]

People are taking this weather thing too far. Practicing outside doesnt make you better, it just makes you prepared, which is why I think the better coaches in the NFL practice outside. They prepare their teams better.

 

I just dont see how throwing a ball indoors can be the same as throwing outdoors.

[WellDressed]

No. "While away" is an actual phrase.

 

You might while away a summer's afternoon in the hammock.

 

http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/phra...while+away.html

 

OK. Then there is the old standby,

 

"He willed away the tumor after watching 'The Conqueror' "

[berndogg]

Honestly, it sounds like you had a crappy coach.

That is absolutely correct, the worst ever, and then of course he get's fired the year after I graduate and we start having winning seasons , but I digress. However, Tim's point about the time factor can't be stressed enough. When there's a broken play due to sloppy condidtions you have to run it again, and in really bad conditions, when that's happening frequently, it does take valuable time away.

[TimGraham]

Honestly, it sounds like you had a crappy coach. The practice outside should have prepared you for what you could reasonably run, and what the competition could reasonably do, in those conditions. Had the game been played in bad weather, you should have been far more prepared.

 

Now, if he had you running a fair weather game plan, then I understand why you thought the practice was useless. Good coaches (and managers) use the situation at hand as a teaching moment, to demonstrate what can be done, if/when you encounter the current conditions.

 

Of course, if the whole week sucks outside, I understand doing what Marv did...have some practice inside and some outside. Be prepared!

 

So you think it's better to prepare for a handicapped version of your opponent's playbook and not the entire array of possibilities?

 

Interesting approach.

[The Dean]

So you think it's better to prepare for a handicapped version of your opponent's playbook and not the entire array of possibilities?

 

Interesting approach.

 

 

No, I think it is better to prepare for EVERYTHING.

[berndogg]

Honestly, it sounds like you had a crappy coach. The practice outside should have prepared you for what you could reasonably run, and what the competition could reasonably do, in those conditions. Had the game been played in bad weather, you should have been far more prepared.

 

Now, if he had you running a fair weather game plan, then I understand why you thought the practice was useless. Good coaches (and managers) use the situation at hand as a teaching moment, to demonstrate what can be done, if/when you encounter the current conditions.

Of course, if the whole week sucks outside, I understand doing what Marv did...have some practice inside and some outside. Be prepared!

And the "had the game been played in bad weahter" part is a pretty broad statement. I mean, does practicing in 30 mph winds prepare you for 10 mph winds or vice versa, does practicing in light snow prepare you for a blizzard?

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I don't think the Bills should practice outside if the conditions make it difficult to run a good practice, like pouring rain or a blizzard. I just want the Bills, specifically Trent Edwards, getting used to throwing in weather they will see almost every week.

 

Its almost always 10+ MPH winds at the Ralph.

 

Just some #'s, Trent Edwards passer rating is 58 in the 1st quarter, 86 in the 2nd, 88 in the 3rd, and 104 in the 4th.

 

No one thinks him adjusting to conditions plays any role in this?

[The Dean]

And the "had the game been played in bad weahter" part is a pretty broad statement. I mean, does practicing in 30 mph winds prepare you for 10 mph winds or vice versa, does practicing in light snow prepare you for a blizzard?

 

 

Well, yes, far better than practicing inside with zero winds, and no precipitation does. Of course, if you practiced outside all the time, you would get to practice in perfect weather, rain, drizzle, snow, etc. You could eliminate the elements as an excuse, as you would have prepared for everything.

 

Of course, you can't prepare for a specific team, in one week, in every element. But the most important thing to know is what your team can do, in any particular condition. If your players are confident they can execute in any given weather conditions, you have an advantage over those who are unsure.

[TimGraham]

And the "had the game been played in bad weahter" part is a pretty broad statement. I mean, does practicing in 30 mph winds prepare you for 10 mph winds or vice versa, does practicing in light snow prepare you for a blizzard?

 

This is a guy who gets it.

[GaryPinC]

Honestly, it sounds like you had a crappy coach. The practice outside should have prepared you for what you could reasonably run, and what the competition could reasonably do, in those conditions. Had the game been played in bad weather, you should have been far more prepared.

 

Now, if he had you running a fair weather game plan, then I understand why you thought the practice was useless. Good coaches (and managers) use the situation at hand as a teaching moment, to demonstrate what can be done, if/when you encounter the current conditions.

 

Of course, if the whole week sucks outside, I understand doing what Marv did...have some practice inside and some outside. Be prepared!

 

 

Pardon my ignorance Dean, but you write as though Marv practiced outdoors on the most inclement days. I haven't read any of Marv's books or anything so maybe you could help me out. Do you know this for sure and can you provide a reference/link? Maybe Marv would only practice outdoors when the weather would allow and took it inside when things were crappy outside?

 

I can see both Tim and your points, but I lean towards Tim's arguments more. You never know what weather you'll get on Sunday, so do you try to struggle through practice trying to install a small portion of your gameplan or do you install your full gameplan during practice and adjust it to the weather on gameday?

 

Biggest reason I could see for practicing outside would be adjusting the players to the outside temperature. Also, if the Bills played on natural grass maybe you could justify outdoors but that's irrelevant here.

 

Wind and weather issues I think you try and address in the pregame warm ups on game day (run some patterns). JMHO.