BillsVet Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 With free agency 3 weeks old and the draft still a long month away, I get the feeling Buffalo is looking further down the road than 2007. Although the season is still almost half a year away, it appears the Bills will not acquire any starting caliber free agents the rest of the way. There may be some players available later in the off-season, but I rarely hear Buffalo is interested like we heard when Dockery visited OBD on opening day of free agency. The question is this: do Bills fans think Buffalo looks toward 2008 or will they go out of their way to win in 2007? And what qualifies for success in 2007? Is it merely being .500, making the playoffs, or winning a post-season game? Do they have a sense of urgency for 2007 with the franchise missing the playoffs each season since 2000? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oneonta Buffalo Fan Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 With free agency 3 weeks old and the draft still a long month away, I get the feeling Buffalo is looking further down the road than 2007. Although the season is still almost half a year away, it appears the Bills will not acquire any starting caliber free agents the rest of the way. There may be some players available later in the off-season, but I rarely hear Buffalo is interested like we heard when Dockery visited OBD on opening day of free agency. The question is this: do Bills fans think Buffalo looks toward 2008 or will they go out of their way to win in 2007? And what qualifies for success in 2007? Is it merely being .500, making the playoffs, or winning a post-season game? Do they have a sense of urgency for 2007 with the franchise missing the playoffs each season since 2000? 1. Trust in Marv and the team. 2. We want character players. It seems to be working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 I'm looking for more than simply trusting in Marv. We won't fully be able to have ultimate confidence in Marv's drafting ability for another 1-2 years. It will take some time to evaluate Marv's decisions. Character players are good for the organization. Won't argue there because they're the face of the franchise and get people in the seats. Of course winning doesn't hurt either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuile Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 They don't have the players yet to think Super Bowl. Most teams in the cap era go through a growing period where they find players who will be the foundation for a deep playoff run. I would be happy with a wildcard this year with a top 4 seed to come in 2008 or 09. The hope is J.P. and Lee are the players to build around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 I think JP will continue to develop. The effect of having a better offensive line should help him grow. I wish he had some more weapons, but there's still draft day. The danger is saying the team is one way or another based on what they have on paper. I don't want to do that, but it just seemed like 07 was going to be the bridge to a successful 2008. I'd rather not wait that long, but it is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koufax Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Build a winner the right way and for the long term. I want to win in 2007, but expect 2008 to be even better, and don't want the team to make decisions that will mortgage 2008+ for a slightly better chance to win this year. Would you give next year's #1 and #2 for Michael Turner? Nope, because we care about 2007, but we also care about 2008 and beyond. We want to build a team that can compete year in year out, and that is done with smart choices and not a sense of urgency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 Build a winner the right way and for the long term. I want to win in 2007, but expect 2008 to be even better, and don't want the team to make decisions that will mortgage 2008+ for a slightly better chance to win this year. Would you give next year's #1 and #2 for Michael Turner? Nope, because we care about 2007, but we also care about 2008 and beyond. We want to build a team that can compete year in year out, and that is done with smart choices and not a sense of urgency. Sure, I'd want the team on solid footing for the long haul. But give me something this season like a playoff appearance and it'll make 2008 even more anticipated. But to a certain level you've got to spend money to remain successful. IMO, this whole cash to the cap thing comes not from "amortizing" the future but from an unwillingness to spend. Now some smart person out there will cite the Dockery and Walker signings, but with roughly 20 million left in free agency, are we going to be that one team with room to spare and an unwillingness to spend it? I think the answer is yes and that's why I'm questioning where this team is going. If we're not using the resources we're alloted, are we putting our best effort forward? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 I'm looking for more than simply trusting in Marv. We won't fully be able to have ultimate confidence in Marv's drafting ability for another 1-2 years. It will take some time to evaluate Marv's decisions. Character players are good for the organization. Won't argue there because they're the face of the franchise and get people in the seats. Of course winning doesn't hurt either. I disagree. We have a great legacy of Marv's drafting and personnel ability. My recollection is it was pretty damn good. (Of course, I drink, ya know.) As far as winning goes, Marv's legacy isn't so bad there, either. He improved the team in his very first year and I expect the team will improve again this year. Until circumstances dictate a different direction, I will continue to: TRUST IN MARV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Sure, I'd want the team on solid footing for the long haul. But give me something this season like a playoff appearance and it'll make 2008 even more anticipated. But to a certain level you've got to spend money to remain successful. IMO, this whole cash to the cap thing comes not from "amortizing" the future but from an unwillingness to spend. Now some smart person out there will cite the Dockery and Walker signings, but with roughly 20 million left in free agency, are we going to be that one team with room to spare and an unwillingness to spend it? I think the answer is yes and that's why I'm questioning where this team is going. If we're not using the resources we're alloted, are we putting our best effort forward? It is one thing to spend money wisely on players who will be good team players for a period of time, it is another to foolishly spend ala Danny & is Deadskins. IN MARV WE TRUST! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipster19 Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Nice pensive post BillsVet. Before I try to offer a response to your questions, I'd like to ask you a couple. What if the Bills feel like they are already close to being successful this year with the players that they have? What if they do only need a couple of players out of the draft and/or free agency to be play-off bound? Marv sure doesn't appear in a panic to fill what we all deem areas of need. Take a second to contemplate our immediate needs. 1) DT. Does Marv feel like our current rotation is more than adequate, especially with a healthy McCargo? The right draft pick here could secure this concern. 2) CB. Last year we went heavy in the secondary. Do we benefit now from this investment? Once again the proper draft pick here could melt this concern away. 3) LB. Even with the possible trade/liquidation of Spikes we're only still probably looking for 1 player at this position. Another draft pick here and we're only up to 3 picks used. 4) RB. Even if we don't sign Brown, we still got A-Train, Shaud Williams and Fred Jackson and I believe that Marv really does like this guy ALOT. Okay, need another RB for security, use another draft pick here, that's 4. I do believe we still pick up 1-2 more players (outside of RB) in free agency to help our cause and we got 4 first day draft picks. I'm not even counting our picks in day two, where there still will be players who can contribute in their first year. What if Marv really knows what he's doing and we don't? Scary thought, isn't it? Now to answer your 3 questions. First, Buffalo does both, they go out of their way to win in 2007 as they look to solidify themselves for the 2008 season. Secondly, what qualifies for success in 2007 is to have a winning record and make it to the play-offs and play some really competitive football, win or lose. Last but not least, yes, they have urgency to win in 2007 but don't confuse it for desperation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acantha Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 I'm looking for more than simply trusting in Marv. We won't fully be able to have ultimate confidence in Marv's drafting ability for another 1-2 years. It will take some time to evaluate Marv's decisions. Character players are good for the organization. Won't argue there because they're the face of the franchise and get people in the seats. Of course winning doesn't hurt either. I have to believe that Levy/Jauron have a vision of what they want the team to be, whether it be schemes, personnel, or any number of other things, and they will do the best they can to get us there as soon as possible. And while I think they perfectly understand that Bills fans have been waiting forever to make the playoffs and be Super Bowl contenders, they have can't sacrifice what they believe to be the winning strategy in order to try and win now (redskin style). As far as what will make a successful season? That's going to be different not only for everyone you ask, but when you ask them. There are a lot of people right now that may say they will be patient this year and understand we still need too much help, but once the team starts losing will be the first in line calling for Marv/Jauron's heads. Personally, I am of the opinion that it takes a new front office/coaches 3 years to get things put together and in the direction you want them going. I don't want to see the team lose this year, but I think it is a probability. I will be much more critical of moves, or lack there of, next offseason and throughout next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike formerly from Florida Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 1. Trust in Marv and the team.2. We want character players. It seems to be working. I AGREE WITH YOU! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marauderswr80 Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 I dont think they are looking down the road to 2008......... I think they are looking for quality players that fit the system. Big names, Big contracts, big signing bonuses dont win you championships. Dont believe me ask the Redskins. The Bills are about getting younger athletes who are hungry for winning. They are getting guys who are team oriented. Guys who know how to play the game together. In the NFL these days you have too many guys playing for themselves........and less about the team. I honest think Marv & Co, are trying to get guys who care more about winning then about personal stats. Cause really thats all it boils down to, Wins & Loses...... At first I didnt like the direction the team was heading in.....but after seeing what our draftees did last year with the defense, Im more then happy with it. I finally have trust within the scouting department to find the right guys to play here in Buffalo. Face the facts, did anyone ever hear about Keith Ellison before he was drafted? I sure as heck didnt. When TKO went down with that hammy, Ellison stepped right in and played VERY well for the most part. Donte Whitner and Ko Simpson in my mind are going to be alot better this year then last year. They will understand the game better and adjust to the speed of the game. We had 5 rookies start on defense this past year and all of them played fairly well....to me thats huge for a team. Buffalo is getting younger with more athletic/hungry players.......I see nothing wrong with that at all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 23, 2007 Author Share Posted March 23, 2007 Every time someone like a new GM and/or coach arrives, we've got to give them a few years. At least that's what many on this board say. Well, we've done that a few times now. At which point do we say, "Win Now" to the new guy. Frankly I don't want to hear about 2008. It's too far off and the 07 season is still more than 5 months away. We had to play those five rooks last season because there was nothing else in the talent/warm body department. Having five rookies play doesn't mean you had a solid draft, it means your team had no depth. I'm concerned about a team that continually gets younger every season. You could potentially have starting on defense this season 7 guys who were drafted in 2004-2007. (CB Youboty, SS Whitner, FS Simpson, CB McGee, MLB/OLB Crowell, OLB Ellison, DT Williams/McCargo) Don't confuse youth with talent and it's not always a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketch Soland Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Build a winner the right way and for the long term. I want to win in 2007, but expect 2008 to be even better, and don't want the team to make decisions that will mortgage 2008+ for a slightly better chance to win this year. Would you give next year's #1 and #2 for Michael Turner? Nope, because we care about 2007, but we also care about 2008 and beyond. We want to build a team that can compete year in year out, and that is done with smart choices and not a sense of urgency. Yes, "win now" and "in the future" are not mutually exclusive. Ask the Patriots. Of course, easier said than done, but you can't "win now" by just buying ever FA on the market ala the Redskins, nor can you exclusively win "in the future" by not signing any FA's and just going with a bunch of rookie draft picks. The Patriots seem to realize the latter this year, if their FA spending spree is any indication. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koufax Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Yes, "win now" and "in the future" are not mutually exclusive. Ask the Patriots. Of course, easier said than done, but you can't "win now" by just buying ever FA on the market ala the Redskins, nor can you exclusively win "in the future" by not signing any FA's and just going with a bunch of rookie draft picks. The Patriots seem to realize the latter this year, if their FA spending spree is any indication. I largely agree with you, but I don't think that the Patriots have realized something new after being in the dark about it before. I think they are just using their dollars (which they have plenty of) wisely adjusting to a new situation and trying to be a better team for 2007. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 I largely agree with you, but I don't think that the Patriots have realized something new after being in the dark about it before. I think they are just using their dollars (which they have plenty of) wisely adjusting to a new situation and trying to be a better team for 2007. True, and have been doing it for quite some time. Contrary to popular belief, the Patriots rise in 2001 was not solely due to starting Brady over Bledsoe when he got injured. The Patriots signed 21 free agents that year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 With free agency 3 weeks old and the draft still a long month away, I get the feeling Buffalo is looking further down the road than 2007. Although the season is still almost half a year away, it appears the Bills will not acquire any starting caliber free agents the rest of the way. There may be some players available later in the off-season, but I rarely hear Buffalo is interested like we heard when Dockery visited OBD on opening day of free agency. The question is this: do Bills fans think Buffalo looks toward 2008 or will they go out of their way to win in 2007? And what qualifies for success in 2007? Is it merely being .500, making the playoffs, or winning a post-season game? Do they have a sense of urgency for 2007 with the franchise missing the playoffs each season since 2000? I think that Marv wants to create the same feeling that he had here when he was the coach in the late eighties. A talented young team that's on the rise and one which will be a playoff contender for a long time. I saw saw bits of that in the second part of last season. As long as the fans see the young players starting to gel even more so than they did last season, and we see this year's rookies make an impact as the 2006 did, then the ride in 2007 will be that much sweeter even if they do just miss the playoffs again. I think we'll be too busy enjoying the 2007 season to worry about 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phlegm Alley Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 If you look and see how much the increased spending has affected every team in the league, you will realize why Marv and Co. arean't giving up alot now, because it will benefit this team in the long run. We are going to ahve to use some of the remainder cap space of ~$20M to sign a couple of core leaders on this team in a few years: Losman and Evans. I also think that this front office is not going to mortgage the future with draft picks to move up in the draft to select AP this year. I think the Bills brass are looking down the road to next year where you will se an abundance of very talented RBs eligible for the draft. Ray Rice Steve Slaton Darren McFadden Mike Hart All these guys are first round talent so I think that the Bills will be looking forward to the future to select their new franchise guy, and for this year, rely on a RBBC and a servicable mid round flyer at RB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 24, 2007 Author Share Posted March 24, 2007 If you look and see how much the increased spending has affected every team in the league, you will realize why Marv and Co. arean't giving up alot now, because it will benefit this team in the long run. We are going to ahve to use some of the remainder cap space of ~$20M to sign a couple of core leaders on this team in a few years: Losman and Evans. I also think that this front office is not going to mortgage the future with draft picks to move up in the draft to select AP this year. I think the Bills brass are looking down the road to next year where you will se an abundance of very talented RBs eligible for the draft. Ray Rice Steve Slaton Darren McFadden Mike Hart All these guys are first round talent so I think that the Bills will be looking forward to the future to select their new franchise guy, and for this year, rely on a RBBC and a servicable mid round flyer at RB. I'd agree with you on this one. Usually there isn't one year where RB is stocked. This season there are 2 clear #1's and a host of 2nd-3rd round talents. Even if you don't get the guy you want this season and have something serviceable, there's next year's draft. But for this year, we need to get a guy who can carry the load at about 4 ypc. Two guys who can't are 3.5 ypc isn't going to do it. McFadden made Arkansas run with one of the most highly recruited HS QB's in 06 on the team. Hart is a local guy from Syracuse area and Slaton has done some amazing things at WVU. So there's going to be talent there in 2008. As for that 20 million in cap room-I'm fine with using it to keep Losman and Evans. I personally think Evans is a more sure thing by virtue of his performance last season. Losman still has further strides to make. If he can make them, then yeah lock him up. But I do expect us to get close to the salary cap limit at some point. Spending less from season to season (i.e. the minumum) isn't an encouraging sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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