apuszczalowski Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 I was listening to Shred and Ragan live from Radio Row at the Super Bowl this week and they had Vic Carrucci from nfl.com on and he had mentioned that Max Starks, RT of the Steelers (who's an RFA) wants to talk to the Bills and is interested in signing here. If Marv could get him cheap, it might not be bad. Vic said he wasn't sure if Marv would be looking at him, but they may have some interest. He also mentioned that Marv has been mostly looking at depth moves right now, and not to expect huge signing and spending to the Cap (not because of Ralph being "Cheap") because of Marvs stance on FA. He is more of a build your team through the draft instead of FA, and that he is more for signing their own FA's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 You mean like Clements? And I'm sure there are a handful of players who would like to play for the Bills and not just for a boatload of cash. But Starks will probably get a 1st round tender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 I was listening to Shred and Ragan live from Radio Row at the Super Bowl this week and they had Vic Carrucci from nfl.com on and he had mentioned that Max Starks, RT of the Steelers (who's an RFA) wants to talk to the Bills and is interested in signing here. If Marv could get him cheap, it might not be bad. Vic said he wasn't sure if Marv would be looking at him, but they may have some interest. He also mentioned that Marv has been mostly looking at depth moves right now, and not to expect huge signing and spending to the Cap (not because of Ralph being "Cheap") because of Marvs stance on FA. He is more of a build your team through the draft instead of FA, and that he is more for signing their own FA's Starks actually was on the Howard Simon show this morning talked mostly about Rex Grossman (he played with him at Florida) and adjusting from playing in college to the NFL. I found him to be surprisingly well spoken and seemed like a nice guy as Hos (Simon's nickname) joked around with him about signing here and Starks was very political in wouldn't turn down the chance if the Bills pursued him et all. I know Allen Wilson also made mention the Bills might want to pursue him. Though to be honest I don't think Starks would be worth the compensation. As am guessing the Steelers would give him a low tender which means we have to give up a 3rd Rounder for a guy whose given up 16.5 sacks in 30 NFL starts which are similar to Mike Williams type numbers. I'd be all for signing a depth RT to push Pennington for the starting job and/or compete with Butler as the primary backup role though the free agent crop is lean with Floyd Womack as the best option with Brad Bedell another option that I'd consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Starks would be a good add, but for how much? Last year I recall Buffalo going after OG/T Reggie Wells from Arizona and DT Israel Idonije from Chicago. Both signed the offer sheet and then re-signed with their own team for more money. If we're only going to pursue RFA's and average or below average UFA's, it's gonna be a long time until the playoffs. No matter what, if the front office uses the same strategy as last year, the fans aren't going to buy into these cheaper players being difference makers. You can't say today that Buffalo will be bad in 2007, but we're counting on too many low round draft picks and unwanted FA's to make the playoffs next season. I like building through the draft, but when your last playoff appearance was 7 years ago, patience is something Bills fans have very little of. It's time to import some talented guys. Not sure which ones, but you've gotta pay to get talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 If he can play guard, and comes cheap, then sign him up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stussy109 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Starks would be a good add, but for how much? Last year I recall Buffalo going after OG/T Reggie Wells from Arizona and DT Israel Idonije from Chicago. Both signed the offer sheet and then re-signed with their own team for more money. If we're only going to pursue RFA's and average or below average UFA's, it's gonna be a long time until the playoffs. No matter what, if the front office uses the same strategy as last year, the fans aren't going to buy into these cheaper players being difference makers. You can't say today that Buffalo will be bad in 2007, but we're counting on too many low round draft picks and unwanted FA's to make the playoffs next season. I like building through the draft, but when your last playoff appearance was 7 years ago, patience is something Bills fans have very little of. It's time to import some talented guys. Not sure which ones, but you've gotta pay to get talent. Remember all our big signings in 2002 and 2003, where'd they get us? Spikes, Millow, Sam Adams, Villarial, FLetcher, Bledsoe... FA is not the answer. I can see 1 or 2 good pick ups, but the best teams are built fromt he ground up that being the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBilliever Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 He's very up and down. I live in Steel town, and he's either phenomenal one week or sucks the next. He'll be great against a great DE, but get burned by a no name... I'm sketchy, but he's an improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyBall4Buffalo Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 FA is not the answer. I can see 1 or 2 good pick ups, but the best teams are built from the ground up that being the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Yeah, bringing in all those guys didn't mean a thing. Then again, we had Greggggg as the head coach and TD as the GM. No, those guys didn't make us a winning team, but had we possessed the right leadership, we'd have gone much further. Now, we've got the leadership and the players aren't there. Bottom Line: still mediocre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayFinkle Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Remember all our big signings in 2002 and 2003, where'd they get us? Spikes, Millow, Sam Adams, Villarial, FLetcher, Bledsoe... FA is not the answer. I can see 1 or 2 good pick ups, but the best teams are built fromt he ground up that being the draft. Do you mean, remember back when we had one of the best defenses and special teams in the league? Yes is do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Remember all our big signings in 2002 and 2003, where'd they get us? Spikes, Millow, Sam Adams, Villarial, FLetcher, Bledsoe... FA is not the answer. I can see 1 or 2 good pick ups, but the best teams are built fromt he ground up that being the draft. Spikes has played like a monster for us. Adams was excellent when teamed with Pat Williams. Without him, not so much. Villarial filled in capably on the relative cheap until his body gave out. Fletcher gave us his all as well. Milloy and Bledsoe are the two pickups that probably weren't prudent given what we paid (and remember Bledsoe was not just a FA -- which would have been a MUCH better deal for us that giving up a #1 draft pick to a hated and successful division rival for him). Two things come to mind here: 1) don't deal with the Patriots. They know something you don't and will come out on the winning end. 2) If the Pats want to let a guy go, it's probably because he's not worth what he is asking for. Now the Pats excel with role-playing FA pickups and guys looking for something to prove. I think we're working on that and may have found a few solid ones in Royal and Fowler. We need to pick up more of those kinds of guys and less of the Tutan Reyes' of the world. Nothing wrong with looking FA and especially for guys who will fit the system and want to be here. If Starks or Briggs are those kinds of guys, take 'em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 If he can play guard, and comes cheap, then sign him up! I think that I'd maybe draft a tackle who has proven he can play gaurd (Aaron Sears of Tennessee comes to mind) but I'd think as a FA I'd want someone who has actually had some success playing that position. Backup tackle? Yeah...but he'd better come cheap at backup tackle money. I like Marv's position about signing our own. I like Clements (beaucoup) and think we've got to strain the purse strings a bit, but should make a serious run for him. Kelsay is a nice player and I'd try to keep him as well. I'm in the minority I know, but I think I'd get serious about keeping London Fletcher as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oneonta Buffalo Fan Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 He won't be cheap, pretty good player, won a superbowl, don't think we will get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Now the Pats excel with role-playing FA pickups and guys looking for something to prove. I think we're working on that and may have found a few solid ones in Royal and Fowler. We need to pick up more of those kinds of guys and less of the Tutan Reyes' of the world. Nothing wrong with looking FA and especially for guys who will fit the system and want to be here. If Starks or Briggs are those kinds of guys, take 'em. The problem is that in FA, both Reyes and Royal is looked upon as similar FA type players....in the B-class. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it does not.... People talk about some of the success stories in FA, but equally we had bad FA acquisitions starting with Bennie Anderson, Tutan Reyes, Mike Gandy at LT, Posey... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 He won't be cheap, pretty good player, won a superbowl, don't think we will get him. May be he figured out that he can get a contract extension with the Steelers (by matching another teams offer) and just throw in a team that might be interested in a RT. I think a RG is a higher priority for the Bills than a RT...However, Starks is a very good player and is also a colorful personality like a Reuben Brown... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 I can see 1 or 2 good pick ups, but the best teams are built fromt he ground up that being the draft. You know, when a team signs players through free agency they don't give up draft picks. So you get to sign FAs AND use the draft to build your team. Any team that goes only one route isn't using all the tools available to them. This team isn't going to be able to compete year in and year out without using FA to cherry pick a few difference makers. Hell, this team doesn't even want to spend the money to keep their own difference makers. If the Bills are going to build through the draft they had better start signing their own players once their initial contracts are up. Bottom line is that the Bills just aren't going to be able to compete on a consistent basis if they don't spend up to the cap. You can't be a consistant winner by using the draft and then not signing your own great players to second contracts. Sure they might have a year here or there where they exceed expectations and slip into the playoffs but they'll be a mediocre team at best overall if they're consistently 13+ million under the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 The problem is that in FA, both Reyes and Royal is looked upon as similar FA type players....in the B-class. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it does not.... People talk about some of the success stories in FA, but equally we had bad FA acquisitions starting with Bennie Anderson, Tutan Reyes, Mike Gandy at LT, Posey... I don't know if they do this right now but I think every FA lineman should talk to McNally and just see if they're going to hit it off and if they play the way that we want them to play. I understand the front office should have the final say but I think you're not trying to fit round pegs into square holes if you have the guys who are working with the talent, especially talent as important to the game as the OL, in on the decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 You can't be a consistant winner by using the draft and then not signing your own great players to second contracts. The problem is in the recent past, our draft picks that have become FA have not been GREAT players to give them big contracts....I don't see the bills not giving a contract to Lee Evans, because he is on the way to be one of the leagues best WR. There are still question marks on JP and McGahee to write them also as GREAT players, but they have shown certain growth towards that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 The problem is in the recent past, our draft picks that have become FA have not been GREAT players to give them big contracts....I don't see the bills not giving a contract to Lee Evans, because he is on the way to be one of the leagues best WR. There are still question marks on JP and McGahee to write them also as GREAT players, but they have shown certain growth towards that. I'm mainly talking about Clements and Winfield. Perhaps not "great" players but not the kind of players you want to keep letting go and having to draft their replacements. Doing that is the equivalent of running on a treadmill. I don't even want to hear the cap arguement because the Bills haven't been near the cap in years. The day they're close to the cap is the day I'll worry about "overspending" on a player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 The problem is that in FA, both Reyes and Royal is looked upon as similar FA type players....in the B-class. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it does not.... People talk about some of the success stories in FA, but equally we had bad FA acquisitions starting with Bennie Anderson, Tutan Reyes, Mike Gandy at LT, Posey... And I'd argue that with B-level free agents Donahoe missed more than he hit. That's probably what separates him from Scott Pioli. Everyone in the world can tell you that a healthy Takeo Spikes in the prime of his career is a can't-miss pickup. Not everyone can tell you which affordable linemen will fit in your system and work out nicely. Last year Marv brought in: Tripplett (OK, not awesome), Bowen (wash, injury), Royal (solid), Reyes (flop), A-Train (solid backup), Kiwaukee Thomas (solid nickel guy), Andre Davis (good ST, poor WR), Peerless (sort of a call-it-as-you-see-it pickup, some liked it, some didn't) Fowler (popular and quality C who seems to have a good rapport with JP, center of line got better as OGs were switched) Nall (wash, probably a capable backup, OK problem to have as JP blossomed) In red I have the signings for which something more was probably expected than what we got in return. I still think that Tripplett will be a quality signing, provided we back him up with a healthy McCargo and a new acquisition to better what we got from Tim Anderson. Bowen's signing now looks a bit silly in that we got solid production from the rooks and Leonhard looks like a chippy guy who can contribute on STs. Reyes should not have been signed. Peerless will either have to better what he did last year or take a demotion as new blood comes in. Again, Nall's non-production is not the worst issue to have and when we part ways with Holcomb it'll be good to have youth on our side in the backup position. So I really like half of those signings and most of them have a chance to perform better than they did last year. I don't think Marv really struck out the way others did. What we got was probably good enough for an 8-8, 7-9 team. We now need an impact guy or two like Briggs to replace what we'll lose, with obvious decisions to be made at MLB, CB, 2a WR, and the defensive line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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