Buftex Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Losing seems to have eaten away at peoples brains. The fact that someone here is calling out Marv Levy as the "most overrated HOF'er ever" is sheer idiocy. Marv may not have been the greatest X's and O's coach ever, and his moves as GM may be questionable right now, but for a supposed a Bills fan to write such crap, and have those in agreement, almost makes me believe that Bills fans, en masse, are not the "smart fans' that the national media likes to portray them as, but rather a bunch of lead paint-chip eating baffoons. I would love to hear one of these genious' try to make a case for each and every HOFer. My guess is that their memory wouldn't get too far past Howie Long... There is almost no point in coming here to try to discuss football anymore. The ADD crowd has taken the house.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Someone having an opinion that Marv Levy was overrated = Bills fans are not smart fans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Losing seems to have eaten away at peoples brains. The fact that someone here is calling out Marv Levy as the "most overrated HOF'er ever" is sheer idiocy. Marv may not have been the greatest X's and O's coach ever, and his moves as GM may be questionable right now, but for a supposed a Bills fan to write such crap, and have those in agreement, almost makes me believe that Bills fans, en masse, are not the "smart fans' that the national media likes to portray them as, but rather a bunch of lead paint-chip eating baffoons. I would love to hear one of these genious' try to make a case for each and every HOFer. My guess is that their memory wouldn't get too far past Howie Long... There is almost no point in coming here to try to discuss football anymore. The ADD crowd has taken the house.... 635212[/snapback] Good post. The most surprising thing is the number of long time posters that have gone off the deep end. One day i wish all these bridge jumpers would actually jump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazykat Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Losing seems to have eaten away at peoples brains. The fact that someone here is calling out Marv Levy as the "most overrated HOF'er ever" is sheer idiocy. Marv may not have been the greatest X's and O's coach ever, and his moves as GM may be questionable right now, but for a supposed a Bills fan to write such crap, and have those in agreement, almost makes me believe that Bills fans, en masse, are not the "smart fans' that the national media likes to portray them as, but rather a bunch of lead paint-chip eating baffoons. I would love to hear one of these genious' try to make a case for each and every HOFer. My guess is that their memory wouldn't get too far past Howie Long... There is almost no point in coming here to try to discuss football anymore. The ADD crowd has taken the house.... 635212[/snapback] Other than the four Super Bowl seasons, Levy's 94-97 in record. 7 of his 17 seasons had losing records, one was .500, two were 9-7. What mediocre or better coach wouldn't have gone an average 12-4 with the talent that we had in the early '90s? Polian built this team, Levy underachieved with it! As soon as Polian left the team began to fall apart again. That's why Levy's ingenious and coaching prowess finished out his string with the Bills 7-9, 10-6, 10-6, 6-10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazykat Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Compare Levy's career record to Jimmy Johnson's, Bill Parcells', and Joe Gibbs'. There's no comparison with the three that dusted him in the big game. If Levy had never known Polian he'd never have come close to making the Hall of Fame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talonz Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Other than the four Super Bowl seasons, Levy's 94-97 in record. 7 of his 17 seasons had losing records, one was .500, two were 9-7. What mediocre or better coach wouldn't have gone an average 12-4 with the talent that we had in the early '90s? Polian built this team, Levy underachieved with it! As soon as Polian left the team began to fall apart again. That's why Levy's ingenious and coaching prowess finished out his string with the Bills 7-9, 10-6, 10-6, 6-10. 635233[/snapback] Did you hit your head while jumping off the bandwagon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 There is almost no point in coming here to try to discuss football anymore. The ADD crowd has taken the house.... 635212[/snapback] Your're right. Losing is a big part of it, but so's the rise in the American Idol / "Look at Me!" culture where ourageous viewpoints are valued higher than logical thought and discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Wing '73 Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Other than the four Super Bowl seasons, Levy's 94-97 in record. 7 of his 17 seasons had losing records, one was .500, two were 9-7. What mediocre or better coach wouldn't have gone an average 12-4 with the talent that we had in the early '90s? Polian built this team, Levy underachieved with it! As soon as Polian left the team began to fall apart again. That's why Levy's ingenious and coaching prowess finished out his string with the Bills 7-9, 10-6, 10-6, 6-10. 635233[/snapback] Obviously some posts are put up with the intention of getting a rise out of the board. Those of us who just love the Bills and just like talking football with others don't pay any attention to the negativity. Regardless of what most people post if they agree or disagree or just need to vent they will all be watching this team in '06 (or they are just fans of other teams pushing buttons). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMadCap Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 I too have noticed a great increase in the number of "strafe posters" who register and spout nonesense, attempting to disrupt and inflame the regulars around here. It almost always works. How bout we NOT reply to them, they will tend to go away... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted March 19, 2006 Author Share Posted March 19, 2006 Someone having an opinion that Marv Levy was overrated = Bills fans are not smart fans? 635214[/snapback] No, I wasn't saying that at all. I know there are a number of people here, who think Marv was a lousy coach. I am not one of them, but a number of people here do, and I respect some of their opinions a lot. It is the assertion that he is the most "overrated HOF'er" ever. One genious in that thread contends that Marv was a "lousy motivator". I think if you questioned every coach in the HOF, they would agree that guiding a team to four consecutinve losing Super Bowl appearences is the ultimate motivation job. But no, they say it was all Bill Polian. This is the kind of crap I hear all the time, down here in Texas, when they talk about the Cowboys. Some will argue that Aikman was nothing without Irving, other will argue that Irving was coked out loser, who owes everythig to Aikman. Still others will argue that Emmitt was the sole reason that the Cowboys of the 90's were so successful. And yet still, others will say Emmit is overrated, and it was his O-line that carried him to the HOF. All seem to agree that Jerry Jones deserves no credit for anything, all he did was drive the best NFL coach ever, out of town....you see what I am saying? Nothing can ever just be what it is, or what it was, everything is the cause and effect of something else. Marv couldn't get his team over the hump and win a Super Bowl (despite all the talent that they credit Polian with giving him to work with) so he is a lousy motivator, and a lousy coach, who does not belong in the HOF. My own opinion is that Marv was a great coach (not X's & O's necessarily), a great motivator, who, ultimately, was outcoached in one game (aganst another certain HOF coach in Parcells), and out-classed, personal wise, in three others. My guess is that nobody here would be questioning Levy's credentials for the HOF, if they were not disappointed with the way this off-season is going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted March 19, 2006 Author Share Posted March 19, 2006 Polian built this team, Levy underachieved with it! As soon as Polian left the team began to fall apart again. That's why Levy's ingenious and coaching prowess finished out his string with the Bills 7-9, 10-6, 10-6, 6-10. 635233[/snapback] I would argue that Levy was outcoached by Parcells in 1990. The Redskins and Cowboys teams that beat the Bills, were clearly better than the Bills. I think Polian did a great job, make no mistake. But keep in mind, once you get past the big names on those Bills rosters, they were comprised mostly of average, to mediocre talents who knew their roles. They knew their roles, and won a ton of games, because their coach impressed it upon them. With the exception of maybe Don Beebe, Cornelius Bennett and Will Wolford, nobody from those teams went anywhere else and had a good career. In fact, most disappeared after they left the Levy coached Bills...conincidence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Other than the four Super Bowl seasons... 635233[/snapback] Well, there's no denying Levy was the right man at the right time who benefitted from great players and a great GM. However, going to the bowl 4 straight times has never happened before or since. There was some luck involved, sure, but Levy was the guy running the ship when it happened. Take all the coaches before modern day free agency- some still coach today- and none of them went to 4 in a row. If Houston wins the comeback game, Levy is not in the Hall of Fame- he needed the 4 in a row in my opinion. But he did it, he's in, and why are we even questioning this, Bills fans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleedinblue Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Compare Levy's career record to Jimmy Johnson's, Bill Parcells', and Joe Gibbs'. There's no comparison with the three that dusted him in the big game. If Levy had never known Polian he'd never have come close to making the Hall of Fame. 635235[/snapback] Actually, overall career numbers are quite comparable: Parsells 163-123-1 (.569) 11-7 Playoffs Gibbs 140-76 (.640) 17-16 Levy 143-112 (.560 ) 11-8 Bilichek 99-77 (.562) 11-2 Noll 193-148 (.552) 16-8 Johnson 80-64 (.555) 9-4 http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 I too have noticed a great increase in the number of "strafe posters" who register and spout nonesense, attempting to disrupt and inflame the regulars around here. It almost always works. How bout we NOT reply to them, they will tend to go away... 635241[/snapback] I do a little housecleaning every few days. Occasionally, these infants get over their diaper rash. Usually not, though - I added 4 more of 'em to my Ignore list today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 To even suggest Marv can't coach, is to not have any clue whatsoever. To simply throw out 4 years of his coaching career as though they were trivial moments in his career and use that as any reference to his ability is absolute absurdity. Why not throw out all the other HOF caoches 4 best years and then compare, at least that would be a veiled attempt at reasonability? But, that's not the point is it. The point is exactly what has been suggested, just inane attempts to get a rise and create a little controversy; an attempt to creat a post and watch that post be responded to in any way somehow justifies a simple existence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt in KC Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Actually, overall career numbers are quite comparable: Parsells 163-123-1 (.569) 11-7 Playoffs Gibbs 140-76 (.640) 17-16 Levy 143-112 (.560 ) 11-8 Bilichek 99-77 (.562) 11-2 Noll 193-148 (.552) 16-8 Johnson 80-64 (.555) 9-4 http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/index.htm 635283[/snapback] Gosh, I dunno, bleedinblue.... I think your analysis may be too straightforward. I think what krazykat was saying is that you have to remove each coach's best four seasons and then look at their record (duh!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Is Marv Awake? Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Actually, overall career numbers are quite comparable: Parsells 163-123-1 (.569) 11-7 Playoffs Gibbs 140-76 (.640) 17-16 Levy 143-112 (.560 ) 11-8 Bilichek 99-77 (.562) 11-2 Noll 193-148 (.552) 16-8 Johnson 80-64 (.555) 9-4 http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/index.htm 635283[/snapback] What is Marv lacking that the others have? Rings. Not just one ring. Multiple rings. Without one Marv doesn't even quailify for the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt in KC Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 What is Marv lacking that the others have? Rings. Not just one ring. Multiple rings. Without one Marv doesn't even quailify for the discussion. 635322[/snapback] So there's only one good coach and one good GM each year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Is Marv Awake? Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 So there's only one good coach and one good GM each year? 635326[/snapback] Only one that gets the job done. It's what separates the "Greats" from everyone else. It's why five of the six listed will always be part of the greatest coaches of all time discussion. Levy doesn't make the grade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fischer Posted March 19, 2006 Share Posted March 19, 2006 Other than the four Super Bowl seasons, Levy's 94-97 in record. 7 of his 17 seasons had losing records, one was .500, two were 9-7. What mediocre or better coach wouldn't have gone an average 12-4 with the talent that we had in the early '90s? Polian built this team, Levy underachieved with it! As soon as Polian left the team began to fall apart again. That's why Levy's ingenious and coaching prowess finished out his string with the Bills 7-9, 10-6, 10-6, 6-10. 635233[/snapback] You should have stopped after "other than the four Super Bowl seasons . . ." ridiculous. butex is right, this is a shameful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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