JDG Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 well, start KH if you are happy with "Noodle Arm" Holcomb slinging 5 yard passes all game. Sure 70% completion looks good on paper, but when its friggin 20-25 for 125, thats worthless. As someone said in another thread, all short passes get you is 3rd and 3. Uh right..... and, umm.... isn't getting 3rd and 3 a *good* thing? JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 if losman is in this leauge as long as holcomb you ought to be eating crow for at least that long......he almost already has caught holcombs capability 486912[/snapback] I think too many people are confusing potential with achievement. What exactly did Losman actually do in weeks 2-4 to indicate that he is nearly as good as Holcomb, at this point? You can wax poetic about Losmans' scrambling abilityu, and cannon arm, or Holcombs slow feet and "noodle arm", but the numbers don't lie. Holcomb is much more proficient, at this point, than Losman. We can all undertand the logic of saying this team is so awful, they should let Losman play, and get over the hump. But, there is also logic, and a certain amount of responsibility that the Bills have to field the best possible team, right now, while their playoff hopes are still flickering. It likely won't happen, but how stupid would everyone feel if the Bills were to somehow beat the Patriots this weekend? Suddenly, their hopes look a lot better. If they lose Sunday, then I think the bye week is a good time to work Losman back into the starting role. People have way overreacted to Losman being benched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 I think too many people are confusing potential with achievement. What exactly did Losman actually do in weeks 2-4 to indicate that he is nearly as good as Holcomb, at this point? You can wax poetic about Losmans' scrambling abilityu, and cannon arm, or Holcombs slow feet and "noodle arm", but the numbers don't lie. Holcomb is much more proficient, at this point, than Losman. We can all undertand the logic of saying this team is so awful, they should let Losman play, and get over the hump. But, there is also logic, and a certain amount of responsibility that the Bills have to field the best possible team, right now, while their playoff hopes are still flickering. It likely won't happen, but how stupid would everyone feel if the Bills were to somehow beat the Patriots this weekend? Suddenly, their hopes look a lot better. If they lose Sunday, then I think the bye week is a good time to work Losman back into the starting role. People have way overreacted to Losman being benched. 487068[/snapback] i dont think they have overreacted when he was pulled out of the saints game with a full quarter to go down by less than a td and a pat.........only his second road start.........bring in a guy cold off the bench for the last 2 drives more than likely... 3 if things go quick?......................jp started that game off with a nice drive let him finish the game ........by finishing he either loses and gets game on the line 4th quarter experience, wins and gets a huge shot in the arm and a 2-2 record, or comes close............. dont know if you saw the giants game last week but if you did you might have noticed the reaction of Eli pulling the game out.........his brother would have just walked off the field, but it was Eli's first last second touchdown pass and could elevate his game further the position of qb is confidence take your training camp and the preseason and shift to reverse....if jp comes out looking better in the chiefs game it will be to his credit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 i dont think they have overreacted when he was pulled out of the saints game with a full quarter to go down by less than a td and a pat.........only his second road start.........bring in a guy cold off the bench for the last 2 drives more than likely... 3 if things go quick?......................jp started that game off with a nice drive let him finish the game ........by finishing he either loses and gets game on the line 4th quarter experience, wins and gets a huge shot in the arm and a 2-2 record, or comes close............. dont know if you saw the giants game last week but if you did you might have noticed the reaction of Eli pulling the game out.........his brother would have just walked off the field, but it was Eli's first last second touchdown pass and could elevate his game further the position of qb is confidence take your training camp and the preseason and shift to reverse....if jp comes out looking better in the chiefs game it will be to his credit 487088[/snapback] Actually, I was at the Saints game. Losman was horrendous. He was not getting the proverbial job done! It was not a bad move to bench him. I also saw the end of the Giants/Broncos game, and yes everyone was excited. Would they have been less excited about the win if it was a journeymen QB who had pulled it out. Again, I don't know what Eli Mannings situation has to do with Losmans. I will repeat this again, ELI MANNING HAD 7 STARTS IN HIS ROOKIE YEAR! Losman already has 4 under his belt, and will likely get at least another 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Actually, I was at the Saints game. Losman was horrendous. He was not getting the proverbial job done! It was not a bad move to bench him. Do you think KH is 'getting the job done' any better than JP was ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Actually, I was at the Saints game. Losman was horrendous. He was not getting the proverbial job done! It was not a bad move to bench him. I also saw the end of the Giants/Broncos game, and yes everyone was excited. Would they have been less excited about the win if it was a journeymen QB who had pulled it out. Again, I don't know what Eli Mannings situation has to do with Losmans. I will repeat this again, ELI MANNING HAD 7 STARTS IN HIS ROOKIE YEAR! Losman already has 4 under his belt, and will likely get at least another 5. 487105[/snapback] 4 under his belt and shift gears......if he gets 5 more that still isnt the equivalent to 7 in a row i have my doubts he plays in the chiefs game win or lose next week.....if you pull him out at 1-3 why put him back in at 3-5? you still have the same winning percentage and 8-8 or 9-7 might be good enough.... ...sure people would be excited and then KH would know he's reached the pinnacle of his carreer, while the young qb with credentials knows its just the beginning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 I'm sorry, but Sunday night in New England is not the situation where I want to put Losman back in the game. More importantly, first place is on the line against the Pats. We win, we're a leg up in the standings with a 3-0 division record. There is no question that Holcomb gives us the best chance to win this game, and the best chance to slip into the division title at 9-7. We shouldn't see Losman until the game is out of control..... if then. JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ch19079 Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Does anyone think that Losman will play this Sunday? Mularkey has been saying that he will play him as a "spark". I believe it might be an advantage since the Patriots have probably been planning on facing Holcomb for 2 weeks now. 486191[/snapback] i thaught Holcomb was the "spark" that was gunna turn things around. Holcomb has won 2 of the last 3. hes playing MUCH better than JP was. its our D thats loosing games for us now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 i thaught Holcomb was the "spark" that was gunna turn things around. Holcomb has won 2 of the last 3. hes playing MUCH better than JP was. its our D thats loosing games for us now. 487148[/snapback] While I agree that KH will, and should, start this week...the SPARK is Willis. At the risk of sounding like a guy on a crusade, 16 rushing attempts is nowhere NEAR enough, He should be getting 30+ evey game...certainly no less than 25. He had 4 (FOUR) rushing attempts in the second half. We were not that far behind that we had to pass the entire 3rd quarter. The spark is WILLIS! Run the GD Ball! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shameless Homer Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 While I agree that KH will, and should, start this week...the SPARK is Willis. At the risk of sounding like a guy on a crusade, 16 rushing attempts is nowhere NEAR enough, He should be getting 30+ evey game...certainly no less than 25. He had 4 (FOUR) rushing attempts in the second half. We were not that far behind that we had to pass the entire 3rd quarter. The spark is WILLIS! Run the GD Ball! 487153[/snapback] What does it matter who the QB is? As long as it's Anybody but Bledsoe. Remember guys? Anybody but Bledsoe will take us deep into the playoffs and probably the Super Bowl. JP Losman is all this team needs. Remember guys? Bledsoe was responsible for last years 7 losses and the team won 9 games despite him. Remember guys? Rico, Mile High, Labatt, Mead107, LABills and this list goes on and on. Guys who were full of hate for Bledsoe and were sure Losman (or Stojan's grandmother) would assure the playoffs. Bledsoe gaffed on one play this past weekend but his numbers are far loftier than Losman's and the rest. Including a 4-3 team record and a real shot at the playoffs. We should have kept him. There is no longer any doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Do you think KH is 'getting the job done' any better than JP was ? 487121[/snapback] Yes, actually I do. He has been significantly better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Yes, actually I do. He has been significantly better. 487196[/snapback] Indeed, for those of you, like Homer, who are pining for Bledsoe, how about these stats for you. Bledsoe's QB rating: 94.9 Holcomb's QB rating: 95.2 Bledsoe's INT's: 6 Holcomb's INT's: 2 Bledsoe's Sacks: 17 (yes, Virginia, *seventeen*) Holcomb's Sacks: 8 (behind arguably a much worse O-Line) Bledsoe's Completion Percentage: 62.3% Holcomb's Completion Percentage: 70.5%* (* - leads NFL) Personally, I feel very good about dropping Bledsoe for Holcomb, particularly given what Bledsoe had showed me for the last two seasons - that he was a very dumb and very immobile player who couldn't win on the road and was pretty inept at the 2 minute drill. JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Indeed, for those of you, like Homer, who are pining for Bledsoe, how about these stats for you. Bledsoe's QB rating: 94.9 Holcomb's QB rating: 95.2 Bledsoe's INT's: 6 Holcomb's INT's: 2 Bledsoe's Sacks: 17 (yes, Virginia, *seventeen*) Holcomb's Sacks: 8 (behind arguably a much worse O-Line) Bledsoe's Completion Percentage: 62.3% Holcomb's Completion Percentage: 70.5%* (* - leads NFL) Personally, I feel very good about dropping Bledsoe for Holcomb, particularly given what Bledsoe had showed me for the last two seasons - that he was a very dumb and very immobile player who couldn't win on the road and was pretty inept at the 2 minute drill. JDG 487219[/snapback] Not sure why you are quoting me. I was answering Fan In Chicago's question as to if I thought Kelly Holcomb was "getting the job done" better than JP Losman had. My answer was, yes, he has played significantly better than Losman did. I didn't mention Bledsoe at all...he is not on the team anymore, and can do nothing to help the Bills win games! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Yes, actually I do. He has been significantly better. 487196[/snapback] Okay, I will agree to disagree with you. Actually we are screw*d in more ways than one and this is not just a QB issue. Given that we are doomed to miss the playoffs, we might as well start JP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 well, start KH if you are happy with "Noodle Arm" Holcomb slinging 5 yard passes all game. 486350[/snapback] Hey, I heard that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockpile Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 If they lose against NE, I think they'll give JP the start after the bye. If they win, we're in first place and they stick with KH. 486225[/snapback] Oh, Puh-Leeze! That would make sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted October 26, 2005 Share Posted October 26, 2005 Oh, Puh-Leeze! That would make sense! 487434[/snapback] oops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 27, 2005 Share Posted October 27, 2005 Actually, I was at the Saints game. Losman was horrendous. He was not getting the proverbial job done! It was not a bad move to bench him. I also saw the end of the Giants/Broncos game, and yes everyone was excited. Would they have been less excited about the win if it was a journeymen QB who had pulled it out. Again, I don't know what Eli Mannings situation has to do with Losmans. I will repeat this again, ELI MANNING HAD 7 STARTS IN HIS ROOKIE YEAR! Losman already has 4 under his belt, and will likely get at least another 5. 487105[/snapback] Losman had two home games. One he played pretty well against a crappy team with a losing record and they won. Another he played fair at best and they lost, against a good Atlanta team. If you look really close, he didnt play terrible. Holcomb had two games at home and he played pretty well and they won against two crappy teams with losing records. He played one game on the road against a crappy team and we got killed and he did very little except the first drive, which is something Losman did in one or two of his losses also. Their histories havent been as widely disparate as one may be led to believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted October 27, 2005 Share Posted October 27, 2005 I didn't have the advantage of being able to say any of Losman's starts this year. I will say, however, that not only is Losman's performance line from the Atlanta game *not* "fair" - but it borders on utter incompetence: 10 of 23 (43.5%) for *75* yards with no TD's an INT, 4 sacks, and a fumble. He had 5 rushes for 20 yards. It is an utter miracle that we weren't blown out of the water in that game with a performance line like that. I think that I would struggle to find worse performance lines from any QB in the NFL iover the last few years. What is utterly shocking is that his performance line against the Saints is almost identical: 7 of 15 (46%) for 75 yards (*again*!) no TD's, an INT, 3 sacks, and a fumble (which he recovered.) He had 4 rushes for 38 yards. For the game in Tampa, he at least didn't have any turnovers, and only 2 sacks, but 11 of 28 (39% - which is almost impossible in the NFL) for 113 yards is still essentially incompetent. Yes, Eli Manning was pretty bad his rookie year (in fact, his performance lines were stunningly similar in some games), but he also didn't start until Thanksgiving time. If the Bills drop out of the playoff hunt, Losman may get similar opportunities. Nevertheless, after looking closely, I disagree - Losman played utterly, totally, and completely terribly. An unmitigated disaster in those games that he played. The good news is, he almost *has* to get better...... but not before making sure that we don't burn the team on the funeral pyre of Losman's development. JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted October 27, 2005 Share Posted October 27, 2005 Losman had two home games. One he played pretty well against a crappy team with a losing record and they won. Another he played fair at best and they lost, against a good Atlanta team. If you look really close, he didnt play terrible. Holcomb had two games at home and he played pretty well and they won against two crappy teams with losing records. He played one game on the road against a crappy team and we got killed and he did very little except the first drive, which is something Losman did in one or two of his losses also. Their histories havent been as widely disparate as one may be led to believe. 487520[/snapback] I guess I don't see it that way...I think Holcomb may have played his best game against the Raiders, yet conversely, the defense played its' worse game of the season. I didn't see Holcomb make big plays, but I also didn't see him whiff on plays that were available to him. Losman did that continually against both the Falcons and the Saints. I honestly think if Holcomb had started both of those games, we would have won at least one, if not both of them. Really man, I am not writing Losman off as a lost cause, but I think this notion that he played "almost as well" as Holcomb is absurd... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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