ganesh Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Holcomb is only a marginal improvement over JP. KH still throws INT's, takes dumb sacks, misses his receivers, except he's a veteran, so I guess that makes it all better. One big difference is KH can't throw long or with any zip. His passes float like frisbees. PTR 484696[/snapback] Oh no...When your veteran WR says that he has to be the better one and the one that should be played......Sadly, the day our caoching staff gave in to players wishes, the head coach lost control of this football team.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East Brady Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Yeah, based on what I've seen of his play, that was pretty uncharacteristic of Holcomb. In fact, it was downright Losman-esque. 484634[/snapback] At least with JP there is a chance he might outrun the D....Holcomb..........all I can say is , you can't teach an old dog, new tricks.....Maybe JP could learn... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 But the bottom line is, what has Kelly Holcomb done to really show that he deserves to start over JP? In my opinion, the only thing he has really done in his three starts that's noteworthy is NOT LOSE GAMES. His numbers are modest, and while he may be completing 70 percent of his passes, he's averaging like 160 yards per game. He absolutely cannot throw an accurate pass beyond 15 or 20 yards. In the last 3 games, how many deep balls has he thrown? maybe 4, and each one was horribly missed. From badly underthrowing Moulds, to badly overthrowing Evans and Reed. 484422[/snapback] Without an offensive line, your team isn't going to complete many deep passes. Rob Johnson played without pass protection, and he'd take the sack while waiting for the deep throw to open up. Holcomb also plays without an offensive line. But when he takes the dump-off option instead of the sack, people complain that he's not going deep. On that badly underthrown pass to Moulds, Holcomb was hit as he threw. Yesterday Holcomb was hit practically every time he dropped back to pass. Many QBs would have responded by becoming rattled and throwing interceptions. Holcomb didn't. His 70% completion percentage is a testimony to his coolness when everything around him was going to pieces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risin Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 On that badly underthrown pass to Moulds, Holcomb was hit as he threw. Yesterday Holcomb was hit practically every time he dropped back to pass. Many QBs would have responded by becoming rattled and throwing interceptions. Holcomb didn't. His 70% completion percentage is a testimony to his coolness when everything around him was going to pieces. 484789[/snapback] Kelly was hit AFTER he released that deep ball to moulds, watch it again. There is no shame in having a rag arm, unless you play in Buffalo anytime after October 31st. Rob Johnson used to have a great completion percentage, and QB rating, how'd that work out? I have ZERO confidence that KH can QB this team, and lead us to a comeback when we are down by a couple of TD's and need to throw downfield. Even most of his TD's have been 3 yard passes, that WR's made great runs after the catch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 On that badly underthrown pass to Moulds, Holcomb was hit as he threw. Yesterday Holcomb was hit practically every time he dropped back to pass. Many QBs would have responded by becoming rattled and throwing interceptions. Holcomb didn't. His 70% completion percentage is a testimony to his coolness when everything around him was going to pieces. 484789[/snapback] You have to be kidding me. His 70% completion percentage is exactly what every other QB in the league completes in the 0-10 yard range...the only differencethat is that is the only pass that Holcomb attempts so his total completion percentage remains that high. The Raiders didn't mind Holcomb dumping the ball off, in fact they played a perfect D for it. They'd let him dump it off and there was an LB or a S there to make the tackle every single time. As for the "everything around him going to pieces" part, you are correct. Of course, this is exactly why we shouldn't be wasting time with Holcomb at QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YOOOOOO Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 The blame can be spread out...coaching, playcalling, run defense, pass defense, lack of pass rush, WR drops, terrible pass blocking.... but to say Holcomb is free from blame is bull sh--.... he missed many passes on the day...took one of the worst sacks ive seen in a long time....fumbled a snap that hit his hands....held the ball to long at times...had chances to break the pocket and gain some yards(like Collins did to us a couple times) but stayed in and took a couple sacks.... are team overall was just terrible yesterday... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Without an offensive line, your team isn't going to complete many deep passes. Rob Johnson played without pass protection, and he'd take the sack while waiting for the deep throw to open up. Holcomb also plays without an offensive line. But when he takes the dump-off option instead of the sack, people complain that he's not going deep. On that badly underthrown pass to Moulds, Holcomb was hit as he threw. Yesterday Holcomb was hit practically every time he dropped back to pass. Many QBs would have responded by becoming rattled and throwing interceptions. Holcomb didn't. His 70% completion percentage is a testimony to his coolness when everything around him was going to pieces. 484789[/snapback] Hell, when oyu ask the QB to complete nothing longer than 10 yards, you BETTER be able to complete 70% of your passes...holcomb's arm is limp and JP needs to get back in after the bye... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 he missed many passes on the day...took one of the worst sacks ive seen in a long time....fumbled a snap that hit his hands....held the ball to long at times...had chances to break the pocket and gain some yards(like Collins did to us a couple times) but stayed in and took a couple sacks.... 484819[/snapback] I'm not going to excuse that fumbled snap, which was clearly Holcomb's worst play of the game. But the sack wasn't as black and white. The first group of defenders came in practically as soon as the ball was snapped. Had Holcomb tried throwing it then chances are good the ball would have been stripped. Instead, he evaded that group of defenders. I believe he was still inside the tackle box at that point, so simply throwing the ball to the sidelines wasn't an option. He seemed to take a brief second to look for the dumpoff option or something, which is when the second wave of defenders came for the sack. Clearly he would have been better off rolling out to either his right or his left and throwing the ball away. But it looked like both the right and the left were blocked off by defenders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 I'm not going to excuse that fumbled snap, which was clearly Holcomb's worst play of the game. But the sack wasn't as black and white. The first group of defenders came in practically as soon as the ball was snapped. Had Holcomb tried throwing it then chances are good the ball would have been stripped. Instead, he evaded that group of defenders. I believe he was still inside the tackle box at that point, so simply throwing the ball to the sidelines wasn't an option. He seemed to take a brief second to look for the dumpoff option or something, which is when the second wave of defenders came for the sack. Clearly he would have been better off rolling out to either his right or his left and throwing the ball away. But it looked like both the right and the left were blocked off by defenders. 484835[/snapback] what scared me the most about that play, was that our line was holding and he STILL got sacked... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 You have to be kidding me. His 70% completion percentage is exactly what every other QB in the league completes in the 0-10 yard range... 484816[/snapback] Every QB except Losman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 I didn't know Holcomb's arm had joined us in the forum. Question: Considering you are only used to throw short range passes, are you ever fatigued? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 I didn't know Holcomb's arm had joined us in the forum. Question: Considering you are only used to throw short range passes, are you ever fatigued? 484852[/snapback] I see by your sig that when life gives you lemons you should throw them at people. My offensive line has been giving me enough lemons to feed a Third World country. Yes, I am fatigued! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 When your veteran WR says that he has to be the better one andthe one that should be played 484709[/snapback] Something tells me Eric Moulds knows a thing or two about which QB is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 You have to be kidding me. His 70% completion percentage is exactly what every other QB in the league completes in the 0-10 yard range... 484816[/snapback] Maybe that is why JP is riding the pine. His completion percentage on 0-10 yard passes wasn't even close to 70%! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East Brady Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 I see by your sig that when life gives you lemons you should throw them at people. My offensive line has been giving me enough lemons to feed a Third World country. Yes, I am fatigued! 484875[/snapback] Question for holcombs arm.....Have you ever been able to throw it deep or is this just a problem with the play calling??? Which style of offense do you like better this one or the one that got you killed in cleveland??:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan III Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Maybe that is why JP is riding the pine. His completion percentage on 0-10 yard passes wasn't even close to 70%! 484898[/snapback] True. JP also struggled checking out of a play at the line. I think those are the 2 main reasons MM made the switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Which style of offense do you like better this one or the one that got you killed in cleveland??:-) 484915[/snapback] That's like asking whether you would prefer to be eaten alive by ants or piranhas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachChuckDickerson Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 You have to be kidding me. His 70% completion percentage is exactly what every other QB in the league completes in the 0-10 yard range...the only differencethat is that is the only pass that Holcomb attempts so his total completion percentage remains that high. The Raiders didn't mind Holcomb dumping the ball off, in fact they played a perfect D for it. They'd let him dump it off and there was an LB or a S there to make the tackle every single time. As for the "everything around him going to pieces" part, you are correct. Of course, this is exactly why we shouldn't be wasting time with Holcomb at QB. 484816[/snapback] Actually when he throws 1-10 yards he completes 77.1% of his passes, from 11-20 he completes 66.7%. JP is 47.5% from 1-10 and 54.3 from 11-20. Peyton Manning is 67.1 from 1-10 and 68.3. With that said, if he wants to remain the starter he needs to go deep a lot more often and stop playing it so safe. If that is coaching or the QB I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Something tells me Eric Moulds knows a thing or two about which QB is better. 484889[/snapback] I would think the HC knows better than having to listen to his WR to make a change. My point was MM lost control of this team by going with the wishes of some of the veterans rather than looking at the longer path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Ridiculous. Mularkey made the decision he felt was best for the team. Just because a few vets went into this office doesn't mean that he based his decision solely on them. Nevertheless, had Mularkey continued to play Losman, looking at (as you call it) the "longer path," he would have lost his team. The decision to go with Alex Smith and Eli Manning are completely different, as they come in wtih a 7 ear contract making Pro Bowl money. Such is not the case with JP. My point was MM lost control of this team by going with thewishes of some of the veterans rather than looking at the longer path. 485083[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts