Thurman's Helmet Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 And yes, Gitmo has political prisoners. Free Stephen Biko and Nelson Mandela!! DOWN WITH GITMO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGTEleven Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 I didn't ask what made you think they had an agenda. I asked what their motive was for having an anti-American agenda. why ( P ) Pronunciation Key (hw, w) adv. For what purpose, reason, or cause; with what intention, justification, or motive: Why is the door shut? Why do birds sing? 347112[/snapback] From the same person who brought you: I once said that the Beatles were better then the Rolling Stones and the American government threw me in Gitmo. B E A U tiful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Tate Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Finally a report that I feel hits the nail on the head. Nonsense. Tens of thousands of individuals have been captured and processed by American forces. There have been a few hundred allegations of abuse, and only a few dozen documented cases. Investigations are ongoing, prosecutions have been brought, and some individuals have already been punished. The record of human-rights compliance so far compiled by the United States Armed Forces in the war on terror has been exemplary. I hope no one is under the misconception AI is an objective organization that doesn't have a political agenda. It includes a worldwide ban of the death penalty and institution of the International Criminal Court. Are all of their supporters here signed up for that, too? Want to see American officials traveling abroad seized and prosecuted in the ICC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 Hot-Pocket Disclaimer: I'm by no means discounting the terrible conditions of the gulags operated by the Soviet Union or the suffering that those who were held there endured. Nor am I attempting to draw any comparison to them and Gitmo. Anyone who has read The Gulag Archipelago (myself included) will forever have very strong reactions whenever we hear the word "gulag." But I do think it's important to remember that the definition of the word gulag is "a labor camp or prison for political prisoners" and should not be defined by the atrocities that occured in the Soviet Union's. The results of Amnesty's findings aside, by using an objective and non-connotation laden definition, Gitmo is a gulag. Therefore, the writer was accurate in his use of the word from my understanding of the context in which it was used, ie, "the prison for politcal prisoners of our time." I say that, because I hope that any person who is learned enough to use the word "gulag" in a sentence must know the difference between Gitmo and the Soviet's infamous gulags. As an aside, if anyone hasn't read The Gulag Archipelago, it's well worth your time. It is a powerful read that will change your perspective on a great many issues. I know that it did mine. As another aside, I understand that after the Soviet Union fell Solzhenitsyn returned to Russia. What a homecoming that must have been, eh? 346994[/snapback] Actually, Chris, I'd argue that the definition of the word "gulag" should PRECISELY be defined by the Soviet version - considering that's where the word (acronym, actually) came from in the first place. What little smidgen of Russian I once knew has long since retreated into a deep, dark corner of my brain... but this link looks correct: Gulag, according to wikipedia To your second aside: Solzhenitsyn is certainly a fascinating man to study. One wonders what path he would have followed if Stalin hadn't gone overboard... ...and an aside of my own: isn't it marvelous that we can agree to disagree, without Beria's thugs knocking on either of our doors in the middle of the night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 And yes, Gitmo has political prisoners. There is a world of difference between an Iraqi saying something like "Down with Bush" or "Down with America" and actually being a terrorist, yet anti-American rhetoric can land Ahmed the Iraqi in Gitmo. 347332[/snapback] Prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reuben Gant Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Amnesty International is a bunch of pie-in-the-sky dreamers. They have no idea the nastiness that real life dictates. 346188[/snapback] wow, I have a friend that used to work for CIA and now works for Amnesty. You might be right. But I think they, better than most, know how the world works. They report nastiness everyday, so much so that the pie-in-the-sky dreamers rarely last very long because it is too discouraging. Imagine if you keep investigating the nastiness that China does, and even if no news outlet is interested, they keep at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTS Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Finally a report that I feel hits the nail on the head.346121[/snapback] Tuesday, September 11th, 2001 ... that's all that needs to be said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Tuesday, September 11th, 2001 ... that's all that needs to be said. 348362[/snapback] No it's not. See, that's the attitude that loses liberty and gives the government carte blanche to abuse the power they've stolen. At the end of the day 9/11 happened BECAUSE our government can't keep its hands to itself. The only war our government has won since WWII is the one they're waging against the Constitution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 But I think they, better than most, know how the world works.348360[/snapback] bull sh--. They call Gitmo the 'gulag of our time'...which indicates that 1) they know nothing about the gulags, and 2) they know nothing about Gitmo. And because they have high and lofty ideals, they are somehow able to write an authoratitive report on Gitmo, having never visited it I'm sure, comparing it to the gulags, having never visited them either I'd wager. But they know, better than most, how the world works? Hell with that, they don't even know how to research their own !@#$ing reports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blzrul Posted June 1, 2005 Share Posted June 1, 2005 bull sh--. They call Gitmo the 'gulag of our time'...which indicates that 1) they know nothing about the gulags, and 2) they know nothing about Gitmo. And because they have high and lofty ideals, they are somehow able to write an authoratitive report on Gitmo, having never visited it I'm sure, comparing it to the gulags, having never visited them either I'd wager. But they know, better than most, how the world works? Hell with that, they don't even know how to research their own !@#$ing reports. 348387[/snapback] Yeah and besides as Bush said just today those people they interviewed are just "dis-assemblers". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted June 1, 2005 Share Posted June 1, 2005 "I gave my love a cherry that had no stone.I gave my love a chicken that had no bones..." 346813[/snapback] That was the absolute FIRST thing that popped into my head when I read BiB's comment about folk music. I can still see John Belushi grabbing the guy's guitar, smashing the crap out of it, handing the pieces back to the guy and saying, almost sincerely, "Sorry." The unfortunate thing about all this is that AI got what it wanted: headlines that say "US prison camps" followed by "gulag of our time" (in parentheses, capital letters, quotated, as Arlo Guthrie would say), and their job is done. They're not going to cause some actual change. But they put a dink in the armor. Good stuff, Paul. Thanks for the read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted June 1, 2005 Share Posted June 1, 2005 That was the absolute FIRST thing that popped into my head when I read BiB's comment about folk music. I can still see John Belushi grabbing the guy's guitar, smashing the crap out of it, handing the pieces back to the guy and saying, almost sincerely, "Sorry." The unfortunate thing about all this is that AI got what it wanted: headlines that say "US prison camps" followed by "gulag of our time" (in parentheses, capital letters, quotated, as Arlo Guthrie would say), and their job is done. They're not going to cause some actual change. But they put a dink in the armor. Good stuff, Paul. Thanks for the read. 348568[/snapback] That folk singer is Stephen Bishop (On and On was one of his hits -I believe). He also sang the theme song at the end. The girl adoring him is Belushi's wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted June 1, 2005 Share Posted June 1, 2005 Yeah and besides as Bush said just today those people they interviewed are just "dis-assemblers". 348541[/snapback] Yeah, well...Bush is an illiterate idiot. We all knew that. And honestly...I'd wager a good portion of the American public doesn't know the word "dissemble", anyway. It's not an exceptional mistake like "nukyooler" or "subliminable", merely a normal everyday American one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted June 1, 2005 Share Posted June 1, 2005 Yeah and besides as Bush said just today those people they interviewed are just "dis-assemblers". 348541[/snapback] "NO DISASSEMBLE !! NO DISASSEMBLE !!!" Couldn't help but giggle when I heard that soundbite..... I won't pick on GWB for 'nu-cu-lar', though - that's exactly how my old high school chemistry teacher pronounced it. (Not saying it's correct, just saying I'm used to it by now...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blzrul Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 "NO DISASSEMBLE !! NO DISASSEMBLE !!!" Couldn't help but giggle when I heard that soundbite..... I won't pick on GWB for 'nu-cu-lar', though - that's exactly how my old high school chemistry teacher pronounced it. (Not saying it's correct, just saying I'm used to it by now...) 349120[/snapback] I hear ya. Like every time I hear some yahoo say "Mos-COW" I remember Walter Cronkite admonition that "there is NO "cow" in Moscow". It is, of course, pronounced Mos-coe. Yeah, he's not the brightest bulb in the pack, no doubt about THAT. The sad part is there are probably a large number of 'Murkins who heard it and thought "wow! he's got a great vocabulary! I never knew that! Maw! Turn down the tee-vee and listen to this..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reuben Gant Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 The anger at the Gulag comment has me thinking. The whole problem with Gitmo is that it is not well defined. It is not a POW camp or it would be under Geneva Rules. It is not a prison in the strict sense because nobody is charged with a crime. Does anybody have a clear definition of what it is beyond detention camp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 2, 2005 Author Share Posted June 2, 2005 The anger at the Gulag comment has me thinking. The whole problem with Gitmo is that it is not well defined. It is not a POW camp or it would be under Geneva Rules. It is not a prison in the strict sense because nobody is charged with a crime. Does anybody have a clear definition of what it is beyond detention camp? 349469[/snapback] Which leads to the speculation that is causing us problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of BiB Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 "NO DISASSEMBLE !! NO DISASSEMBLE !!!"Couldn't help but giggle when I heard that soundbite..... I won't pick on GWB for 'nu-cu-lar', though - that's exactly how my old high school chemistry teacher pronounced it. (Not saying it's correct, just saying I'm used to it by now...) 349120[/snapback] Johnny Five Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Tate Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Johnny Five 349618[/snapback] That took me a couple seconds, but that's funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of BiB Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Thank Lori. I just had this image of a bunch of muslims waving their arms looking at a dead grasshopper... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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