switz1610 Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 Portnoy would be the ass to the bidet. Anyway, I'm sure Pegula has figured out this crew doesn't have the money for a multiyear deal. Next... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 24 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: Portnoy would be the ass to the bidet. Anyway, I'm sure Pegula has figured out this crew doesn't have the money for a multiyear deal. Next... They just sold to Penn National for $450M. I thought you were normally on top of this kind of stuff? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 12 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: They just sold to Penn National for $450M. I thought you were normally on top of this kind of stuff? Yes and as I pointed out earlier, a company with 1 billion in annual revenue couldn't afford the annual nut on their stadium naming rights---almost from the get go, it appears. The recent purchase price of a company is not an indication of how much cash on hand that new owner of the company has.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 39 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: Yes and as I pointed out earlier, a company with 1 billion in annual revenue couldn't afford the annual nut on their stadium naming rights---almost from the get go, it appears. The recent purchase price of a company is not an indication of how much cash on hand that new owner of the company has.. The New Era deal paid the Bills roughly $5M annually. With Barstool being owned by a sports gambling operation it make TOTAL sense that they’d be interested in a naming rights deal (or at least the exposure of trying). Penn National has a market cap of 7.65B. For what it’s worth the first part of the barstool purchase was 36% for $163M in cash and stock. This deal likely doesn’t happen but it isn’t because they couldn’t afford it. $5M a year for the rest of the lease is a bargain for a sports gaming company looking to grow. It’s actually one of the few situations in the world where naming rights might end up beneficial. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said: The New Era deal paid the Bills roughly $5M annually. With Barstool being owned by a sports gambling operation it make TOTAL sense that they’d be interested in a naming rights deal (or at least the exposure of trying). Penn National has a market cap of 7.65B. For what it’s worth the first part of the barstool purchase was 36% for $163M in cash and stock. This deal likely doesn’t happen but it isn’t because they couldn’t afford it. $5M a year for the rest of the lease is a bargain for a sports gaming company looking to grow. It’s actually one of the few situations in the world where naming rights might end up beneficial. I don't doubt why they would want to purchase high profile naming rights. But Penn National, a casino group is the not the majority owner of Barstool and they would not be paying the Pegulas for the rights. Due to COVID, they are selling assets to generate cash. They just posted a 77% Q3 year over year revenue drop. Anyway, Penn National would get little benefit from "Barstool Stadium", given its core business. They are Barstool investor that few have ever heard of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 5 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: I don't doubt why they would want to purchase high profile naming rights. But Penn National, a casino group is the not the majority owner of Barstool and they would not be paying the Pegulas for the rights. Due to COVID, they are selling assets to generate cash. They just posted a 77% Q3 year over year revenue drop. Anyway, Penn National would get little benefit from "Barstool Stadium", given its core business. They are Barstool investor that few have ever heard of. Penn National will have 1/2 of Barstool in 3 years as per the agreement and the right to buy controlling ownership at that time. I believe that this wouldn’t be a rogue Barstool investment. Penn National would be tied in. They are the part that really stands to benefit from the exposure. I don’t know exactly what it would look like but suspect they are working on it. Also saw yesterday that Portnoy is moving to Philly to be more involved on the Penn National end of things. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 5 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: Yes and as I pointed out earlier, a company with 1 billion in annual revenue couldn't afford the annual nut on their stadium naming rights---almost from the get go, it appears. The recent purchase price of a company is not an indication of how much cash on hand that new owner of the company has.. I think you’re giving New Era too much credit here. They took millions from the county to keep jobs in Buffalo. Then still cut 100+. Poloncarz publicly requested them to remove their name. Then negotiations started and the name was removed. They’ve been pretty bad stewards for the city recently. If you believe this is about them not having the money to honor the rest of the existing contract, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. The community and New Era are parting ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Mango said: I think you’re giving New Era too much credit here. They took millions from the county to keep jobs in Buffalo. Then still cut 100+. Poloncarz publicly requested them to remove their name. Then negotiations started and the name was removed. They’ve been pretty bad stewards for the city recently. If you believe this is about them not having the money to honor the rest of the existing contract, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. The community and New Era are parting ways. Poloncranz () could do all the requesting he wanted--the deal was between the Bills and New Era only. New Era took 5-10 million form the fed in PPP. The Bills were involved in restructuring the payment deal over a year ago and well before any COVID impact on New Era. This is exactly about New Era's difficulty paying the annula amount. https://buffalonews.com/news/new-era-name-to-be-dropped-from-bills-stadium/article_d2117992-c6c6-11ea-9ea8-0fada25c9c73.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 6 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: Penn National will have 1/2 of Barstool in 3 years as per the agreement and the right to buy controlling ownership at that time. I believe that this wouldn’t be a rogue Barstool investment. Penn National would be tied in. They are the part that really stands to benefit from the exposure. I don’t know exactly what it would look like but suspect they are working on it. Also saw yesterday that Portnoy is moving to Philly to be more involved on the Penn National end of things. Unless the labeling is "Penn National Stadium", no one will make the connection in a way that will boost their core business of casinos (plummeting). Anyway, I just don't see Pegulas (especiallY Kim Pegula) wanting Barstool as their home brand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said: Poloncranz () could do all the requesting he wanted--the deal was between the Bills and New Era only. New Era took 5-10 million form the fed in PPP. The Bills were involved in restructuring the payment deal over a year ago and well before any COVID impact on New Era. This is exactly about New Era's difficulty paying the annula amount. https://buffalonews.com/news/new-era-name-to-be-dropped-from-bills-stadium/article_d2117992-c6c6-11ea-9ea8-0fada25c9c73.html Oh, please. Koch even says in the article, “We don’t do naming rights deals”. He credits the only reason for doing it is his relationship with Terry. The author also credits New Era paying for naming rights for keeping the Bills in Buffalo. Which is wild, Ralph didn’t name it after himself because he had to, he just wanted to. Also at $4M per year, it’s half the league average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 4 minutes ago, Mango said: Oh, please. Koch even says in the article, “We don’t do naming rights deals”. He credits the only reason for doing it is his relationship with Terry. The author also credits New Era paying for naming rights for keeping the Bills in Buffalo. Which is wild, Ralph didn’t name it after himself because he had to, he just wanted to. Also at $4M per year, it’s half the league average. You're kdding, right? LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 52 minutes ago, Doc said: You're kdding, right? LOL! “That moment was five years in the making, dating back to when the Bills and Erie County were working out a new stadium lease and the team’s founder, Ralph Wilson Jr., was still alive and owned the team. Russ Brandon, then the president of the Bills, asked Koch if he someday would be willing to put New Era’s name on the stadium, which bore Wilson’s name and was often called "The Ralph." Koch told Brandon he would be open to talking about it. The question – exploratory as it was at the time – was part of a plan aimed at keeping the team in Buffalo after Wilson’s death. Making the lucrative naming rights available would be attractive to a new owner.“ My statement was a bit hyperbolic. But yes. The author implies that naming the stadium “New Era” took 5 years. And that naming the stadium at 50% of the going rate for NFL stadiums (or $4M per year) was going to help somebody decide weather or not to make a $1B investment. Anyways. New Era has been slashing their overhead for years. Moving almost their entire supply chain to China. Increasing profit margins. Miami is only open to make theMLB hats, which are contractually obligated to be produced in the US. New Era could definitely afford to honor the duration of the contract. They just don’t want to. There is a very significant difference between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Mango said: Oh, please. Koch even says in the article, “We don’t do naming rights deals”. He credits the only reason for doing it is his relationship with Terry. The author also credits New Era paying for naming rights for keeping the Bills in Buffalo. Which is wild, Ralph didn’t name it after himself because he had to, he just wanted to. Also at $4M per year, it’s half the league average. You said the deal ending didn’t have anything to with ability to pay the fee—that it had something to do with the Erie County government. The article proves you wrong. Also, Erie didn’t give New Era millions. Also, the naming deal came 2 years after Pegula bought the team. The couple million it brought is/was unlikely to be what keeps/kept the Bills in Buffalo (their onerous lease is what kept them and would have outlasted the rights deal anyway). To reiterate, the deal fell apart only because, despite both sides trying to figure out some payment plan, New Era couldn’t afford it. Nothing to do with the county or it executive. What were saying about a Brooklyn Bridge...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: Unless the labeling is "Penn National Stadium", no one will make the connection in a way that will boost their core business of casinos (plummeting). Anyway, I just don't see Pegulas (especiallY Kim Pegula) wanting Barstool as their home brand. I think that the Pegulas will be open to anyone offering $5M a year. I’m not sure the county will let that happen though as they have “veto rights.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: I think that the Pegulas will be open to anyone offering $5M a year. I’m not sure the county will let that happen though as they have “veto rights.” The names that the County can object to are on a very specific list as per the lease. They "shall not unreasoanbly cause embarrassment to the county" (such as names containing slang, barbarisms or profanity, names that can be construed to encourage th use of beer or other alcoholic beverages by minors or the use of tobacco by persons of any age; or names that relate to illicit drugs or any sexually oriented business or enterprise)". Futher, the County approval of the name "shall not be unreasonably withheld and excepting the names which the County and ECSC have previously consented as set forth in (the above quoted section)". So the County has extremely narrow "veto rights" here. There is no chance that Pegula would accept rights from a group that would violate that quoted section anyway. "Barstool" is veto proof per the language of the lease. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 6 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: The names that the County can object to are on a very specific list as per the lease. They "shall not unreasoanbly cause embarrassment to the county" (such as names containing slang, barbarisms or profanity, names that can be construed to encourage th use of beer or other alcoholic beverages by minors or the use of tobacco by persons of any age; or names that relate to illicit drugs or any sexually oriented business or enterprise)". Futher, the County approval of the name "shall not be unreasonably withheld and excepting the names which the County and ECSC have previously consented as set forth in (the above quoted section)". So the County has extremely narrow "veto rights" here. There is no chance that Pegula would accept rights from a group that would violate that quoted section anyway. "Barstool" is veto proof per the language of the lease. Thanks I didn’t realize that. IMO, that makes them a lot more viable. I guess Goodell could step in but if the county can’t veto that it’s a possibility. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Thanks I didn’t realize that. IMO, that makes them a lot more viable. I guess Goodell could step in but if the county can’t veto that it’s a possibility. Given the public persona of Barstool, I would find it incongruous for Kim Pegula to get onboard with that D-bag as the label of their home. Edited August 23, 2020 by Mr. WEO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: You said the deal ending didn’t have anything to with ability to pay the fee—that it had something to do with the Erie County government. The article proves you wrong. Also, Erie didn’t give New Era millions. Also, the naming deal came 2 years after Pegula bought the team. The couple million it brought is/was unlikely to be what keeps/kept the Bills in Buffalo (their onerous lease is what kept them and would have outlasted the rights deal anyway). To reiterate, the deal fell apart only because, despite both sides trying to figure out some payment plan, New Era couldn’t afford it. Nothing to do with the county or it executive. What were saying about a Brooklyn Bridge...? Sorry, never meant to imply that Mark Poloncarz was responsible for the move. Rather painting the whole picture that New Era has been pulling out of Buffalo for years, and the local GOV is not happy about it. Local governments have been giving tax breaks to New Era for decades. Hence the millions of dollars. The naming rights quote I referenced was from the article you gave me. It was a stupid take and inherently incorrect. We agree here. Haha! The article doesn’t say they couldn’t afford it. It actually says they came together to figure out how to get out of the deal, not to try and make it work, but couldn’t. That’s important. “The two organizations issued a joint statement Wednesday confirming that New Era had sought to get out of the naming rights and sponsorship deals with the Bills: "The Bills and New Era are currently negotiating the details of this separation and the Bills are beginning the process of pursuing a new naming rights partner for the stadium."” The article is trying to use the laying off people and closed a plant two years ago as financial issues. I’m positing these moves were always part of the plan and that they haven’t been hurting since 2018. They’ve actually been profiting more due to slashing overhead and moving the supply chain to China. They didn’t do that because it was noble and more expensive. They did it to increase GP. Lots of large companies are trimming huge amounts of fat 20-30% at the moment and blaming the pandemic, but a lot of them are just using it as an excuse to do it all at once, rather than have to tell the state first and do it gradually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BananaSquad Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 I’m shocked how many people here are against it. Bills mafia and barstool together would be ridiculous and amazing to be a part of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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