Kirby Jackson Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Generally I agree with you, but depending on when TT is lost a backup could take over and perform well-enough. Loosing Shady makes the offense rely on the pass. None of our QB's can gun-sling their way to a win. Shady must stay healthy. Yeah, I have him right after TT on my list. Shady is their best player and I'm not a JW fan. With that being said they've been able to withstand the loss of McCoy to a certain extent. Tyrod missed 3 games, 2 of which were played against 5 win teams and they lost them all. EJ was a big reason but still it's hard to play without your QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickrage Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 #25 Lesean McCoy. The entire offense runs thru him until proven otherwise....#5 & 14 im looking at you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Tyrod is 15-14 as the Bills starter, EJ 6-11, Thad 2-3, Fitz 20-33, Trent 14-18 and JP 10-23. We all know you aren't a Tyrod fan but I don't know how you could say those are the same? If anything this strongly illustrates that point. There isn't a close 2nd to TT and there isn't a close 3rd to Shady. Your record isn't going to be drastically different if you have to plug Groy into LG for a game or 2. That's kind of the point. Maybe it would be different if they drafted a guy early this year. From what I've heard though there is a giant gap from TT to the field (and it widened during OTAs). Obviously it's early but they aren't interchangeable. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/ In the last 11 years, we have won 4 games once, 9 games once, 7 games 4 times, 6 games 4 times, & 8 once. No matter the qb or players around them. The overwhelming odds are we will win between 6-9 games this year, which is a complete waste of a season and keeps us going nowhere. I know Taylor is better than the backup qbs. But we run a simple offense that is not based on the qb carrying us. If Taylor missed the entire season, I would bet would win 4 or 5 games. But if Taylor is as valuable as you think, I would rather win 2 games than 7. Constant spinning your wheels. I picked Sammy and Dareus because besides McCoy (RB is the position most easily replaceable), they are the only Bills who have top 5 ability at their position. If Sammy can say healthy (his new nickname), he is an animal. If Dareus can stay motivated, he can carry this defense. Yeah, I have him right after TT on my list. Shady is their best player and I'm not a JW fan. With that being said they've been able to withstand the loss of McCoy to a certain extent. Tyrod missed 3 games, 2 of which were played against 5 win teams and they lost them all. EJ was a big reason but still it's hard to play without your QB. They weren't beating the Bengals, no matter who the qb was. And there is no doubt, they win against the Jags with Taylor. EJ did help them take the lead and defense let Blake Birtles go 80 yards for a game winning td. And McCoy fumbled inside the 5. But that gets forgotten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Agree about the Bengals game. Defense was an utter disaster in that game. Too many 3 and outs on offense made our defense suck.😂 Haha. The Bengals before Dalton got hurt that year might have been the best team in the NFL. That was a a really good team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 EJ did help them take the lead and defense let Blake Birtles go 80 yards for a game winning td. And McCoy fumbled inside the 5. But that gets forgotten. It makes me so happy when someone besides me brings this up. Thanks, CB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 EJ has 3 starts with the same roster as TT and is 0-3. That's the only other comp. TT is a big step up from the bums that we've had at QB. Orton was probably next (at least since Bledsoe)!! Yep. TT, Orton and Bledsoe are the only QBs worth talking about since 2001. To put TT in with the others is not being factual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Yep. TT, Orton and Bledsoe are the only QBs worth talking about since 2001. To put TT in with the others is not being factual. So Taylor didn't win as many games as Losman and Trent have in a season? I believe Taylor is a better qb than those 2 but he is closer to that level than Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 It makes me so happy when someone besides me brings this up. Thanks, CB. EJ's horrible miscues ended up 20 points for Jacksonville. And the defense had an int returned for a TD. This game should never have been what it was. That falls on the QB. He also had two minutes at midfield to tie or win the game and he failed at the end. So Taylor didn't win as many games as Losman and Trent have in a season? I believe Taylor is a better qb than those 2 but he is closer to that level than Brady. He won more. 8 And bringing up the GOAT for some kind of comparison is also not being honest. Half the QBs in the league that are starting are closer to those bad Bills QBs then to a Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Yep. TT, Orton and Bledsoe are the only QBs worth talking about since 2001. To put TT in with the others is not being factual. Orton was a kitty sliding bum and we only got about eight good games from Bledsoe. Pretty bad stretch of quarterbacking for the Bills in the period of the drought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 They weren't beating the Bengals, no matter who the qb was. And there is no doubt, they win against the Jags with Taylor. EJ did help them take the lead and defense let Blake Birtles go 80 yards for a game winning td. And McCoy fumbled inside the 5. But that gets forgotten. EJ helped in that he contributed to previous scores, but he wasn't on the field when we took the lead. It was a pick-6 by Graham. Also, we got the ball back with over 2 mins left to answer back with a TD and couldn't convert a 2nd and 1 into a 1st down. Why is this even being brought up anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Orton was a kitty sliding bum and we only got about eight good games from Bledsoe. Pretty bad stretch of quarterbacking for the Bills in the period of the drought. Not having a top ten QB, and NE, are the main reason this drought has gone on. NE more so. That 2015 Bills team would have won the AFC South. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 EJ's horrible miscues ended up 20 points for Jacksonville. And the defense had an int returned for a TD. This game should never have been what it was. That falls on the QB. He also had two minutes at midfield to tie or win the game and he failed at the end. I've always said Taylor wins that game because he doesn't make the mistakes. That said, it's so funny how narratives can get changed by the end result. That five minute stretch was one of the worst stretches in NFL history. His career was over. But what you will never give him credit for is bouncing back and helping us take the lead. If the defense makes a stop, the team makes jokes and it becomes like Romo's 5 int game against the Bills. For example, Taylor led a high school passing attack against the Titans. Lucky for him, the defense was really good that day and he was able to lead a comeback with 100 yards passing. On the Titans last drive, Dareus forced a throw that gets intercepted. On the flip side, I might think differently about Taylor if he comebacks against Seattle. It's those little plays that separates great from good and good from bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 I've always said Taylor wins that game because he doesn't make the mistakes. That said, it's so funny how narratives can get changed by the end result. That five minute stretch was one of the worst stretches in NFL history. His career was over. But what you will never give him credit for is bouncing back and helping us take the lead. If the defense makes a stop, the team makes jokes and it becomes like Romo's 5 int game against the Bills. For example, Taylor led a high school passing attack against the Titans. Lucky for him, the defense was really good that day and he was able to lead a comeback with 100 yards passing. On the Titans last drive, Dareus forced a throw that gets intercepted. On the flip side, I might think differently about Taylor if he comebacks against Seattle. It's those little plays that separates great from good and good from bad. You'd be wrong on that game. I rooted EJ on when the Bills were getting back in the game. The midfield miscues at the end finally ended it for me with him.Morning game and it ruined the rest of the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 (edited) http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/ In the last 11 years, we have won 4 games once, 9 games once, 7 games 4 times, 6 games 4 times, & 8 once. No matter the qb or players around them. The overwhelming odds are we will win between 6-9 games this year, which is a complete waste of a season and keeps us going nowhere. I know Taylor is better than the backup qbs. But we run a simple offense that is not based on the qb carrying us. If Taylor missed the entire season, I would bet would win 4 or 5 games. But if Taylor is as valuable as you think, I would rather win 2 games than 7. Constant spinning your wheels. I picked Sammy and Dareus because besides McCoy (RB is the position most easily replaceable), they are the only Bills who have top 5 ability at their position. If Sammy can say healthy (his new nickname), he is an animal. If Dareus can stay motivated, he can carry this defense. They weren't beating the Bengals, no matter who the qb was. And there is no doubt, they win against the Jags with Taylor. EJ did help them take the lead and defense let Blake Birtles go 80 yards for a game winning td. And McCoy fumbled inside the 5. But that gets forgotten. The Bengals were the team that wasn't a 5 win team. I'm not disagreeing that winning 2 might be better than winning 7 (at all). I'm simply saying that no player can impact wins and losses more than Tyrod. I'm not even sure that an argument can be made. I know that you keep trying to lump him in with those other QBs but they aren't the same. That doesn't mean that he is perfect but he's 2 tiers above the best of those guys. The guys you lumped him in with are 52-88 while he is 15-14. That's not the same. Edited July 7, 2017 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 The Bengals were the team that wasn't a 5 win team. I'm not disagreeing that winning 2 might be better than winning 7 (at all). I'm simply saying that no player can impact wins and losses more than Tyrod. I'm not even sure that an argument can be made. I know that you keep trying to lump him in with those other QBs but they aren't the same. That doesn't mean that he is perfect but he's 2 tiers above the best of those guys. The guys you lumped him in with are 52-88 while he is 15-14. That's not the same. Agree to disagree, respectfully. Another counter is that Tyrod played on much more talented teams than those other qbs, minus 2014. And no matter what, we finish with 6-8 wins every year. The most consistent bet in all of sports is the over/under for Bills wins is 6.5. Obviously, I'll never root for us to lose and I will be the first one to praise Tyrod if he helps us get to the playoffs. But if you gave me the choice of 4-12 with the other qbs and 8-8 with TT, I'm taking 4-12. I hate saying that but I also hate 7-9 & 8-8 every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 (edited) Agree to disagree, respectfully. Another counter is that Tyrod played on much more talented teams than those other qbs, minus 2014. And no matter what, we finish with 6-8 wins every year. The most consistent bet in all of sports is the over/under for Bills wins is 6.5. Obviously, I'll never root for us to lose and I will be the first one to praise Tyrod if he helps us get to the playoffs. But if you gave me the choice of 4-12 with the other qbs and 8-8 with TT, I'm taking 4-12. I hate saying that but I also hate 7-9 & 8-8 every year. Why? It looks like we finally have some better drafters at OBD, but we don't know that yet for certain.And if you can go 8-8, there is a chance, with a good break that that extra win or two comes along for a WC. Edited July 7, 2017 by JM2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Why? It looks like we finally have some better drafters at OBD, but we don't know that yet for certain.And if you can go 8-8, there is a chance, with a good break that that extra win or two comes along for a WC. I think Whaley is a lot better than you will ever credit. But even though I hate that our coach hired our GM, I'll give them time to prove themselves. And if Tyrod ends the playoff drought, I will name my first born Tyrod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 I think Whaley is a lot better than you will ever credit. But even though I hate that our coach hired our GM, I'll give them time to prove themselves. And if Tyrod ends the playoff drought, I will name my first born Tyrod. I can never consider a GM good when he claims a QB of EJ's talent has the "it" factor and pushes him on different coaching staffs. Jones may not make the roster this year. He was a bad evaluator of QB talent in the draft. That's a big problem. Now if Whaley were here, we may have had Maclin,who knows. I think it's refreshing though, to have a HC/GM combo that actually have the same goals and ideas. Whaley couldn't get along with his HC, which also is another big problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Agree to disagree, respectfully. Another counter is that Tyrod played on much more talented teams than those other qbs, minus 2014. And no matter what, we finish with 6-8 wins every year. The most consistent bet in all of sports is the over/under for Bills wins is 6.5. Obviously, I'll never root for us to lose and I will be the first one to praise Tyrod if he helps us get to the playoffs. But if you gave me the choice of 4-12 with the other qbs and 8-8 with TT, I'm taking 4-12. I hate saying that but I also hate 7-9 & 8-8 every year. EJ is 6-8 with other rosters and 0-3 with the same roster. I don't disagree at all on the 4-12 vs. 8-8 (especially this year). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Allan in MD Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 That's easy, McCoy. That's why giving Gilleslee to our parent team may haunt the Bills no end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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