Don Esmonde article about new ownership

[Kirby Jackson]

if Ralph said the bills had to stay as a condition of ownership, his estate/heirs would be lucky to get $700M. In an open market they will get a $1B+. He would have been stupid to do otherwise.

 

Its up to Buffalo to find someone with that much wherewithal to keep them here. Sure everyone including Ralph hopes they stay but it will be what it will be.

 

If they stay get ready as Buffalo fans will have to pay market rates for tickets once this happens.

 

BTW, Jerry J and Bon J can kiss my royal arse.

They will get $1B+ in WNY. Book it

[Hplarrm]

vegas- You (and Esmonde and others seem to make a major economic misinterpretation about owning a team as well.

 

Yes, it is about the money, but a key is to realize that by far the big bucks made by a team owner comes from the money provided by the TV networks and the big $ do not come primarily from the local team market.

 

Follow the money and the money says that the networks are paying for the epic almost mythic story that the NFL is selling to the networks so that TV can attract eyeballs to sell commercials to.

 

The Bills will almost certainly remain in Buffalo as they have a higher value to the NFL and individual team owners than this owner's 1/31st of a relocation fee.

 

Add into this the negative 7-10 years of story telling while the WNY region laments and whines about losing the Bills and the NFL goes to war against Cuomo and a NYS Congressional delegation threatening the NFL's limited protection against anti-trust (the lever which allowed municipal leaders in Cleveland to beat a franchise out of the NFL when their political leaders are just as stupid as WNY leaders.

 

You and many others really misread the economics of the NFL.

 

Don Esmonde column in Buffalo News illustrates just how clueless folks can be about the economics of the NFL as it pertains to keeping the Bills in Buffalo. There's no excuse though, for a columnist who has the time and has the obligation to at least research the subject matter he writes about to be so off base. He writes that we need an owner who won't chase the dollar, who will be happy with the 35 million dollar profit the team produces. Well Don, you are right about Buffalo needing an owner who won't be obsessed with maximizing profit. But the "35 million" profit? Well Mr Osmonde, because this team has been thrown out there to highest bidder, a new owner will pay close to one billion dollars for the Bills. And even if he puts up half of that amount in cash, the financing cost will reach at least 40 million annually, a cost that the Bills don't currently have, but a cost that will demolish the 35 million dollar "profit". And that's all thanks to good old Ralph Wilson, who despite the ridiculous hero worship he has received by many on this board (and elsewhere) made no provisions at all in his will, or even expressed a preference in his will, that the team be kept in Buffalo. But why should he have? . The fans/taxpayers of WNY only built and paid for the stadium that bears his name, and the franchise that he so "generously" kept in WNY only produced a billion dollar windfall for him and his heirs. So why should Ralph have even lifted a finger, or expressed even a simple non binding wish, that Bills be sold to an owner committed to keeping the team in WNY.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

It almost seems like there is too much support for this team from potential owners, NFL owners and politicians that they are lulling us to sleep before they pull the rug out from us. Not trying to be negative but so many things go wrong with this state and region it seems almost to good to be true that they stay.

[jahbonas]

vegas- You (and Esmonde and others seem to make a major economic misinterpretation about owning a team as well.

 

Yes, it is about the money, but a key is to realize that by far the big bucks made by a team owner comes from the money provided by the TV networks and the big $ do not come primarily from the local team market.

 

Follow the money and the money says that the networks are paying for the epic almost mythic story that the NFL is selling to the networks so that TV can attract eyeballs to sell commercials to.

 

The Bills will almost certainly remain in Buffalo as they have a higher value to the NFL and individual team owners than this owner's 1/31st of a relocation fee.

 

Add into this the negative 7-10 years of story telling while the WNY region laments and whines about losing the Bills and the NFL goes to war against Cuomo and a NYS Congressional delegation threatening the NFL's limited protection against anti-trust (the lever which allowed municipal leaders in Cleveland to beat a franchise out of the NFL when their political leaders are just as stupid as WNY leaders.

 

You and many others really misread the economics of the NFL.

 

Did you even read Vegas post? where does he/she even indicate tv money not key etcccc???

[YoloinOhio]

Tim Graham ‏@ByTimGraham 54m

Nugget that didn't make this morning's story: NFL expects Bills sale to take a little longer because of Haslam fiasco. Intensified vetting.

[Fingon]

The votes aren't even there for the team to move. This team will remain the Buffalo Bills.

 

http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/bills-nfl/nfl-owners-say-votes-arent-there-for-moving-the-bills-20140520?two-bills-drive

[K-9]

 

Tim Graham ‏@ByTimGraham 54m

Nugget that didn't make this morning's story: NFL expects Bills sale to take a little longer because of Haslam fiasco. Intensified vetting.

 

I'd stake my shady reputation that some level of vetting was done even before Mr. Wilson passed away.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

I'd stake my shady reputation that some level of vetting was done even before Mr. Wilson passed away.

 

GO BILLS!!!

I'd bet K-9's shady reputation on that as well. RW was in his 90's we would be very naive (wink, wink) to think that these conversations and potential buyers first surfaced after his death.

[Campy]

Nope - - in 1997 the Bills negotiated for and received the right to name the stadium whatever they wanted in 1998 - - Ralph chose to name the stadium after himself:

 

http://www.sportsbus...spx?hl=SFX&sc=0

 

Interesting. This is the first time I heard (read) that. Thanks for the info.

 

But I'm still going to blame it on the county when those two yahoo Jets fans make their annual visit to our Backer bar and mock RWS.

[Hplarrm]

 

take it from this line posted directly from vegas post (which I seem to have read) > Well Mr Osmonde, because this team has been thrown out there to highest bidder, < he buys into the false statement that the team UST be sold to the highest bidder.

 

 

WRONG WRNG WRONG

 

It will be sold only to a bidder who has the approval of 75% of the current owners. Thus, folks who misinterpret the actual history of NFL team ownership make the demonstrably false assumption that individual team owners make their biggest profit from operating in a traditional capitalist system.

 

The actual fiscal history of the NFL is filled with examples of the league running kicking and screaming from traditional capitalist model and instead embracing operations based on using a social compact as their basis for operation rather than a trqaditional free market approach.

 

For example,

 

1. In the late 80s, after the NFL simply beat the crap out of the NFLPA which under the leadership of AFL-CIO type Ed Garvey, the NFLPA now under the leadership of the talented tenth of actual players like Gene Upshaw merely threatened to decertify itself.

 

This would have forced the individual team owners to operate in a traditional more pure capitalist system where each owner would simply sign personal services contracts with individual players. If the highest bidder simply choose to pay more and succeeded in buying Tom Brady, AND, Troy Polamalu, AND Ray Lewis, AND Adrian Peterson, AND whomever else because in traditional freemarket restraint of trade like the NFL draft or barring adults from signing with teams until they are over 21 would not be allowed under a pure free market.

 

Instead, individual team owners have long realized that they make more money and produce a better product by instead pursuing an economic model based on the social compact called the CBA.

 

2. The NFL in fact has a clear history under very smart men like Pete Rozelle of convincing individual team owners that they make a higher profit by rewarding bad play than they would using the traditional free market incentive of letting the highest bidder do what they can or doing something like giving giving higher draft choices to better teams. Rozelle demonstrated to individual owners that they made bigger profits by adopting policies such as equal sharing of TV money or reaching agreement with the NFLPA to reward poorly performing teams with higher draft picks.

 

3. When the mid 80s CBA with its designated gross salary cap being the basis for the CBA, NFLPA head Gene Upshaw (with the support of talented tenth former Bills like Troy Vincent and Takeo Spikes who spent their off-seasons taking Harvard MBA courses)publicly announced prior to negotiations between team owners and the NFLPA that the new salary cap MUST be based on total gross receipts (rather than designated profit streams) and the players share MUST be higher than 60%. The final agreement btw the NFL and NFLPA met this standard with Paul Tagliabue and the NFL staff arguing down Ralph Wilson and others who argued against the social compact.

 

4. Rush Limbaugh became part of a proposed leadership team but was rejected by the NFL despite his deep pockets due to the objections of NOT a fellow owner, but due to the public objections of players (who under the social compact of the CBA are actually partners (and arguably the majority partners since under the CBA since they get a majority of the gross receipts.

 

The mistake which Esmonde and others seem to make is that they seem to believe that the key determining factor here is who makes the highest bid. Actually the determining factor is which owner/partner lets the NFL best tap its largest financial source the TV nets and not whether the new owner can exploit a larger market.

 

A Buffalo team allows the NFL to sell a much more profitable story than many a larger market.

 

Etc

 

 

 

 

 

Did you even read Vegas post? where does he/she even indicate tv money not key etcccc???

[K-9]

Nope - - in 1997 the Bills negotiated for and received the right to name the stadium whatever they wanted in 1998 - - Ralph chose to name the stadium after himself:

 

http://www.sportsbus...spx?hl=SFX&sc=0

 

The idea that Ralph Wilson simply chose to name the stadium after himself is entirely out of context. George Pataki, who is the one who came up with the idea in the first place, strongly urged him to accept the honor and there was also considerable pressure from family and even Littman, to allow the stadium to be named after him. Mr. Wilson hemmed and hawed at the suggestion, but finally relented.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Mr. WEO]

The idea that Ralph Wilson simply chose to name the stadium after himself is entirely out of context. George Pataki, who is the one who came up with the idea in the first place, strongly urged him to accept the honor and there was also considerable pressure from family and even Littman, to allow the stadium to be named after him. Mr. Wilson hemmed and hawed at the suggestion, but finally relented.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

Well, in the ensuing 16 years after he relented, he more than once proclaimed how hard it was for a "small market team" to make a buck in the NFL, yet he never suggested that the team raise money in a standard way most other teams do--by selling the naming rights to the stadium.

[K-9]

Well, in the ensuing 16 years after he relented, he more than once proclaimed how hard it was for a "small market team" to make a buck in the NFL, yet he never suggested that the team raise money in a standard way most other teams do--by selling the naming rights to the stadium.

 

No doubt he could have raised some revenue by selling the naming rights. But selling naming rights to advertisers was anathema to him. He was simply old fashioned in that regard. Selling the naming rights was suggested to him on more than one occasion by several in the office. He simply wouldn't hear of it. He was never on board with the county selling the rights to Rich Products and that's the only reason he wanted the team to have naming rights after the initial lease expired.

 

And his position was that small market teams find it harder to raise a buck RELATIVE to large market teams. That's just a fact. And even though he was stubborn on the issue of selling naming rights to raise revenue, part of me respects the man for sticking to his principle, regardless.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[thebandit27]

I'd stake my shady reputation that some level of vetting was done even before Mr. Wilson passed away.

 

GO BILLS!!!

I'd bet K-9's shady reputation on that as well. RW was in his 90's we would be very naive (wink, wink) to think that these conversations and potential buyers first surfaced after his death.

 

I bet both K-9's shady reputation and Kirby's squeaky-clean stature that these conversations took place (wink/nod/involuntary spasm).

[vegas55]

 

 

No doubt he could have raised some revenue by selling the naming rights. But selling naming rights to advertisers was anathema to him. He was simply old fashioned in that regard. Selling the naming rights was suggested to him on more than one occasion by several in the office. He simply wouldn't hear of it. He was never on board with the county selling the rights to Rich Products and that's the only reason he wanted the team to have naming rights after the initial lease expired.

 

And his position was that small market teams find it harder to raise a buck RELATIVE to large market teams. That's just a fact. And even though he was stubborn on the issue of selling naming rights to raise revenue, part of me respects the man for sticking to his principle, regardless.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

 

 

No doubt he could have raised some revenue by selling the naming rights. But selling naming rights to advertisers was anathema to him. He was simply old fashioned in that regard. Selling the naming rights was suggested to him on more than one occasion by several in the office. He simply wouldn't hear of it. He was never on board with the county selling the rights to Rich Products and that's the only reason he wanted the team to have naming rights after the initial lease expired.

 

And his position was that small market teams find it harder to raise a buck RELATIVE to large market teams. That's just a fact. And even though he was stubborn on the issue of selling naming rights to raise revenue, part of me respects the man for sticking to his principle, regardless.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

So Ralph demonstrated that he was a man of principle by naming the stadium after - HIMSELF? You are kidding right - because a man who felt strongly that selling the naming rights for money was wrong could have had the stadium named after a war hero, one of the Bills who died in Vietnam etc etc. Naming a stadium that the taxpayers/fans, not Ralph, paid for in full was not a principled act; it was an ego trip.

[K-9]

So Ralph demonstrated that he was a man of principle by naming the stadium after - HIMSELF? You are kidding right - because a man who felt strongly that selling the naming rights for money was wrong could have had the stadium named after a war hero, one of the Bills who died in Vietnam etc etc. Naming a stadium that the taxpayers/fans, not Ralph, paid for in full was not a principled act; it was an ego trip.

 

As I stated in my previous post, the idea that Mr. Wilson simply decided to name the stadium after himself is entirely out of context. It wasn't even his idea.

 

This meme goes back several years and is tired. If you need to think that he was nothing more than an egotist seeking to satisfy a selfish urge, then so be it.

 

And his reluctance to sell the naming rights, against the advice of even his closest advisers, was indeed standing on his principle about that matter. This should be plainly obvious to anyone when he stood to generate revenues by going against those exact principles.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Mr. WEO]

No doubt he could have raised some revenue by selling the naming rights. But selling naming rights to advertisers was anathema to him. He was simply old fashioned in that regard. Selling the naming rights was suggested to him on more than one occasion by several in the office. He simply wouldn't hear of it. He was never on board with the county selling the rights to Rich Products and that's the only reason he wanted the team to have naming rights after the initial lease expired.

 

And his position was that small market teams find it harder to raise a buck RELATIVE to large market teams. That's just a fact. And even though he was stubborn on the issue of selling naming rights to raise revenue, part of me respects the man for sticking to his principle, regardless.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

I'm not sure what principle RW was standing on when he refused the very basic and widely accepted (in every major sports venue) of selling naming rights--especially when the stadium wasn't even his property---while at the same time he was aggressively seeking corporate purchasers of luxury boxes and sponsors in general. He was happy for corporations to contribute to the Bills bottom line, but not at the cost of changing the name on the front door. Had a nice ring to it, I'm sure he thought...Also, his refusal to seek for the stadium to be named other than eponymously was looked upon poorly by other owners who cited it in response to his public complaints of how hard it was to make money in the NFL (when, buy the way, they all could see he was doing just fine).

[vegas55]

 

 

As I stated in my previous post, the idea that Mr. Wilson simply decided to name the stadium after himself is entirely out of context. It wasn't even his idea.

 

This meme goes back several years and is tired. If you need to think that he was nothing more than an egotist seeking to satisfy a selfish urge, then so be it.

 

And his reluctance to sell the naming rights, against the advice of even his closest advisers, was indeed standing on his principle about that matter. This should be plainly obvious to anyone when he stood to generate revenues by going against those exact principles.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

What you seem to be implying is that naming the stadium after Ralph Wilson was an idea that never occurred to Ralph, that it was kinda forced unto him. Forgive me if I am completely skeptical about that scenario. And nothing you have stated prevented Ralph from naming the stadium after someone else, perhaps the Buffalo Bill player who died in Vietnam. Again this was a stadium that he did not pay for, and I don't believe he was forced to name the stadium after himself. He had lots of choices, but shockingly, he chose himself.

[K-9]

What you seem to be implying is that naming the stadium after Ralph Wilson was an idea that never occurred to Ralph, that it was kinda forced unto him. Forgive me if I am completely skeptical about that scenario. And nothing you have stated prevented Ralph from naming the stadium after someone else, perhaps the Buffalo Bill player who died in Vietnam. Again this was a stadium that he did not pay for, and I don't believe he was forced to name the stadium after himself. He had lots of choices, but shockingly, he chose himself.

 

As has been documented numerous times here, first by Lori our ex-resident scribe, the idea for the name was ENTIRELY George Pataki's idea and he urged both the county and RW's family to talk him into accepting it as a way of honoring his contribution to football in general and to WNY in particular. He was very resistent and it took a certain amount of cajoling by family to get him to agree.

 

As I've said, this is a tired argument. And if you need to believe that Mr. Wilson was just on a power trip due to his out of control ego, have at it all you want. You know what you know, and I know what I know. I'm content with leaving it at that.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[gobillsinytown]

I am a bit confused by the "hero" status RW has achieved as owner of the Bills in death. His contributions in WWII, something I did not know, are certainly worthy of the term hero, but his ownership of this team does not make him a hero. It is pure speculation that an NFL franchise in Buffalo would not have existed without RW. In reality, a number of folks could have started a franchise here. Why do we think small. Buffalo is a great city, with unbelievable fans that support their team. RW did not create and keep the team in Buffalo due to his generosity. He made a number of business decisions that resulted in the astronomical growth in his investment. The fan base should not sell themselves short, we helped create this team as well (ticket sales, broad based community support, and tax dollars).

 

With that being said, RW could have made many more decisions if his primary goal was to keep the team in Buffalo. By all accounts it seems as if he encouraged that they remain here, but he was not willing to have his estate devalued by insuring that they remain here. RW, in death, did as he did in life, and that is make business decisions. It's his investment, his money, his asset and he could do with it what he wishes, but please rethink the party line that he was a generous person that we should call a hero.

 

OK, now everyone can attack me.

 

I don't think the term "hero" applies here. I think that this term is used far too often. I had a lot of respect for Ralph, because in my opinion, he could have moved the team from the city quite some time ago for greener economic pastures but chose not to do so.

 

Looking at the history of the team, the two years of 1984-85 would have been an ideal opportunity. I think he chose to keep the team in Buffalo because of the league concept that he helped create. The concept is that, if there is a true league with true revenue sharing, then a pro football team can play almost anywhere. If Green Bay has a football team, then so can Buffalo.

 

In my opinion, it's going to come down to how badly the community wants to keep the team. If Western New York as a whole, from the business community, the politicians and the residents feel that the team is worth keeping, then I believe it will happen