Whose the better OT

[Astrobot]

Agree that neither is a reach in sharp contrast to the DEs and OLBs available. That's why we better trade down if we don't go OT (speaking of which, like a lot of you, I watch a bunch of NFL Network this time of year and I could have sworn that Mayock's OT ticker has had Reiff ahed of Kalil a couple of times--think it's back to Kalil again--anyone else catch this???).

Nope, you are right. I might add that Reiff was a great wrestler in the NCAA tournament and everything. most drafts have Kalil ahead of Reiff, but I respect Mayock...and wrestling...

[BillsCelticsAngelsBama]

The player you are describing is neither Kalil nor Martin - nor a left tackle...it is Stanford right guard David DeCastro (think Joe DeLamielleure)...

 

Stanford runs behind a pulling DeCastro on three out of four run plays because his prowess as a blocker on the move is impressive. Although he is not an elite athlete, the Washington native simply does get not beaten in pass protection, either. Sound technique, excellent toughness, and intelligence are all traits scouts look for in a first-round interior offensive line prospect--and DeCastro has them all in spades...

 

Pass blocking: Doesn't get beat. Has enough of an anchor and resets hands to get leverage if beaten initially. Keeps feet churning and his head up. Capable of blocking down with one hand and sliding to help tackle. Very aware of late blitzers, can stonewall them or ride them out of the pocket. Usually keeps arms extended in pass pro to maintain distance with his man. Loses the hand-to-hand battle occasionally but works to quickly counter.

 

Run blocking: Excels as a run blocker in power, zone and on the move. Plays with his eyes up. Takes defenders to the ground and doesn't let up. Rarely allows defenders to sidestep. Not dominant as a drive blocker but grinds to the whistle. Defensive tackles with elite power can anchor or move him off the snap.

 

Pulling/trapping: Dominant leading on pulls outside and traps inside. Reaches second level instantly, has natural bend and flexibility to get correct angle. Does not always dominate smaller defenders after initial contact, falling off instead of latching on, but can take out multiple targets when he squares. Will miss inside target on occasion, giving max effort to cut or reach the linebacker.

 

Initial Quickness: Very good off the snap. Gets hands up immediately, rarely beaten with an initial pass-rush move. Swims to reach second-level defenders. Generates push in goal-line situations, firing off hard and low.

 

Downfield: Has enough -- but not great -- speed. Very effective negating targets seven or eight yards downfield. Inconsistent sustaining blocks against powerful linebackers and defensive backs, lowering his head to easily be disengaged.

 

Intangibles: Solid work ethic and character. Known for his work on the practice field and weight room. Durable; could play every snap in any scheme. Chose Stanford for its academic standards.

 

 

Link - NFL DraftScout/CBS Sports

 

 

I know we have glaring needs at DE and LB, but we also saw our offensive line start to crumble under the weight of last season's injuries, mainly due to lack of depth. DeCastro's the real deal, probably will start as a rookie, and could well develop into the NFL's best guard. Some mocks have him going as high as #13 - and that could change after the combine, which starts on Wednesday.

 

Right now, I still think 'bama OLB Courtney Upshaw's our guy - but if he's gone or has a bad combine and we're sticking to the philosophy of best-available player, DeCastro might be the pick. Personally, I'd have no problem with that. JMO.

That is really not a bad call. I could see him opening up some big holes for Spiller and Jackson next year. There really is no weakness to him other than position.

I really like the idea of drafting the best "Football player" out there. Not sure he will be the top guy @ #10 but I think Martin,Reiff and DeCastro are more of a sure thing than some of these defensive guys. The difference between drafting a Courtney Upshaw/Nick Perry/Quinton Coples vs. picking a Vinny Curry in round 2 may not be as great as picking Martin,Reiff,DeCastro vs. the linemen available in round 2.

Edited February 21, 2012 by MOVALLEYRANDY

[artmalibu]

If they can sign D bell on the cheep that would be best. Use the first 2 picks on a pass rusher and a wr who start week 1! Hairston was a good pick a little later and looked ok for a rookie, he should be better this year with the experience and a real off-season this year.

 

Glaring needs over small ones.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

The player you are describing is neither Kalil nor Martin - nor a left tackle...it is Stanford right guard David DeCastro (think Joe DeLamielleure)...

 

Stanford runs behind a pulling DeCastro on three out of four run plays because his prowess as a blocker on the move is impressive. Although he is not an elite athlete, the Washington native simply does get not beaten in pass protection, either. Sound technique, excellent toughness, and intelligence are all traits scouts look for in a first-round interior offensive line prospect--and DeCastro has them all in spades...

 

Pass blocking: Doesn't get beat. Has enough of an anchor and resets hands to get leverage if beaten initially. Keeps feet churning and his head up. Capable of blocking down with one hand and sliding to help tackle. Very aware of late blitzers, can stonewall them or ride them out of the pocket. Usually keeps arms extended in pass pro to maintain distance with his man. Loses the hand-to-hand battle occasionally but works to quickly counter.

 

Run blocking: Excels as a run blocker in power, zone and on the move. Plays with his eyes up. Takes defenders to the ground and doesn't let up. Rarely allows defenders to sidestep. Not dominant as a drive blocker but grinds to the whistle. Defensive tackles with elite power can anchor or move him off the snap.

 

Pulling/trapping: Dominant leading on pulls outside and traps inside. Reaches second level instantly, has natural bend and flexibility to get correct angle. Does not always dominate smaller defenders after initial contact, falling off instead of latching on, but can take out multiple targets when he squares. Will miss inside target on occasion, giving max effort to cut or reach the linebacker.

 

Initial Quickness: Very good off the snap. Gets hands up immediately, rarely beaten with an initial pass-rush move. Swims to reach second-level defenders. Generates push in goal-line situations, firing off hard and low.

 

Downfield: Has enough -- but not great -- speed. Very effective negating targets seven or eight yards downfield. Inconsistent sustaining blocks against powerful linebackers and defensive backs, lowering his head to easily be disengaged.

 

Intangibles: Solid work ethic and character. Known for his work on the practice field and weight room. Durable; could play every snap in any scheme. Chose Stanford for its academic standards.

 

 

Link - NFL DraftScout/CBS Sports

 

 

I know we have glaring needs at DE and LB, but we also saw our offensive line start to crumble under the weight of last season's injuries, mainly due to lack of depth. DeCastro's the real deal, probably will start as a rookie, and could well develop into the NFL's best guard. Some mocks have him going as high as #13 - and that could change after the combine, which starts on Wednesday.

 

Right now, I still think 'bama OLB Courtney Upshaw's our guy - but if he's gone or has a bad combine and we're sticking to the philosophy of best-available player, DeCastro might be the pick. Personally, I'd have no problem with that. JMO.

Senator, yea know I love you and all but I really disagree on the DeCastro idea. Below is my reply to #34fan who has brought up drafting DeCastro a couple of times now.

 

Logan Mankins, considered by many to be the best guard in the NFL was beaten cleanly in pass protection several times in the Super Bowl.

 

Guards play guard for a reason and it's not because of they're good in pass protection.

 

Andy Levitre is a great guard partly because he played offensive tackle in college and is a superior pass blocker as well as being extremely strong and a guy who plays with great leverage in the run game. He will make the Pro Bowl this season.

 

As No Saint has pointed out numerous times, the New Orleans Saints have two of the best guards in the NFL in Carl Nicks and Jahri Evans.

 

Both of those players are converted TACKLES.

 

Last year's top guard, Danny Watkins was a disappointment for the Eagles.

 

Bottom line, you never draft a guard in the top ten… unless you project him as a center. The only interior linemen who get drafted in the first round typically are your Pounceys, Woods, and Mangolds.

 

You draft tackles and if they can't cut it at tackle, they are moved to guard.

 

Wood, Levitre, Urbik, and Rhinehart all played very well this season and OT Colin Brown was pressed into service as a center in the last weeks and looked quite good. Interior offensive line is one of this team's real strengths.

Unless this guy is guaranteed to be the next coming of Alan Faneca or Steve Hutchinson of someone of that caliber, you can't take him at #10.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Nope, you are right. I might add that Reiff was a great wrestler in the NCAA tournament and everything. most drafts have Kalil ahead of Reiff, but I respect Mayock...and wrestling...

[aussiebills]

i think Coples, Upshaw, Mercilus and Ingram - only one of them will be great the others will be average too much questions bout all of them

But MArtin. Decastro and Reiff will be solid starters from the start

[Dragonborn10]

I would worry about Martin and the level of competition he has faced. The Pac 12 measures success on defense on how long it takes the other team to score not if they actually stop someone. Reiff may be there(Kalil will be gone in the top 5) but I don't think Adams or Martin are that far behind him in talent. Again this draft screams trade down and take BPA - WR(Floyd), DE(Mercilus), or OT.

[papazoid]

both are going Top 10......Reiff first (7th or 8th overall) and then Martin (10th to Bills).

[Best Player Available]

both are going Top 10......Reiff first (7th or 8th overall) and then Martin (10th to Bills).

Either will be fine. There will be no stud DE at 10. Why not shore up an area of need?

Bell is no long term solution. Although if they resign him before the draft we will most

likely not draft a LT.

 

We need a dominating unit somewhere on this team. A stud rook LT and Hairston on the right

would possibly be dominant assuming Wood comes back 100%, and Levitre/Urbik continues too develop.

[KOKBILLS]

The player you are describing is neither Kalil nor Martin - nor a left tackle...it is Stanford right guard David DeCastro (think Joe DeLamielleure)...

 

Stanford runs behind a pulling DeCastro on three out of four run plays because his prowess as a blocker on the move is impressive. Although he is not an elite athlete, the Washington native simply does get not beaten in pass protection, either. Sound technique, excellent toughness, and intelligence are all traits scouts look for in a first-round interior offensive line prospect--and DeCastro has them all in spades...

 

Pass blocking: Doesn't get beat. Has enough of an anchor and resets hands to get leverage if beaten initially. Keeps feet churning and his head up. Capable of blocking down with one hand and sliding to help tackle. Very aware of late blitzers, can stonewall them or ride them out of the pocket. Usually keeps arms extended in pass pro to maintain distance with his man. Loses the hand-to-hand battle occasionally but works to quickly counter.

 

Run blocking: Excels as a run blocker in power, zone and on the move. Plays with his eyes up. Takes defenders to the ground and doesn't let up. Rarely allows defenders to sidestep. Not dominant as a drive blocker but grinds to the whistle. Defensive tackles with elite power can anchor or move him off the snap.

 

Pulling/trapping: Dominant leading on pulls outside and traps inside. Reaches second level instantly, has natural bend and flexibility to get correct angle. Does not always dominate smaller defenders after initial contact, falling off instead of latching on, but can take out multiple targets when he squares. Will miss inside target on occasion, giving max effort to cut or reach the linebacker.

 

Initial Quickness: Very good off the snap. Gets hands up immediately, rarely beaten with an initial pass-rush move. Swims to reach second-level defenders. Generates push in goal-line situations, firing off hard and low.

 

Downfield: Has enough -- but not great -- speed. Very effective negating targets seven or eight yards downfield. Inconsistent sustaining blocks against powerful linebackers and defensive backs, lowering his head to easily be disengaged.

 

Intangibles: Solid work ethic and character. Known for his work on the practice field and weight room. Durable; could play every snap in any scheme. Chose Stanford for its academic standards.

 

 

Link - NFL DraftScout/CBS Sports

 

 

I know we have glaring needs at DE and LB, but we also saw our offensive line start to crumble under the weight of last season's injuries, mainly due to lack of depth. DeCastro's the real deal, probably will start as a rookie, and could well develop into the NFL's best guard. Some mocks have him going as high as #13 - and that could change after the combine, which starts on Wednesday.

 

Right now, I still think 'bama OLB Courtney Upshaw's our guy - but if he's gone or has a bad combine and we're sticking to the philosophy of best-available player, DeCastro might be the pick. Personally, I'd have no problem with that. JMO.

 

I don't disagree about the Player...DeCastro is an excellent Prospect...But the Bills are not going to take an OG at #10 Overall...Period...End of story...

[3rdand12]

I have read more than once from " the guys that know things" that you can move a tackle inside but not a guard to the outside. Although Levitre was quite a gamer there for a bit.

We resign D Bell for a proper contract considering his health and respecting his potential.

Then we draft best player available. and or best upgrade. Which might include cornerback.

if we get an Olineman it better be left tackle and Kalil would be my wish.

But Reiff or Martin look to be solid picks and i would be pleased enough.

[NewEra]

1329752034[/url]' post='2385811']

The player you are describing is neither Kalil nor Martin - nor a left tackle...it is Stanford right guard David DeCastro (think Joe DeLamielleure)...

 

Stanford runs behind a pulling DeCastro on three out of four run plays because his prowess as a blocker on the move is impressive. Although he is not an elite athlete, the Washington native simply does get not beaten in pass protection, either. Sound technique, excellent toughness, and intelligence are all traits scouts look for in a first-round interior offensive line prospect--and DeCastro has them all in spades...

 

Pass blocking: Doesn't get beat. Has enough of an anchor and resets hands to get leverage if beaten initially. Keeps feet churning and his head up. Capable of blocking down with one hand and sliding to help tackle. Very aware of late blitzers, can stonewall them or ride them out of the pocket. Usually keeps arms extended in pass pro to maintain distance with his man. Loses the hand-to-hand battle occasionally but works to quickly counter.

 

Run blocking: Excels as a run blocker in power, zone and on the move. Plays with his eyes up. Takes defenders to the ground and doesn't let up. Rarely allows defenders to sidestep. Not dominant as a drive blocker but grinds to the whistle. Defensive tackles with elite power can anchor or move him off the snap.

 

Pulling/trapping: Dominant leading on pulls outside and traps inside. Reaches second level instantly, has natural bend and flexibility to get correct angle. Does not always dominate smaller defenders after initial contact, falling off instead of latching on, but can take out multiple targets when he squares. Will miss inside target on occasion, giving max effort to cut or reach the linebacker.

 

Initial Quickness: Very good off the snap. Gets hands up immediately, rarely beaten with an initial pass-rush move. Swims to reach second-level defenders. Generates push in goal-line situations, firing off hard and low.

 

Downfield: Has enough -- but not great -- speed. Very effective negating targets seven or eight yards downfield. Inconsistent sustaining blocks against powerful linebackers and defensive backs, lowering his head to easily be disengaged.

 

Intangibles: Solid work ethic and character. Known for his work on the practice field and weight room. Durable; could play every snap in any scheme. Chose Stanford for its academic standards.

 

 

Link - NFL DraftScout/CBS Sports

 

 

I know we have glaring needs at DE and LB, but we also saw our offensive line start to crumble under the weight of last season's injuries, mainly due to lack of depth. DeCastro's the real deal, probably will start as a rookie, and could well develop into the NFL's best guard. Some mocks have him going as high as #13 - and that could change after the combine, which starts on Wednesday.

 

Right now, I still think 'bama OLB Courtney Upshaw's our guy - but if he's gone or has a bad combine and we're sticking to the philosophy of best-available player, DeCastro might be the pick. Personally, I'd have no problem with that. JMO.

 

I'm a big fan of DeCastro, but of he's our pick at 10 I'll be unbillievably pissed. If there's ever a year to trade down, this is the year. Doubtful, but we still have hope as of now.

 

 

I hope to resign Bell and go with him and Hairston at LT, Pears at RT. If we can't trade down, draft the bpa at WR or Pass rusher....although its my opinion we'll trade Reiff if available. If he's gone, Martin.