Good article

[C.Biscuit97]

And we will be playing for the #1 overall pick since we still don't have a franchise type QB

 

 

Just like the 1-15 Fins after they selected Jake Long with the #1 pick. Whoops!!!

 

And i'll for getting a franchise Qb if the right guy is there. I, personally, don't think that guy is there to be selected at #9. I'd rather Lefevour in the 2nd or 3rd or wait for one of top 2 guys next year and just build the lines. Forcing the issue because you need a QB is how you end up with Losman.

 

P.S. I believe Matthews is the same guy who wanted us to draft Matt Leinart in the draft a while back.

[Bob in STL]

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/articl...101/2030354/tbd

 

This says it all...'Everyone who knows anything about the NFL knows that teams with below-average quarterbacks don't win Super Bowls and seldom even make the playoffs.'

 

 

The article is poorly written whether you agree with him or not. He said nothing to prove Clausen to be a compelling pick. I want an impact player to be taken at 9. McClain is a possiblity. I know you think LBs are not as important.

 

I watched McClain play in the tough SEC and he was dominant. I saw Clausen play at ND. He has the physical tools but he plays like an average guy.

[PDaDdy]

If the Colts have the #1 Offensive line, why were they ranked #32 in rushing??? Oh...that's right, they put the ball in Manning's hands......

 

If the QB reads it right, quickly and executes...all of the sudden the O-line looks good. If the QB is puzzled, takes forever to read AND execute (Ron Johnson), even the best O-line will look crappy.

 

 

Perhaps for the same reason why the Bills defense was decently ranked against the pass. It's not because we were great at defending the pass. It's because we stunk defending the run. Teams didn't need to put the ball in the air much. Our defense was #13 in passing attempts per game #2 in yards per attempt. Despite those figures I don't think anyone would say they were afraid the throw against us. The numbers that really matter are 31st in attempts to game and 31st in yards/attempt. This drives home the point that teams didn't need to pass against us and could basically take the week off from game planning and just run the damn thing against us.

 

So

 

Indy is a GREAT and I mean a GREAT passing offense. They don't need to run the ball. Basically in my opinion they only ran the ball enough to occasionally be able to sell play action. This is evidenced by Indy having the second fewest rushing attempts in the NFL at 22.9/game. Who was the worst at rushing attempts? Arizona at 22.8/game. Coincidence that Arizona was also amazing at the pass? I think not. In the modern NFL game it is a pass first league. Teams with great QBs are basically embracing this trend. This doesn't mean the line can't run block. It means that the offense is better at passing and they don't need to run the ball nearly as much as some other teams.

 

See the difference?

 

Hope this helps.

[C.Biscuit97]

Perhaps for the same reason why the Bills defense was decently ranked against the pass. It's not because we were great at defending the pass. It's because we stunk defending the run. Teams didn't need to put the ball in the air much. Our defense was #13 in passing attempts per game #2 in yards per attempt. Despite those figures I don't think anyone would say they were afraid the throw against us. The numbers that really matter are 31st in attempts to game and 31st in yards/attempt. This drives home the point that teams didn't need to pass against us and could basically take the week off from game planning and just run the damn thing against us.

 

Sorry but you are flat out wrong. Our run defense blew, no arguments there. But our pass defense was borderline great. 28 INTs on 519 attempts is 1 INT every 19 passes. That's good. On stats that have zero to do with attempts, we finished 3rd in completion % (56.8) and 2nd in QB rating (61.1). That's excellent and has nothing to do with how many times a team passed. And for the record, we ranked 20th in passing attempts so it wasn't like teams didn't pass on us.

 

We have a very good secondary. I don't know why some fans can jsut give creidt where it is due and stop working so hard to put down the Bills.

[PDaDdy]

Sorry but you are flat out wrong. Our run defense blew, no arguments there. But our pass defense was borderline great. 28 INTs on 519 attempts is 1 INT every 19 passes. That's good. On stats that have zero to do with attempts, we finished 3rd in completion % (56.8) and 2nd in QB rating (61.1). That's excellent and has nothing to do with how many times a team passed. And for the record, we ranked 20th in passing attempts so it wasn't like teams didn't pass on us.

 

We have a very good secondary. I don't know why some fans can jsut give creidt where it is due and stop working so hard to put down the Bills.

 

"flat out wrong" is flat out wrong.

 

I never said we were bad against the pass. I never said we were below average against the pass. What I was asserting was that because teams could run over us like small children playing in the street, our pass defense statistically looked better than it was. Let's also be honest, Jarius Byrd was a huge HUGE part of the reason why opposing QBs got intercepted which lead to poor QB ratings. That is something our defense WAS good at. Since you have an axe to grind about lack of respect for the secondary, credit where credit is due. That being said I don't think opposing teams were shaking in their boots and ran because they were afraid to pass against us. They ran because it was an extremely easy, low risk recipe for success.

 

Again, my statement was to say that our defense looked better because teams didn't have to pass. That is a fair and accurate statement. If you disagree with that....you are flat out wrong.

[C.Biscuit97]

"flat out wrong" is flat out wrong.

 

I never said we were bad against the pass. I never said we were below average against the pass. What I was asserting was that because teams could run over us like small children playing in the street our pass defense statistically looked better than it was. Let's also be honest, Jarius Byrd was a huge HUGE part of the reason why opposing QBs got intercepted which lead to poor QB ratings. That is something our defense WAS good at. That being said I don't think opposing teams were shaking in their boots and ran because they were afraid to pass against us. The ran because it was an extremely easy, low risk recipe for success.

 

Again, my statement was to say that our defense looked better because teams didn't have to pass. That is a fair and accurate statement. If you disagree with that....you are flat out wrong.

 

12 other teams had less pass attempts than the Bills had against them. Completion % and QB rating are not stats that are determined by pass attempts. Anyway you slice it, you're wrong and it's a dumb point. Have a nice day.

[PDaDdy]

12 other teams had less pass attempts than the Bills had against them. Completion % and QB rating are not stats that are determined by pass attempts. Anyway you slice it, you're wrong and it's a dumb point. Have a nice day.

 

Your INABILITY to understand my point does not make it dumb. Your inability to understand my well explained point that includes factual data and plausible explanation and interpretation of that data makes.....

 

You say that 12 other teams had fewer pass attempts against them compared to the Bills. That is factual. Hooray for you! What point are you trying to make by stating that fact? There were 19 that had more. My point by saying that would be to say that the Bills were on the cusp of being in the worst 3rd or the top of the middle 3rd in fewest pass attempts.

 

To clear things up...where did I state that completion percentage and QB rating were linked to pass attempts?

 

Apparently there is a reading comprehension issue here.

 

WHAT I SAID:

1) Teams didn't need to pass against us because our run defense was 2nd worst in the league in attempts and yds/per.

2) QB rating and interceptions were in large part due to Jarius Byrd. He is part of the defense which made them good at that.

3) I asserted that the Bills' pass defense looked better than it was because teams didn't have to pass against us

4) I asserted that teams were not afraid to throw the ball against us

 

WHAT I DID NOT SAY:

1) The Bills pass defense stunk

 

 

Please "slice it" for me a few ways to illustrate how I am wrong as opposed to taking the childish "your point is dumb stupid head" approach.

[RyanC882]

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/articl...101/2030354/tbd

 

This says it all...'Everyone who knows anything about the NFL knows that teams with below-average quarterbacks don't win Super Bowls and seldom even make the playoffs.'

 

 

The author is correct, but only to the point that you need a good QB to win. Even as the article itself points out, good quarterbacks are available later in the draft. Montana was not a 1st rounder, Brady was not a first rounder, etc. I think the difference between Pike, LaFevor or Clausen will turn out to be too small to justify spending a #9 on Clausen. Also, it does not appear that Clausen can carry a team; he had a loosing record at ND, and had two stud WR's.

[Adam]

And we will be playing for the #1 overall pick since we still don't have a franchise type QB

So be it- that is part of building a team. Claussen doesn't make us a playoff team overnight either. Up until the Arizona game, I liked what I saw out of Edwards for a season and a half. Rememberthe knock about Claussen in that article- he played behind a subpar line- which probably was more talented than ours.

 

You can't develop a winning QB with a pourous defense and bad offensive line

[DarthICE]

NEWS ALERT: Kuato-lookalike Jimmy Clausen ain't no 'franchise type QB' - the Bills draft that a-hole and trust me, Eric Wood and the rest of the team will be lining up to snap Jimmy-boy's shins faster than J.P. Losman can say, "Troy Vincent."

 

Draft Bulaga in round one, Brandon Carter in round 4, Adam Ulatoski in round 5 - then sit back and watch Ryan Fitzpatrick and Brian Brohm suddenly, magically, morph into 'franchise type QBs'.

 

Bull ****. There is no line on this planet that is going to make ANY QB on this roster a franchise QB, they just dont' have it. It amazes me how many of you still want to keep trying to polish turds. Get a real QB talent in here for once, enough of these wanna be scrubs management keep bringing in.

[DarthICE]

So be it- that is part of building a team. Claussen doesn't make us a playoff team overnight either. Up until the Arizona game, I liked what I saw out of Edwards for a season and a half. Rememberthe knock about Claussen in that article- he played behind a subpar line- which probably was more talented than ours.

 

You can't develop a winning QB with a pourous defense and bad offensive line

 

The Cowboys did with Aikman. They had the QB first. It can be done and should be done in Buffalo.

[PDaDdy]

The Cowboys did with Aikman. They had the QB first. It can be done and should be done in Buffalo.

 

 

I wasn't aware of this.

 

Was the cowboys line nearly as bad as our's is now?

What quality offensive lineman did they get after they got Aikman to dramatically raise their talent level?

[Nanker]

The author is correct, but only to the point that you need a good QB to win. Even as the article itself points out, good quarterbacks are available later in the draft. Montana was not a 1st rounder, Brady was not a first rounder, etc. I think the difference between Pike, LaFevor or Clausen will turn out to be too small to justify spending a #9 on Clausen. Also, it does not appear that Clausen can carry a team; he had a loosing record at ND, and had two stud WR's.

 

Don't forget about Tony Romo. He was undrafted out of college.

[Captain Caveman]

People on both sides of this debate like to pull out examples of why you need to have a line first, or why you need the qb first. The fact that there are examples on both sides make it fairly obvious to me that either method / order can work. It's about drafting the right guys, not just about drafting the right positions. Now play nice.

[DarthICE]

Check nfl.com. I know it's a lot of yin and yang and good line play is complementary to good QB play and visa versa but:

 

Colts #1 ranked offensive line

Saints #4 ranked offensive line

 

 

Manning and Brees can't be Manning and Brees without those guys up front giving them the time and peace of mind to do their thing. Without those QBs, those lines are still easily top 10 in the NFL...with them they are #1 and #4 respectively. You can't get around it. You can't take one of those guys, put them on our team and suddenly we have a top 10 quality line.

 

NOT A CHANCE!

 

Thanks for proving my point...it is about the QUARTERBACKS!!! Oh I know you posted that stat about the lines, go look at where all the guys from Indy were drafted. Go look at ALL the Left Tackles that started for playoff teams this year. Only TWO were first round picks.

 

So your example proves the point you do NOT need a first round draft pick at LT, you need a franchise QB.

[ajzepp]

Ah yes, nothing says “able to command a high-powered offense” like posing with two of your buddies in tiny little speedos...

 

Jimmy Clausen - President, Lance Bass Fan Club

 

 

.

[Captain Caveman]

Thanks for proving my point...it is about the QUARTERBACKS!!! Oh I know you posted that stat about the lines, go look at where all the guys from Indy were drafted. Go look at ALL the Left Tackles that started for playoff teams this year. Only TWO were first round picks.

 

So your example proves the point you do NOT need a first round draft pick at LT, you need a franchise QB.

 

You still give no explanation as to why your franchise QB couldn't win at Notre Dame, if surrounding talent is not important.

[ajzepp]

What I don't understand is how such a great "franchise" qb could lose so many games in College. Yet people are expecting him to turn around a Pro Team with equal (if not greater) talent deficiencies all on his own.

 

It's the same way everyone rationalized the Trent Edwards situation. Yeah, Stanford sucked when he was there, but since his wideouts were awful and he was always running for his life behind a crappy O-line, the W-L record was overlooked. I know Trent wasn't a first rounder, but still....the example is the same. Trent didn't throw a lot of TDs in college, and he hasn't thrown a lot of them in the NFL either. So I agree....if you can't win at the college level, I don't see why all of a sudden you'll be a winner at the pro level.

[Captain Caveman]

It's the same way everyone rationalized the Trent Edwards situation. Yeah, Stanford sucked when he was there, but since his wideouts were awful and he was always running for his life behind a crappy O-line, the W-L record was overlooked. I know Trent wasn't a first rounder, but still....the example is the same. Trent didn't throw a lot of TDs in college, and he hasn't thrown a lot of them in the NFL either. So I agree....if you can't win at the college level, I don't see why all of a sudden you'll be a winner at the pro level.

 

What I find so puzzling is that the OP's whole point is that surrounding talent doesn't matter if you have a franchise QB. To say then that Clausen is a franchise QB just doesn't make any sense, because if so (according to the OP's theory) he should have won a hell of a lot more games at ND.

[The Senator]

Thanks for proving my point...it is about the QUARTERBACKS!!! Oh I know you posted that stat about the lines, go look at where all the guys from Indy were drafted. Go look at ALL the Left Tackles that started for playoff teams this year. Only TWO were first round picks.

 

So your example proves the point you do NOT need a first round draft pick at LT, you need a franchise QB.

Wanna run down the list of first-round 'franchise QBs' that were total busts?

 

Believe me, you do NOT want to see the Bills waste a first round pick on a QB that's gonna demand a fortune, hold up the Bills progress by missing camp in a protracted contract negotiation, eventually get a guaranteed $15M/year multi-year contract after threatening to hold out all season, only to ultimately suck out loud. In Clausen's case it would be particularly distressing, because he's such an a-hole, wanker-punk to begin with.

 

'Franchise QBs' can be found late in the draft, in the CFL, the Arena League, or even bagging groceries at the local Hy-Vee supermarket. The one place there are none to be found is in this year's first round.

 

You're gonna love Bulaga. So will Brian Brohm and Ryan Fizpatrick.