FireChans

Sawyer all day

what who

"Ahhhh risk!" "Ahhhh risk!" "Ahhhh risk!" "Ahhhh risk!" "Ahhhh risk!" No one has ever argued that trading up to draft or drafting a rookie QB high is without risk. The distinction that you failed to grasp in 2017 and fail to grasp today is that the alternative of never trying is FAR worse. If you had your way, we would've have drafted Roquan Smith and Mason Rudolph, would be probably on our 3rd HC and 2nd GM since McD and Beane and probably a perennial bottom-feeder yet again. But we aren't. Because we took a risk. A risk that somehow still petrifies you when the alternative is uh just being ass like you would be anyway.

Since 1980 Jim Kelly, Dan Fouts and Bob Griese are the only 3 HoF QB’s who had more picks than TDs in their playoff careers.

Haha are we talking Jimbo?

Sure, but that’s for planning, not execution. If you are saying “we may end up in CB wasteland if we pass on a near BPA CB in round one,” I agree. if your solution to that is to avoid that situation by not passing on a highly rated CB in the first, I can be convinced. If your backup solution is to reach for an early day 3 CB prospect in round 2, I don’t agree and can never ever be convinced. We will get Beano his elite Devin Funchess/Kelvin Benjamin combos or die trying!

I don’t think so. The reason is because Marino was a better QB lol

I really long for the offseason where we don’t debate what has-been would be better on the current era Bills. That said, the answer is and will forever be, Moulds.

There’s a reason why Marino is pretty much everyone’s “best QB to never win a ring” pick and Kelly kinda isn’t in that discussion.

Yeah for everyone who wants a lotto system, they should look at the lineups half the NBA was trotting out for the last 6 weeks. Lottos fix nothing. I think Gonzaga could’ve beaten the squad the Raptors have been rolling out.

We drafted a safety we needed to contribute right away and that safety could barely play. I’m with @GunnerBill. I don’t care where the team needs are within reason. I’m not taking a 3rd round grade DB in round 2.

Just for funsies, I did a 2017-2018 deep dive. Guess that poster! ”I am adamantly opposed to trading up for any QB except the consensus #1 pick in the draft. They succeed about 80% of the time, after that the success rate drops like a rock: 50% for QBs in the top half of the first round. Trading up for the 3rd best QB prospect ... supposing there even is one ... is a waste of resources. If 2 QBs are already off the board, stay put and see who's available at your spot ... or take a flier on a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round.” “How'd that work out in 2013? It's not ANY QB but the RIGHT QB that they have to draft” “They have too many holes to fill to waste high draft picks on a QB who's ceiling is "backup QB". They can draft one of those on Day 2 or Day 3 if they want somebody better than Peterman (which I hope they do but they have bigger needs right now, so I wouldn't be upset if they didn't” “That's what many fans thought about the 2011 and 2012 drafts, too. They were howling because the Bills didn't draft Blane Gabbert or Christian Ponder or trade up to get Robert Griffin III. Aside from Newton, Luck, and maybe Tannehill (depending how you view him vs Dalton and Cousins) the best QBs from 2011 and 2012 came out of rounds other than Round 1 (Andy Dalton, Russell Wilson, Kirk Cousins).” “Well, the disaster that was the Bills in 2013-2014 is a cautionary tale for teams (and their fans) who think sending a veteran QB packing to save a few $$ because they plan on drafting a QB in the first round” ”If they think Roquan Smith is a better LB than Lamar Jackson is a QB, and they go BPA, that works for me. A first round stud is a stud. A first round bust is an expensive backup. In fact, with all the hysteria over 4 or 5 potential first round QBs, maybe taking a guy in the 2nd or 3rd round is a smart move because those guys get lost in the shuffle.” “Only trading a truckload of high draft picks to gamble on an overhyped collegiate QB will get the Bills close to a Super Bowl” points for being consistent 8 years later I suppose @SoTier

I call it drought brain jokingly, but its really just fear-based decision making. Look at how many folks are like "that's how you get another EJ" in this topic alone. Like it's a death knell. Now, for the staff that messes up at QB, it very well may be, but that's not really the fans' concerns. The bigger crime is missing out on a Mahomes or an Allen or a Jackson because you are too paralyzed by fear to take one. And that's a sentiment that has been echoed in TBD lore forever. It's all documented, you can look back to 2016 and 2017 posts in the Tyrod era. There was a LOT of "what if the rookie is worse?' type posts and not just from the usual suspects. And I get it, in a season to season league we all want the product on the field to be watchable. But the quickest way to be a perennial playoff team is to nail the QB. It seems very quaint now but that's where we were. If I told you, 5 years from now, the Saints make the playoffs or at least are in the WC mix almost every single season for 10 years straight, what is the singular thing they did to make that possible, the answer is undoubtedly "found a QB." It's not prioritizing continuity in the FO, or that they hired a future HoF coach or that they went BPA through the draft and built a powerhouse team. It's just not. Now the larger point is that's where NFL teams get it wrong sometimes too. They sometimes fail to empower their teams. Schoen and Daboll should feel like they can gamble on Shedeur because that's what matters the most. But they clearly won't, because getting another QB wrong means they are both looking for work in 2026. So instead, they will take Hunter or Carter and pray to god they win 8-9 games and save their asses. And then in next year's QB class, they will be far from the #1 QB in the class and probably not even be able to trade up for the #2 QB. That's what the Saints should avoid, at all costs. They have the capital to take a QB now, and they should. I have said it once and I will say it again. The best thing Sean McDermott did for the Buffalo Bills was make the playoffs his first season. Not because it was a crazy successful year, but because it gave him (and Beane) the capital in the owners' eyes to gamble hard for Josh Allen. And because they gambled, we all won. It's doesn't matter that he may not be the best or second best HC in the game, or that Beane isn't the best FO guy in the game. It doesn't matter that a division rival had maybe the best coach in the history of football with 20+ years of continuity. It made it all irrelevant.

There’s no question that Russ and Ralph were trying to not lose money on the Bills first and foremost. Cash to cap spending and all that. The things @SoTier gets wrong are things like: Spiller wasn’t drafted because Lynch was walking in FA. Spiller was drafted and Lynch was traded because Lynch was addicted to hitting pedestrians in his car and doing other dumb *****. Ralph had been dead for 3 years when Gilmore walked and we were “forced” to draft his replacement in the first. (Funny how when we let Edmunds walk, we weren’t forced to draft his replacement in the first. Maybe this “forced” nonsense is just that). Mario Williams was perhaps the greatest Bills FA signing in 25 years. It was not the same as overpaying TO on a 1 year deal (which was in fact shameless FA move but a drop in the bucket imo) Pegula had opened up the checkbook for Whaley long before McD got there. The 2015 and 2016 Bills had a ton of money on the books. They were restructuring Clay and throwing money at Incognito etc etc. But we didn’t make the playoffs those years either, because our QB was dog ***** and our HC sucked too. So right church, wrong pew. The drought Bills were mismanaged. But even mismanagement can’t overcome having a good QB. The Bengals are notoriously cheap, and do dumb ***** or mismanage ***** all the time. When they have Palmer, Dalton, and now Burrow playing high-level ball, they make the playoffs. The Bills were mismanaged and were afraid to chase QBs. That combo is the recipe for the longest playoff drought in sports. this is OBVIOUS

In fairness to @Kirby Jackson, this sounded a lot more like “solitary OD/suicide in hotel” when the story first broke.

That’s the NYT/athletic reporting https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6275934/2025/04/13/lsu-kyren-lacy-death/ Former LSU receiver Kyren Lacy was founddead late Saturday night from an apparent self-inflicted gunshot wound after a police pursuit, the Harris County (Texas) Sheriff’s Office said Sunday. He was 24. The Constable’s Office responded to a call Saturday evening from one of Lacy’s family members who said he shot a gun into the ground, according to the sheriff’s office. Lacy left before authorities arrived. When law enforcement tried to stop his car about 20 minutes later, he fled again. The pursuit lasted several miles until his car crashed, the sheriff’s office said. As law enforcement officials moved to try to take him into custody, they discovered his gunshot wound and a handgun in the vehicle. He was pronounced dead at the scene, and the preliminary investigation determined he shot himself before his car crashed, according to the sheriff’s office.

A total crock. It’s a nice story on paper but it doesn’t hold up to cursory examination. McDermott let Gilmore walk and drafted White in the first. He was running the entire org, and the Pegulas had owned the team for 3 years at that point. They over-emphasized RBs but not because of money reasons. It was because of stupid reasons.

We did. I’m not sure Morse was seeking out independent Neurologists to see if he was okay to keep playing 6 months ago. https://www.newsweek.com/sports/nfl/saints-chris-olave-see-specilaits-determine-nfl-future-after-scary-concussion-1982125 I do know that we aren’t talking about trading a 3rd round pick and potentially signing a massive extension to Morse like we would Olave. do you think it’s smart for a team to trade for Tua and pay him right now?

Fair enough. I just don’t think there’s ever a good enough reason to wait when you don’t have a good QB. If they like Shedeur, they should take him. Maybe Arch stays in school. Maybe they hit on every other pick and win 8 games. The future is uncertain.

And so what? The 2012 Bills were 6-10. The 2013 Bills with a bum in EJ were 6-10. In the grand scheme of it all, it made no difference. EJ sucked. But he had a shot to be better than Fitzy ever would be. That chance is worth taking every time in a QB league. Treating picking a bust QB in the first as a cardinal sin that must never happen is coward stuff. The long view taken is the correct view. The fear mongering of “taking the wrong QB sets you back 5 years” is just that. You’d think Bills fans would’ve wised up to this by now.

May I introduce you to the 2017 draft. You may have heard about it. The sole reason the Bills drought lasted as long as it did is between Kelly and Allen, they drafted TWO QBs in the first lol.

So what though? If Sanders falls to 19 and the Steelers get him and he looks the part, everyone will clown the Saints for passing and rightfully so. The old GB used to believe that regardless of how garbage the rest of the roster is, if you don’t have a QB your biggest need is QB. The new GB believes the Saints should pick the 3rd best EDGE with their top 10 pick when they may not have a QB on the roster lol.

It's changed but I'm not sure it's changed all that much. 10 years ago, the best players to hit FA were Darrel Revis at 30 years old and Suh. Both very good players but not the best of the best at that point in time, with some warts (Revis - age and Suh - everything else about him). The days of free agents "resetting the market" wasn't all that common in the first place. It's probably less so now, because players rightly or wrongly seem to get their money first then demand out. But the benefit of signing mid to upper-tier FAs over extending players that are already under contract is that only one of those methods improves your team's talent. Aikman from 92-95 had 11 less passes thrown than Kelly from 90-93. Both had 11 starts. Aikman from 92-95 had a passer rating of 106. Kelly from 90-93 had a rating of 77. Aikman was a regular season dud who turned into a postseason stud. Kelly was the opposite.

Troy didn't have more INT's than TDs in the postseason. Troy in his 3 SB runs had 17 TD passes and 4 picks. Jim in his 4 SB runs had 13 TDs and 16 picks.

Really? Players we extended early. Josh Diggs Tre White Brown Is 50-50 a much better track record? There's also the point where Beane extending his own looks better for....Beane. Beane drafting Rousseau and paying him $20M AAV looks better to Terry than drafting Rousseau and letting him walk like Edmunds. Hell, look at the positive response our offseason has gotten from the national media. We spent like 90% of our money on paying guys who weren't even pending free agents and got like A- grades on how we improved the team lol