Zerovoltz
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1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:
Tolbert doesn’t play here.
West and Ware aren’t necessarily an upgrade from Ivory but at least in the same tier. I’d be interested for sure. A trade is a better route than any street FA other than Murray.
sorry on that Tolbert....thought I had read somewhere you all had signed him...my mistake.
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Considering the possible issue with "shady".....and frankly even with no issue with him....Ivory and Tolbert aren't excactly good RB depth.
Considering the Chiefs have something of a glut of RB, and that both our team and the Bills have made some recent trades....it's perhaps worth considering another mutually beneficial deal should it become needed.
For you consideration. Charcandrick West. Has started for KC at times and been effective. Decent pass catcher as well. Expendable due to Kareem Hunt and the signing of Kerwyn Williams, as well as others on a deep depth chart at RB. Started 11 games in the last few years for us.
Spencer Ware, has started 16 games including 14 in 2016. Was out all of last year with injury. Career YPC 4.6 (with a large sample size) Also can catch out of backfield with 48 career receptions, 42 of wich came in the 2016 season....again, expendable due to Kareem Hunt, other signings and other depth at RB, including West above. Ware now healthy.
Good NFL backs with some proven performance to look at. Just FYI.
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1 minute ago, transplantbillsfan said:
David Carr was thrust into an absolute shitstorm. He never stood a chance with that team. They were an expansion team and their #1 player in the expansion draft never played a down for them. That was All-pro OL Tony Boseli. Yeah, he might've helped a little.
Otherwise, they had absolutely nothing. Again, they were an expansion team and they decided to start their #1 draft pick immediately despit bringing entirely new players and coaches together across the NFL and college in their very 1st year.
And David Carr, while very talented and likely ruined by poor choices by the Texans, was pretty immobile. He wasn't remotely elusive in the way Allen is.
I agree that Carr is a great example of a rookie QB being mismanaged, but we look NOTHING like the 2002 Texans.
I guess it is worth asking if you think even if Allen is the best option RIGHT NOW....is there a benefit to HIM and the team, staying on the bench until he shows some sort of tangibile, meaningful progress (in the eyes of the coaching staff) ? ....if you don't think there is a benefit (and you may well be 100% right there isn't any) then he should start. My whole point on this is that I believe the scouting reports and what own coach has to say about him...and that is he needs to develop on the bench. I would normally agree that a guy learns better and faster by playing, but Allen I think...as his scouting reports suggested prior to draft day....he is one of the few guys who can make tangible, measurable progress on the bench and on the practive field and in the classroom.
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3 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:
There's a good chance Allen wins the starting job ahead of the season because he currently shares the depth chart with 2017 fifth-rounder Nathan Peterman, who briefly replaced Taylor in the lineup last November and promptly threw five interceptions in 30 minutes of football. The Bills also signed veteran AJ McCarron, who spent the first four seasons of his career with the Bengals, where he started four games (including a playoff game) in 2015 after Andy Dalton went down with a thumb injury.
"I think Josh is a mature guy who has handled his responsibilities the right way," said Bills offensive coordinator Brian Daboll. "He works hard. He improves. He listens to the veterans and coaches. If he makes a mistake one day, he works really hard to try and fix it the next day. He has the right attitude."
Actually Vigen explained that, as well. Been posted more than once.
Wait... so right here you acknowledge that Allen is probably better than Peterman or McCarron already.
I agree that's most likely the case, and that's why he's most likely to start week 1.
It's going to be extremely difficult to explain away to your vets why you aren't starting the best QB on the roster. And McDermott preaches open competition all the time...
If Allen wins that competition, he's the starter. Dabol and McDermott will likely have some sort of plan in terms of game planning and what not to protect him throughout the season.
I can understand your point, but consider David Carr.....he was better than anything the Texans had the moment he was drafted. That doesn't mean he was ready....and behind a bad line, he got clobbered.....now, he may never had amounted to anyhting...or maybe in a better situation he could have....there's no way to say...but MIGHT it have been better to let some journeyman get killed at first while Carr had more time to practice good football in a controlled practice environment? maybe. Allen is a long term investment. If you really wanted a QB that was plug and play you could easily have outspent Denver and brought in Keenum.....All I am saying is that considering what Allen IS NOW....a physical specimen that the scouts all said would need some time to develope...AND who your own head coach has said will take time to develop.....I would say that even if Allen is the best QB on the team.....if the coaches say he isn't ready yet.....then let Peterman or McCarron go out there until he is READY. They are expendable. I also get how the veterans might take that wrong by holding back the "best" player to help the team win....I would think that your coach has enough credibility in the locker room for those guys to understand "the process" ....and consider once again, if Allen was plug and play ready, he would have gone 1/1. If you trust your coach...he'll know when Allen is "ready" and that is when he will see the field.
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5 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:
Well this sounds like an appropriate post
It's rather odd you chose this analogy. Do you have issues of your own?
As to the point and disregarding your absurd analogy, how far exactly does Allen have to go? How much further ahead are Peterman and McCarron from where he is right now? Regardless of whatever progression Allen needs, what makes you think his progression will be better served on the bench than on the field?
I won't post the quotes or links again, but Allen's OC Brent Vigen (who also coached Carson Wentz) raved about Allen's progression in college and his ability to immediately step into the NFL and execute an NFL offense. Our GM Beane essentially shot down the national narrative that Allen is (too) raw in a post draft interview with Buffalo News.
He's also getting plenty of praise from teammates so far, including Shady, who's likely about the most bluntly honest player on our team.
Allen might be ready to start. That'll be determined this Summer. If he is and is better than Peterman and McCarron, I want him starting.
1. What Vigen says and what he actually did are two completely different things. For a guy who is supposed to be the best guy on your team, the best guy on the field...the play calling sure does suggest they tried to avoid putting it on Allen as much as they possibly could.....
2. Allen may very well be better than Peterman and MacCarron right now (in fact, he probalby is BETTER) but being better than Peterman and McCarron is a low hurdle IMO. Even if he is "better" than doesn't mean he is "ready". ....he should start when the coaches think there is nothing else to be gained by sitting. I don't propose to know what that means because I think QB's do the vast majority of their learning by playing in games...so if the coaches think ALLEN has improved and learned all he can while sitting, then he should start and see what he can do and how/if he progresses in real games. Whenever you get to that point, start him. That might mean week 1, or it might mean week 1 next year.
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6 hours ago, The Process said:
Is anyone else disenchanted by the swoosh Logos? Perfect example is the Pats ugly guy face swooshing out of....well....nowhere! The jags had the same.....Panthers.....same.....I wonder if the same overpaid artist is laughing all the way to the bank selling the same ole same ole....over and over. Am I nuts for noticing this or just an old fart not wanting to embrace modern design....?
I agree with this. a good sports logo and branding is able to convey that you are strong, confident, a sense of tradition, it's iconic...something familiar to a community as times change...
The Patriots HAD that look with their old logo. I don't tend to like logos that include a piece of sports equipments such as a ball, helmet, etc...but the old logo with the patriot ready to snap the football was classic, and met the criteria I set above. the current logo looks like the letterhead for a large life insurance company that formed after they merged two or three times with others. They've won a bunch in this look so it won't change..and will probalby become "classic" and "iconic" because of the winning tradition.
The Broncos is another example. I hate those guys, but the D with the horse head in it was a really strong look....that thing on their helmet now screams "western city public transit authority".
Jacksonville should have just stuck with their original uniforms....good clean look..they were a winner right away in those....no reason to have changed, but they did.
I prefer a clean crisp, classic, look, like the Colts...or Steelers (hate them too, but nice uniforms.) Might I even venture to say that KC has decent, iconic classic look that hasn't changed and isn't made to look like a swoosh etc.
I've always thought that it was arena league like to "swoosh": your logo....and another offense that comes off as minor league...having your font for the team name start with a Capital letter, have lowercase in between an uppercase, large final letter. .....are we advertising a tractor pull? (I'm talking to you EagleS, bring back the old eagle font and kelly green!)
FWIW, I like the old standing Buffalo logo better than the current one. (but it's not awful)
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I've never seen a QB who understand an NFL pocket better than Tom Brady. I don't like the Patriots...and I am certain the Patriots are hated universally here...but you watch the guy and litterally, the one thing he does that makes him elite instead of average is that he stands tall in the pocket...sliding left/right or moving up/back just slightly as needed to maintain himself in a small spot and area while KEEPING HIS EYES downfield. In the NFL, so often, the winning play is made when the QB has time to make a read and throw. And so often the QB is his own worst enemy, by taking your eyes off your targets and looking at pass rushers and tyring to see where you can run to...you are no longer looking for the best target. Plays can and are made from this circumstance....but once the QB no longer can see ALL of his available targets on the field..the chance the defense will win the play goes way up. Brady wins from the pocket at a HIGH RATE because he almost always is standing up straight, eyes downfield...finding the best target and delivering the ball to that target.
That's it...there is no magic..and certainly Brady doesn't ahve a cannon arm and he can't run....his excpetional skill is understanding how to win in an NFL pocket. That is it.
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5 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:
While I agree with some of this, I just wanted to point out that it is NOT unprecedented to see completion percentage improve by almost 10%.
Brett Favre 1987 Southern Mississippi 40.7%
Brett Favre 1988 Southern Mississippi 55.8%
Brett Favre 1989 Southern Mississippi 54.1%
Brett Favre 1990 Southern Mississippi 54.5% (college totals 52.4%)
Brett Favre 1991 Atlanta Falcons 4 attempts the whole year
Brett Favre 1992 Green Bay Packers 64.1% on 471 attempts and a career total of 62%
Interesting to note that Favre sat for a year before his major improvement occurred.
I admit I overlooked the case of Brett Favre....probalby due to the guys I researched to compare being within the past 10 years or so...but since you bring it up, it does fit in with my thought that Allen COULD do this...but in my opinion, he'll need the good reps, good coaching, etc..and lots of it to get him "right". I can't say i know much about Favre's college career etc but playing at small school, that wasn't in a conference back then, with the big arm and good size....there may be some similarities there.
....it is worth noting that late 80's early 90's era NFL football, it was considered GOOD to have a mid 50's% completion pct....different era, different rules....that's worth noting....Favres college numbers would seem BAD if he played now.
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On 4/27/2018 at 8:07 AM, Magox said:
I want to preface these series of thoughts with the fact that I was hoping for Rosen over Allen. With that said one of the common gripes that I am hearing from some of our fans on this board is that Josh Allen is the bigger risk for this franchise than Rosen. The argument goes something along the lines that Rosen is the best pure passer, the most NFL ready therefore he's close to a sure thing. Whereas Allen is the big armed QB who is inaccurate similar to EJ Manuel and he's got Bust written all over him.
On the surface this argument makes sense.
However, there are huge gaping holes with this argument.
A) One of the big things that people talked about including lots of whispers from NFL personnel is that Rosen was not a leader of men. Some questioned his demeanor and whether or not his heart was fully in the game. I don't know whether or not that stuff is true or not but it was definitely out there. I will say this, the little that I observed of him I definitely saw a smugness about him. Does that matter? I don't know. But it was certainly palpable and if I saw that after a few interviews then I'm certain that this reputation was observed by many others as well. The fact that his ex coach Mora could not give him a full-throated endorsement and even picked his in-state rival as being the QB who should be picked first to me screams of a red flag. Sure, Mora tried backtracking some and equivocating why he said that, but the bottom line is that he didn't feel the urge to gush about the player he coached.
B) His injury concerns. Will he be a Bradford sort of player? I think that is a fair question. He's had a couple concussions and I believe a shoulder injury that kept him out for some time. He's not the most mobile QB, tends to hold on to the ball too long sometimes because he's a QB that likes to try to make plays but if you are in the NFL and you don't have great protection and you hold on to the ball too long and you are prone to some injuries, it's stands to reason to believe he could be an injury prone QB in this league. That is a risk.
Allen on the other hand is a big hulking QB that can not only shake off arm tackles but he's very mobile and makes amazing throws on the run. Considering the offensive line we have, this is probably a better fit than Rosen is essentially just a pocket passer.
While Allen has his shortcomings primarily in the accuracy department, it is an overblown charge that people make and it is without doubt in many cases an on-the-surface observation primarily to the famed 56% completion rate. There certainly is some there there. But a few things you have to keep in mind.
A) This was a down-the-field sort of throwing offense which is more susceptible to producing higher incompletion rates
B) His offensive line was very weak and he was constantly under duress.
C) His WR's were very poor and they weren't able to get a lot of separation.
His intermediate and long range passing is really good, where he struggles are his short passes. That is something that will have to be worked on and to me that is more a matter of setting his feet/mechanics and from what I've been reading it is something that he has worked on and improved, as evidenced in the Senior bowl game. He was the best performing QB that attended this year.
You have posted some contradictory statements here. (A This was a down the field sort of throwing offense which is susceptible to producing higher incompletion rates...but then in your next statement, you say that Allen excelled at long range passing. .....it would seem that the offense was therefore geared to take advantage of something you say Allen does well...wich should lead to BETTER NUMBER...not worse numbers. So, was it beneficial to throw downfield more, or not?
The guy is also an anticipation thrower that can hit receivers in small windows. He's also a very intelligent guy and hard worker and a leader or men. Where he needs some work on the mental aspect are his progressions which of course is a very important element. To me, this is his biggest risk into becoming a franchise QB.
While they both have their risks, it is a fallacy from my point of view to believe that Allen is the bigger risk considering that Rosen may have troubles leading his teammates and his injury risks.
There is a reason why not only was the whisper campaign in NFL evaluator/GM circles in full effect to "stay away" from Rosen and the fact that teams in need of QB's early on decided to forgo him, not to mention that most mocks had Allen being selected over Rosen. It's not because he doesn't have the talent, it's because of these other concerns.
Rosen could very well end up being the better QB, but the risks are there and they are reasonably undeniable. Again, this is not so much an argument of who is going to be the better QB it's to address the fallacy that Allen is the bigger risk.
you make a valid point about risk management here for sure. I would simply ask....that given the Risks with Rosen are based on his percieved aloofness and arogance...personality....and injury history.....vs the more tangible metric of completion percentage/results on the field for Allen....is Rosen the bigger risk? I don't propose to know, but some arogant jerks who can produce on the field have been good pros before...whereas this completion pct/stats issue for Allen has a lot of actual math behind it to suggest there is substantial risk. .....again.....I am not trying to say one or the other is a more worthwhile risk.....certainly an interesting take on it.
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....probalby has to do with the notion that a college QB with such a low completion pct has never been successful in the NFL.....and even when there have been a few to imrpove...the best case is Jake Locker going from a 54% passer in college to a 57% passer in the NFL....3 pct...and still well below what most would consider good enough to succeed.
The anger isn't so much at Allen as it is in the idea that for 2 years this whole series of trades, moves, jockeying, etc...was all to lead up to getting "the man" ....and when the pick finally came in, the leadership selected Josh Allen...a huge gamble/risk.
(I have my reservations about Allen, BUT...I LOVE that your front office pulled the trigger and is shooting for the stars instead of accepting status quo)
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10 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:
1- Is an NFL game ever not brutal? You're projecting too much about how good the teams are in our first 8 games. Regardless of what a coach should or should not do, I highly doubt that's what McDermott is doing. The NFL changes so consistently year to year that I'd bet you money that at least two of those teams you (and so many others who--like every year--are predicting how difficult our schedule is based on the teams we play) allude to who you think will be so great in the first 8 games will end the season with losing records. At least 2. Probably more. I don't think projecting like this is something coaches do or is even plausible--except for when the Bills play the Patriots
2- More projecting. Similarly to #1, Beane's job as GM is to evaluate players and bring in the best known good to great players for value but, more importantly, to rely on scouting--both pro and college--to go out and find those diamonds in the rough. We have and unknown offensive roster, not necessarily a "not very good one." Maybe it's downright awful, but the good thing is that McDermott has had OTAs and Minicamp and will have Training Camp and Preseason to evaluate it. If he thinks they're much worse than they were last year, I'm sure that'll factor into his decision. I, personally, thing the offensive roster is better than you think. But I've really bought into what Beane has been doing with the roster on both the pro and college side.
3- I think this is a playoff team, just like I thought we'd make the playoffs last year and thought it before the season started:
https://www.twobillsdrive.com/community/topic/195955-why-are-you-so-sure-we-arent-a-playoff-team/
We were a playoff team. This year, I think we'll be better. I don't even know who our QB is, yet, but I think we'll finally get to double digit wins and won't rely on another team in a miracle win to make the playoffs. I think that not simply because I am a Bills fan. I think that because it's year 2 under a HC who already coached an underrated team into the playoffs once and he's going into year 2 with a seriously upgraded defensive roster (and that's his bread and butter), he brought in an OC who's advertised as very creative who he seems to know well personally and trust, our RBs are better, our WRs are already better with simply a healthy Benjamin, our OL has an opportunity with 2 aging vets who left to inject some youth in the interior OL, and we have lots of potential at the QB position... with whoever that might be. Plus, again, this is year 2 under a regime that broke a 17 year playoff drought. There's buy-in already built in.
Allen might not start week 1. If he doesn't, it's going to be because Peterman or McCarron were clearly well ahead of him. I doubt it's for any of the 3 reasons you provide.
1. - even if your first 8 games happen to be against what ultimately turn out to be the easiest 8 games played in the NFL all year....he should still be on the bench.
2. I certainly could be wrong about my evaluation of the Bills offensive talent. I'm not a scout etc. I wouldn't have a different opinion in regards to Allen if you had for example, the Patriots offensive roster. I THINK that Allen isn't ready to carry what appears to be an offensive side lacking the kind of talent to carry a QB.
3. McDermott did quite an impressive job getting the Bills to the post season. I certainly wouldn't have counted the Bills as a playoff team heading into last season.
You and many others have stated that if Allen can show he is heads and shoulders above the other 2 running the offense in camp/pre-season, he should start. I AGREE with that....but since this is pre camp, and no preseason games to watch yet, we are speculating here....and so, I am speculating that his pre draft scouting report isn't wrong, that he is who everyone says he is...(a physical talent, a smart kid, who was inaccurate in actual games, on a bad team in a bad conference) I think this will manifest itself in camp and especially on the field in preseason. I frankly can't wait to see how it plays out. I think what will happen is that Allen will look like a guy who needs some work and time on the bench when we get to live action, but I'm certainly looking forward to seeing what he looks like in a game setting and having my views challenged.
Also...I'm not ANTI Bills or Anti Allen. I've said on this board many times that I really want this all to work out for you folks. This board and fan base are GREAT to interact with...it's why I keep showing up here...great group. Unless you are playing the Chiefs, I will be rooting for the Bills. (and hey, I got my picture taken with Poncho Billa at the draft even) .....Anyhow....I am calling it like I see it....like I said...my worthless 2 cents.
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12 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:
Not sure what you’re talking about here, Days. Is this what you’re talking about? I would rephrase it slightly, that a QB who can throw accurately and protect the ball during OTAs may or may not be able to do the same in a real game, but a QB who can’t protect the ball during OTAs has a steep curve ahead of him to do better in real games.
1. This really isn't related to my thoughts on Josh Allen but....
2. We expect Mahomes to have some days like this. He's running with the 1's. We are trying out several players at the C position with the 1's.
3. Mahomes is getting praise from all over the place locally, nationaly, other players, etc...having sat pretty much a year...and this being his first season playing...I am expecting there will be some times where we cringe...but at this point, completely expecting a dynamic, franchise QB over the coming 15 years...nothing at this point to say that isn't the expected trajectory.
I stand by my thoughts on Allen. He's an incredibly intriquing prospect because of his physical and mental makeup. On an actual football field, he has had some well documented issues with accuracy. I am willing to entertain the idea that Allens completion PCT can actually be improved by almost 10 pct even though that would be unprecedented. Allen could be coached up to a QB who could exceed the 60% completion pct threshold in the NFL someday but I'm only willing to think it possible if he gets a TON of reps, in practice, with NFL caliber players on the field with him, and good coaching. The only argument I will buy that he had the low completion pct in college is due to poor coaching, poor talent around him and that he spent a ton of his on field time playing sandlot football, totally off script.
Josh Allen is the very RARE case where if ever a guy could truly see tangible benefits by sitting and learning then he is it. For the sake of your future, for the sake of seeing this whole thing through the right way and to end up with a QB that can be a franchise 15 year guy....he needs to be solidly planted on the bench for the whole year....and at bare minimum, the first 8 games.
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My worthless 2 cents. I think it will be Peterman. ....it could be McCaron, but the important thing here is that the question being asked should be Allen or someone else. The someone else part doens't really matter what their name is or who they are. Some of you posting here have mentioned that Allen was drafted, knowing that there will need to be some time to develop. that has not changed. he's been mostly running with the 3's. He's also lived up to his scouting report. Big arm, athletic. smart. looks like the god of QB's in a no pressure practice type situation (like he always has) I'd venture to say that at some point in the season he will start, but not game one...here is why:
1. The Bills opening 8 games are so are brutal. Let one of your low dollar, not in the future plans, scrub QB's take those hits and losses. No need to expose Allen to the brutal speed and harshness of the NFL over these first 8 games.
2. The Bills offensive roster isn't very good. I'm not a Bills fan as you all know....just objectively looking at your roster on the offensive side of the ball...it's frankly pretty bad. Again, let the other QB's come in and have to work with this less than optimal talent level to start with. Perhaps after 8 games, the talent level won't be much better but at least there will have been some time for the O-line to develop some cohesiveness and maybe some guys emerge here and there.
3. There should be no illusions that this is a playoff team, and certainly not a contender at this point. Let the other QB's take the wrath of the fans and media while Allen remains the golden boy in waiting, the great hope of the future, unstained by what will probalby be a pretty miserable opening to the season. Bring him in when the fans and media no longer are clinging to any hope that this team is has any realistic post season asperiations.....Then the focus can be on watching Allen and seeing how he does game to game..hopefully finding tangible evidence of improvment until the end of the season....giving you something to be hopeful about in 2019 when they can also spend to improve his weaponry, his o line...another draft...etc.
You all like to point at "the process". Starting week 1 would be kind of anti process. sacrifice Peterman and McCaron so that Allen can have the best shot at sustained success (if he is ever to have it)
Week 1. Someone not named Josh Allen.
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5 hours ago, Jay_Fixit said:
I see horrible footwork, off balance throws and things that will get him into trouble in games that mean something.
Watchig that clip makes me cringe. He’s like a marionette with a strong arm.
He isn't off balance on either throw. unlike many QB's who will spin away and run when the outside rush is collapsing the pocket, Mahomes goes forward, keeping his eyes downfield...and delivers a strike right on target. The other play he moves around in the pocket...again, his eyes scanning the field the whole time as you can see his head progressing through targets...he sets and throws a lazer 20 yards downfiled right on target. He isn't off balance on either of these. I can show you one where he doesn't set his feet and tries to use nothing but arm to throw the ball deep downfield and it ends up being underthrown, but it isn't these two plays. Anyhow....interesting how you see a QB doing everything wrong on these two plays and I see a QB doing what you'd want an NFL QB to do in both of them.
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3 minutes ago, Jay_Fixit said:
This is a joke.
Jay Fixit...please....break down what you see in the GIF....I am very interested to know how you see this.
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43 minutes ago, Jay_Fixit said:
It’s going to be a **** show.
So...he takes a snap from under center, does a play action fake, turning his back on the defense..things he is supposed to suck at....he climbs up in the pocket, looks right then whips a pass to the left to the open man while moving forward...this is bad? That is everything you'd want the QB to do on that play. The second play, he takes the snap, LOOKS over the field, sets his feet and WHIPS a pass 20 yards upfeild to the open man.....LOL....yes, this IS why we are excited.
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1 hour ago, John from Riverside said:
I absolutely did
And
I absolutely dont care
You traded away a good veteran QB and pushed all in on a player that has done NOTHING yet
None of that is disputable
You aren't wrong....but you are simplifying it just a little bit by saying he has done "nothing". It would probably be safe to assume that everything he has done since drafted, on the practice field, in the classroom, in preseason and in the Denver game....compelled the Chiefs to feel good about trading away Alex Smith who they still had under contract one more year. I don't think they would have done that for "nothing". It would be reasonable to expect that no matter what anyone says, fans, pundits etc...it is clear the Chiefs coaches and brain trust think they have "something".
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1 minute ago, John from Riverside said:
You know the funny thing is I have absolutely nothing against the Chiefs as long as we are not playing them.....
but
The Chiefs are really gambling with their chips all in on Mahommes......who has done nothing yet to show this kind of trust. To me trading away a established veteran was bizarre......as your veteran QB was better then our veteran QB that we traded away for a 3rd.
Mahommes has a nice situation with those targets......I dont have that same confidence in your OL.....he didnt play under Center in college.....he didnt look great when he got his opportunites as a rookie.
We didnt feel it was the time to take a QB....I was very happy with getting Tre and punting to the next draft year where I felt the QB prospects were better.
If Mahommes starts the year and does well.....and Josh Allen does not start the year I wont feel like we lost the trade one bit. Different QBs....different situations.
Good luck to Patrick
You didn't click on the link and read the article, that is full of plenty of video breakdown...detaling why they traded smith and why all the hype.
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3 hours ago, TonyBeets said:
Mahomes is a generational talent had me cracking up!! You will be missing Alex Smith very soon!
https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2018/6/19/17477286/patrick-mahomes-hype-train
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As a few other said...he signed with KC for the money. If KC had Matt Cassel at QB this year and we (KC) offered that contract, he would still be a Chief...and he would say something like, I feel like Andy Ried's O is the best fit....95% of players in any sport, select the contract that pays the most...there are few exceptions here and there to play close to your hometown, or you've been with a team so long you give a bit of discount to stay put...but 95% of the time...it's the money....players say and do stupid things all the time, but it's amazing that none of them ever just say it was about the money....it's especially baffling that in hip/hop black culutre...the way money is celebrated that most of these guys don't just come and brag all about the money.
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2 hours ago, BB@Shooter said:
Zero....I saw Allen in person in 16 games or somewhere like that. And the rest on TV. I have seen every BYU qb come through the last 30 years. I saw both Carr's and Dilfer in person. I saw Dalton and Smith in person. In other words I have seen a lot off qb's in my years. That is just the tip of the iceberg.
I would like to see Allen play, but know that sitting him would be best. He is used to poor line play and below average receivers, so he can probably handle what is thrown at him. I would have loved to see Mahomes try and play at Wyoming, it would have been hysterical. People need to let it go until he is in pads, then you will see the leadership and toughness. The guy knows how to win. He put those Wyoming teams on his back and carried them. Old hat to him.
Well...then we seem to be in agreement about Allen at least...I am strongly advocating that he sit for now....and I am not disagreeing with what you saw Allen do at Wyoming...it's why I think he should sit...that environment was not one conducive to training a QB up to make reads, throws from the pocket. He has nothing but a history of low completion pct..so I don't know if he'll ever improve.....you'd think there'd be a pattern of progress there as most QB's display in college...but I digress...when you take a ton of reps and most of those reps are running around and trying to find open slow targets...that isn't good prep for the NFL....good prep is what he is getting now and he needs to repeat this and work on it on the practice field and in the classroom. He has the tools that everyone wants..it's why he went in the top 10 of the draft...big arm, big body, athletic, mobile and smart..and by all accounts a good leader...everything you'd want...I'm not telling anyone here anything new...the scouting reports all say the same thing.....if he is ever going to be more than a great prototypical tools guy...he needs quality reps with quality coaching and players around him...his college experience did not provide him that.
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40 minutes ago, BB@Shooter said:
Are you still drunk, or has the rot gut whiskey begun to shut down your mind?
GaryPinC is seeing what I am seeing.
BB@Shooter....curious to know your thoughts on Allens development...should he sit? should he play now? What do you think about what you've seen and hear about him so far?
4 hours ago, John from Riverside said:Ppl see what they wanna see
your qb didn’t look great in year one in th limited time he got and came from an air raid offense in college you may end up regretting the trade that sent your starter away
Submitted without further comment.
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Just now, John from Riverside said:
Well if he says it it must true lol
It's not just that.....but if you study it....and better yet....just take in the reality that they traded Smith away, when they didn't have to at all...for this guy....it speaks volumes.
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9 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:
Well let’s hope so became so he looked like crap in his minimal time last year
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LOL...I don't spend anytime on Chiefs boards..I am part of one facebook group and I can't hardly stand that....WAY WAY too much blind homerism in KC. (Cameroheads) I really enjoy this place...good discussion here.......been interested in the Bills since the Mahomes trade....and have found that lots of good, smart fans to chat with on this board...even though I am not a Bills fan.....all the Allen talk....and just general football discussion...plus the recent trades between KC and you for Ragland....and also we have Watkins so interesting to read all of what folks think of him here....wish KC had a board like this.