Zerovoltz
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Posts posted by Zerovoltz
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I would like to point out that we had Alex Smith here already....behind the same line with the same weapons.....Mahomes isn't just succeeding because he is here...certainly it helps....but Mahomes is legit....Reid went to get him because he understood he needed someone who could drive the porche like a racecar and not like a minivan.
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17 minutes ago, mattynh said:
Mahomes through lots of picks in training camp! Chiefs were concerned. Meanwhile our guy was great in tc and did not make it through one !@#$ing game. I wonder when people will get it through their heads that what you see in preseason. Is not real?
.....He threw pics in training camp that the MEDIA was conernced about. Andy Reid repeatedly said he was pushing the limits of the offense and wanted to see how much Mahomes could handle....they weren't worried about it all....it was party of training camp prep.
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I think it would be good for the NFL if 5 or 6 teams actually came out as big ground and pound style teams and were successful. I miss the 90’s NFL where you had some ground and pound like KC, some west coast like SF, a couple of Run and Shoot teams, like Houston, and then you had the dynamic Bills and Cowboys.
I remembervas a Chiefs fan, part of the week leading up to a game was talking about adjusting to the different style of offense you were facing in a given week. There was a lot of variety. Now teams either run a spread or some variation of a pass heavy west coast.
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From afar, I thought Buffalo was going to be pretty good under Ryan...it looked like you all were about to turn the corner there for a bit....
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As the lines have become small and quick...I've wondered if it would now be a good idea to go get a couple really big Jerome Bettis backs..big hulking fullback, and then a QB like Cam Newton..and run or RPO out of some big sets......these teams who stay in the nickel almost the whole game would get bowled over if they came up against something like that....I think if it happens it will almost be by accident....some coach who doesn't have a great QB, but somehow has a big TE or a bruiser type RB decides he has nothing to lose and goes double TE with an I formation because that's what he has....would be something to see for sure...
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11 minutes ago, Putin said:
Who gives a sh1t about the Chiefs or Mahoney on here ???
The article is directly related to the original poster and his thoughts on the vertical passing game disappearing etc.
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I did some research on this a couple years ago after we drafted Mahomes.....I took every QB who had started in a superbowl going back 20 years (this was a couple years ago so didn't include Foles) ....The reason I chose only super bowl starters is simply that if you are a QB and were good enough to be starting in a SB, that is about as good a baseline as I could come up with for what constituted a "good" or "Successful" QB. What I found was that of all the QB's on my list, over the course of their first 16 STARTS, the guys who sat, had a QB rating in those first 16 starts that was nearly identical to the guys who started right away. IF there were a benefit to sitting, then you would think that there should be some tangible difference in QB rating over the first 16 games....the idea being, all these QB made it to a super bowl, so they were good...so the benefit of sitting should have shown up when they got on the field having had more time to practice, more time to study, more mentoring. The numbers DO NOT show that at all.
.......and I have posted this other places on this board....but IN SPITE of my own thoughts and my own research to back up that starting is better than sitting..Josh Allen is the rare case where I think actual, tangible improvement might have come from practice to work on some things and bad habbits that come from scrambling behind a bad line, and having inferior talent to work with.....
On the other hand...Josh Allen might be perfect for the Bills because, having played behind a bad line in college, and had inferior targets to throw to....he should actually be able to come right in feel comfortable with the situation around him.....and throw for 45% completion pct.
Good luck. The kid isn't ready.
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I watched the "every Josh Allen pass" video from the Baltimore game. It's glaringly obvious that his arm is special. I won't go as far as to evaluate his decision making etc...in a game you are down by 40, the defense isn't doing much at that point, but what is crystal clear is that Allen can put alot of mustard on a football.
I see they are starting Allen this week. I don't think it will go well because I don't believe he is ready....if they thought he was, he would have started week 1. In retrospect, the "process" to start a veteran while Josh sat.....is still the right call to me...but a big mistake was trading Tyrod....if you keep him and start him, your coach has ALOT more credibility to keep Tyrod at the helm because he is a seasoned veteran, coming off at least being at the helm as you made a playoff appearance. Peterman sucks....and now your coach has basically no choice but to throw Allen in because he'll lose the locker room if he runs Peterman back out there. Not optimal.
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1 hour ago, StrikeParry said:
Just came to say you are probably right about Mahomes.
I don't need to do that....I've made that case all over this board...no need to do it again right now....
Consider this Bills fans.....IF you all believe in the process etc....then you really need to embrace what that entails...WAY too many of you (not all) haven't honestly considered what the current FO is having to do here....
1. You are in salary cap hell. There simply isn't any magic that fixes that until you get past all this dead money.
2. You did in fact draft a QB who isn't ready to go out of the box. That's FINE for now as long as you understand that is what you have right now...and even if he is more ready than that, your roster isn't.
3. Your team made the playoffs in a year where you had a negative point differential and some stuff fell your way. Matt Cassel once led one of the worst Chiefs teams I have ever seen, to a division title using smoke a mirrors one year...the schedule broke just right, every bounce went our way...the underlying stats and the eye test told us all they were awful. The Bills are aweful, and they weren't that much less awful last year.
Given that...at this point, you are on schedule. If you can just come to terms with the idea that THIS year is going to be miserable and it has to be that way to wait out the cap and to develope your QB, you'll be fine. in 2019, you'll be picking top of draft and have money to spend....AND if it is meant to be, then Allen will have become more NFL ready. You can then spend big on that roster to actually then find out if the QB you have is the man.
This may or may not work but at MINIMUM, you have to let these guys undue the cap hell and see Allen through enough to determine if they got it right or not. Any new regime would have to carry through with the SAME plan for the first year at least anyway.
Stay the course. Watch a lot of college football to see wich D Lineman you like this year...supposed to be a prime D Lineman draft coming up. Watch some youtubes of your reactions making the playoffs....it sucks, but the real progress can't begin until you get through this year. Good luck.
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Someone had asked about the summary of the trade involving Mahomes etc...here it is....but it doesn't include any subsequent moves to get further up in this years draft for Allen.
Chiefs Get :
QB Pat Mahomes (R1 pick 10, 2017)
Bills Get:
CB Tre White (R1 pick 27, 2017)
Pick 91 (R3 pick 91, 2017) packaged with other picks for trade up to 37. Rams used pick on S John Johnson. Bills go to (R2 pick 37, 2017) and select WR Zay Jones.
Pick 21 (R1 pick 21, 2018) packaged with other picks for trade up to 16. Ravens traded out with Titans who used the pick on LB Rashaan Evans. Bills go to (R1 pick 16, 2018) and select LB Tremaine Edmunds.
Esentially, after it was all said and done, it was Mahomes for Tre White, Zay Jones and Tre Edmunds more or less ish.
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On 6/29/2018 at 5:18 AM, Zerovotlz said:
My worthless 2 cents. I think it will be Peterman. ....it could be McCaron, but the important thing here is that the question being asked should be Allen or someone else. The someone else part doens't really matter what their name is or who they are. Some of you posting here have mentioned that Allen was drafted, knowing that there will need to be some time to develop. that has not changed. he's been mostly running with the 3's. He's also lived up to his scouting report. Big arm, athletic. smart. looks like the god of QB's in a no pressure practice type situation (like he always has) I'd venture to say that at some point in the season he will start, but not game one...here is why:
1. The Bills opening 8 games are so are brutal. Let one of your low dollar, not in the future plans, scrub QB's take those hits and losses. No need to expose Allen to the brutal speed and harshness of the NFL over these first 8 games.
2. The Bills offensive roster isn't very good. I'm not a Bills fan as you all know....just objectively looking at your roster on the offensive side of the ball...it's frankly pretty bad. Again, let the other QB's come in and have to work with this less than optimal talent level to start with. Perhaps after 8 games, the talent level won't be much better but at least there will have been some time for the O-line to develop some cohesiveness and maybe some guys emerge here and there.
3. There should be no illusions that this is a playoff team, and certainly not a contender at this point. Let the other QB's take the wrath of the fans and media while Allen remains the golden boy in waiting, the great hope of the future, unstained by what will probalby be a pretty miserable opening to the season. Bring him in when the fans and media no longer are clinging to any hope that this team is has any realistic post season asperiations.....Then the focus can be on watching Allen and seeing how he does game to game..hopefully finding tangible evidence of improvment until the end of the season....giving you something to be hopeful about in 2019 when they can also spend to improve his weaponry, his o line...another draft...etc.
You all like to point at "the process". Starting week 1 would be kind of anti process. sacrifice Peterman and McCaron so that Allen can have the best shot at sustained success (if he is ever to have it)
Week 1. Someone not named Josh Allen.
I stand by this.
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Something of note here....TWO Bills O-lineman were claimed on waivers. I don't what that says about the Bills line...maybe it's better than anyone thinks...maybe they can't evaluate line talent and cut some guys they shouldn't have? ....I don't know....just saying for a team that had O line problems in the preseason, having TWO of your cut O lineman get claimed is a mystery.
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11 minutes ago, Ittakestime said:
Beane is a disaster of a GM. Been that way since he got here
The good news is that having Peterman, McCarron and Allen at QB right now, means you don't have big money tied up with them so you can absorb some dead money without too much pain. The bad news is, if your GM keeps doing things like this trade, or way overpaying for Star Loltelui, then it won't matter. ....it's still the NFL...and in the NFL the QB is king. if Josh Allen works out, this will be but a minor footnote....but at this point you really really need Allen to work out....he's literally going to be what keeps this regime here and working or fired within the next two years and starting ALL OVER AGAIN.
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I have no idea if they would do it or not, but Green Bay has TWO first round picks next year (they got one from the Saints when New Orleans moved way up to take that pass rusher from San Antonio)
If you are Green Bay, you aren't going to be picking up high in the next draft, and the Saints aren't either. Those are a couple of mid to late round 1 next year. I'd think they'd be strongly considering that....becasue Green Bay is ALWAYS Aaron Rodgers plus one player away.
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On 8/18/2018 at 6:54 PM, aristocrat said:
14 tds 13 picks. 5 fumbles lost. He’s gonna be a turnover machine
If you are going to take box score stats and project those out to how a guy will do in the pros......errr......uh......nevermind.
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2 minutes ago, H2o said:
"Just based off what I saw last year, I think Allen is more talented than Mahomes. I would take him over Patrick Mahomes. I think he's got better feet, quicker feet, he's more natural," Jeremiah said during the latest Move The Sticks Podcast. "He's under center, so in some of those things, he's ahead of Mahomes, but they have the same strengths and the same weaknesses."
Jeremiah wasn't necessarily as big a fan of Mahomes as were the Kansas City Chiefs, who traded up to make the former Texas Tech star the draft's No. 10 pick. In fact, Mahomes wasn't on Jeremiah's final pre-draft list of thetop 50 prospects. Analyst Bucky Brooks sees Allen as less of a developmental project than Mahomes, as well.
"To me, Allen would probably be able to get on the field sooner than Mahomes," Brooks said. "If both guys had to play right now, I think you could probably win more games with Allen, because I think Mahomes is going to have more turnovers." ~ Daniel Jeremiah (from 2017)
For what it's worth Allen is likely going into year one as the starter. You can say it's because he isn't behind a competent vet like Alex Smith and in Buffalo it's a different situation. In many respects you would be right. It also could be that with Allen's skillset and mental capacity he is just more Pro-ready. I'm not saying either are HOF bound and I'm not saying either are destined to be busts of a different nature. Me personally, I wasn't sold on Mahomes as a prospect and regardless of whom his head coach may be I'm still not. One 69 yard pass to one of the fastest men in the NFL during a preseason game doesn't do it for me. Is it encouraging if you're a Chiefs fan? I'm sure it is after dealing with a QB who was typically scared to throw the ball more than 25 yards. It is encouraging for Bills fans the way Josh Allen has handled himself and the strides he has made since his season ended at Wyoming last year. There is a lot involved in this and it can be extremely detailed. Too much to post. We'll let time and the play on the field speak for itself. Truthfully when I started this thread I did so to laugh at all of the Mahomes nut jugglers who would come out of the woodworks in defense of their man-crush. It hasn't let me down, but I can't stop thinking "Only if Jeffismagic was still here."
Either way, carry on gentleman. It is quite entertaining. 
Hurry up and get here regular season!
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30 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:
Or they didn't want to pay him 17m and have him beat out the guy they traded two #1s for.
....Exactly....They didn't want to pay 17 M to a guy to sit on the bench who was going to lose his job to Pat Mahomes. The guy on the bench would be the 2017 "Passer Rating Leader" and a pro bowler. .....That is why we are excited...we beleive we have someone good enough to beat out the NFL passer rating leader, etc. It was exciting drafting him...but everyone is excited when they draft a new QB...if he sucked Smith wouldn't have been traded. Not quite the same as being exicted after 2 pre season games (and yes, the fans in KC were every bit as giddy after 2 Mahomes preseason games as Bills fans are for Allen)
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1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:
ALLEN GETS THE NOD TO START BILLS' THIRD PRESEASON GAME (1:30)
Chris Mortensen explains that AJ McCarron's injury is not as serious as originally thought, and Josh Allen will be the Bills' starter in Week 3 of the preseason.
.....I count myself as one of those critics....and I will gladly back down if Allen continues to shine when he's playing in a real football game.....you all have every right and every reason to be encouraged....He has looked like a good QB prospect should look so far. I'm just not buying that a guy with his on field history has suddenly been cured of all his ailments after some workouts iwth Jordan Palmer, a training camp, and 2 preseason games....The same coach who had Carson Wentz, should have been able to identify these and fix them...and didn't or couldn't...but now he's suddenly fixed?.....IF that IS the case...then myself and a TON of others will have been completely wrong..PLUS, it would be a major major defeat of the analytics crowd who all say Allen should be a monumental bust.
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21 minutes ago, syhuang said:
Pick any big time QB then from the first round that was supposed to be somebody. Cade McNown...Jim Druckenmiller.....Joey Harrington....pick one or all....I'll go find preseason game summarys for all of them if you want....you are missing my point. Mahomes is playing vanilla defenses, who aren't discguising coverages etc..they aren't gameplanning for him...like every game 1 and 2 of preseason ever. Mahomes has looked pretty good so far....and he should. I still don't think he'll make it (I am just a nobody on a message board with an opinion) ....I'd temper my expectations until I'd seen him against some NFL defesnes who are gameplanning, playing all their starters etc. That's it...I am not saying Mahomes is Leaf or Russel or Jeff George or Jim Kelly, Aaron Rodgers etc....
This would be a great example of IRONY except that instead of fans all speculating etc....the Chiefs front office and staff drafted the guy....then having seen him for a whole year in their system, practices, preseason and 3 quarters of a no implication regular season game.....they made the statement that they have a known quantity when they traded away Alex Smith who still had a year at 17 million left on his contract. The enthusiasm for Mahomes at this point is based on something other than preseason games. The staff told everyone very loudly that know they have something when they moved on from Smith voluntarily.
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3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:
Dude you've posted all kinds of Leaf stuff lmao
Leaf had the talent to be great, but he was mentally wired wrong. So NO its not comparable. Allen has shown zero signs of being a mental ticking time bomb. Leaf didn't fall apart because the preseason is a false positive barometer to evaluate a QB, he fell apart because he was a self endulged, entitled, lil b*tch who mentally couldn't handle even an interview let alone the pressures of being a starting QB.
Its just utterly lazy to throw names like Leaf and JaMarcus around with regards to Josh. Not only is it lazy, its just flat our total nonsense.
Pick any big time QB then from the first round that was supposed to be somebody. Cade McNown...Jim Druckenmiller.....Joey Harrington....pick one or all....I'll go find preseason game summarys for all of them if you want....you are missing my point. Allen is playing vanilla defenses, who aren't discguising coverages etc..they aren't gameplanning for him...like every game 1 and 2 of preseason ever. Allen has looked pretty good so far....and he should. I still don't think he'll make it (I am just a nobody on a message board with an opinion) ....I'd temper my expectations until I'd seen him against some NFL defesnes who are gameplanning, playing all their starters etc. That's it...I am not saying Allen is Leaf or Russel or Jeff George or Jim Kelly, Aaron Rodgers etc....
1 minute ago, Lfod said:You know it's bad timing. Josh Allen is about to start his first preseason game. The bills fans are hyped. I Don't blame people for being skeptics. It's not a good time to make that argument.
You are probalby right.....I shouldn't be raining on the parade at this time.....seriously...I'd be super STOKED if I were a Bills fan having had no real QB since Kelly and this guy looks good so far.....again....I am not rooting for Allen to fail....I want him to succeed....I'd like the Bills to be a good NFL contender again.
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10 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:
@Zerovotlz you should be concerned about your own QB. Bucky Brooks review and grade for preseason week 2:
Kansas City Chiefs: Patrick Mahomes, QB. The second-year gunslinger is a "wow" playmaker, but he's still a work in progress when it comes to efficiency. Despite a pretty impressive stat line (completed 8 of 12 passes for 138 yards with a touchdown and an interception), Mahomes got away with a few questionable throws that should have been picked off by sticky-handed defenders. Now, he did fire off a 69-yard touchdown throw to Tyreek Hill that was absolutely ridiculous, but the splash play isn't enough to ignore some of the rough patches in his game. Grade: B-
This is a good assesment....Mahomes looked pretty good. One throw was AWFUL. and it was picked. The other near pick, was iffy....the WR (Watkins) should have kept moving....but you could call it either way I guess.....Mahomes had thrown a TD pass the prior play that was called back for a very tacky RT lined up off the line of scrimmage call...but that happens. Mahomes will have some moments that make you bang your head on a wall. We expect that for every one of those, he'll make some plays that make the difference in a game most of the time.....and maybe an occasiona Patomic Bomb.
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Just now, Zebrastripes said:
How am I crapping on this thread? Please let me know.
I think he meant me.
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1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:
For the last time, people need to drop the Ryan Leaf and JaMarcus Russell non sense...those guys were mental cases, not ever remotely comparable.
I'm not comparing him to those guys, or any other guys....just saying that preseason games are not very good indicators of regular season play for QB.
[Edited Title] Patrick Mahomes Looks Great
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
You all know I am biased, but as far as Watson goes, the box score stats he put up last year were very good. He was chucking balls downfield and his talented WR were making plays on the ball. You might argue Mahomes is benefitting from throwing to talented targets, making plays on the ball.
This is NOT the case. Watson is the same QB he was last year. He makes one read and either throws or looks to run. Last year when he did throw, he had a lot of bad passes get caught by his guys. He had a ton of turnovers last year as well. This year, he is the same guy, the luck on the bad passes just hasn’t been there, and he is still turnover prone.
Not only do the box score stats shine for Mahomes, if you watch the film, he goes through reads, he stands in the pocket. He keeps his eyes downfield even as pressure comes at him, and he throws accurately and has touch at the appropriate time.
when D coordinators go to look at the film they’ll see this and do what? Blitz? He has ice cold blood, he’ll stand tall and find the open man (he has insane rating under pressure). Drop 8? He’ll audible to a run or RPO. Mahomes on the range > Greatest show on turf.