SoTier

This. He seems to have figured out that he should hone what he did best, which is being a DC, and he's been very successful at it. Like many successful people in many endeavors, he's not a particularly a decent person.

Thanks for the effort it took to accumulate the stats and create the index, but I'm not sure what, if anything, it proves because you are comparing QBs from totally different eras -- and even different leagues -- as well as comparing QBs who were backups with long term starters and those that played for the Bills for more than a decade with those who played only a few games. How would Joe Ferguson, Drew Bledsoe or Doug Flutie have done if their teams had had as much talent as the Jim Kelly's teams had had? Conversely, how would Jim Kelly have fared on the 2004-2005 or the 2010-2012 Bills teams?

If you checked the scores of all the games of the top ten scoring defense teams in 2018, I'm sure you would find a similar pattern where several bad games raise the teams' average points against. The #1 Scoring Defense, the Bears, gave up 30, 31, and 38 points but still averaged 17.7 points a game. The Ravens, Titans, Texans, and Jaguars, the other top 5 scoring defense teams, had 2 games each in which they gave up 30 or more points. None of the top 5 scoring defenses gave up 40 or more points even once. Truly good defenses simply don't give up 30 or more points, much less 40+ points, in a quarter of their games.

I disagree. A more appropriate art comparison would be comparing a Renaissance masterpiece to an Impressionist or Cubist masterpiece. Different eras produce different genres with a tiny fraction of the art within each genre eventually becoming a masterpiece. What we consider "classical music" today was a tiny part of the music of its era, that part which was both intended to appeal to the aristocracy, a very sophisticated audience, and which was good enough to endure. A lot of the music that the aristocracy enjoyed at the time hasn't survived because it wasn't good enough. Ordinary people of the time listened to different music ... some of it centuries old traditional music (folk music) and some of it more modern tunes created by contemporary musicians for singing, playing, and dancing in both public and private. Almost all of the popular music from eras contemporary to classical music "masterpieces" hasn't survived, either, but some it -- especially melodies -- have become part of today's popular music.

This post is just silly. It's a perfect example of a Bills fan pretending that all is rainbows and unicorns in the Bills universe. The reality in the NFL is that ... Round 1. White is the only 2017 draftee who has developed into a truly good NFL player. However, to get him, the Bills passed on two QB prospects who seem very likely to become great QBs. Passing on a top QB prospect to take a DB prospect to replace the top DB that they didn't re-sign is easily the most "Billsy" thing about the 2017 draft. Round 2. Zay Jones remains a borderline bust. He was the fourth WR taken in 2017, and hasn't shown very much. He was only a starter last season because the Bills had nobody better in a WR corps that wasn't NFL caliber by any standard. The addition of modest FA veteran WRs may push him out of the starting lineup. Round 3. Being the best starter on one of the worst OLs -- if not the worst -- in the NFL doesn't say much about Dion Dawkins, particularly since his play regressed from "adequate" as a rookie to "poor" as a sophomore. Dawkins will have to improve significantly to remain a starter in 2019. Round 4. Matt Milano has been a decent starter on a modest defense. He's undersized, so he might or might not be a starter on most other NFL defenses. It would depend largely upon defensive scheme and talent level. He's the second best pick for the Bills in 2017. Round 5. Nathan Peterman was not merely a wasted draft pick; he was one of the few draftees taken on Day Three who could be described as a bust. Nobody really expects QBs taken in Round 5 to ever be more than an adequate backup so being bust is a special distinction, but Peterman was far worse. He was easily the most incompetent backup QB in 2017 and 2018, if not in the last decade or more. Both Dawkins and Jones are probably saved from being cut because of their lack of top competition and their low rookie contract salaries. If the Bills had better players in their units or if they were more expensive, they might both be out the door. Neither would be good enough to make numerous other NFL rosters or to be starters on most other NFL teams.

Statistically, Bills defense was 18th in the league in scoring, which puts them in the bottom half of the league. Plain and simple, too many times in 2018, the Bills defense gave up Red Zone TDs rather than holding their opponents to FGs. If the Bills are to be considered a great defense in 2019, they have to make it much harder for teams to score on them, especially in the Red Zone.

My point was that cheering an injury to a key player pn a hated rival means nothing if your own team is uncompetitive anyways. Through virtually the entirety of the twenty first century, the Bills have made their own misery, and splitting with Pats when they were swept by them would have resulted int the Bills making the playoffs only once in 2004 and it was only in 2002 that beating the Pats at least once could have given the Bills a winning season and possibly a playoff berth depending upon tie breakers.

Well, Brady's injury seemed like good news at the time but it didn't actually help the Bills. Even without Brady, the Pats beat the Bills twice and finished last in the division after losing 2-6 in the second half of the season after starting 5-3.

I would never cheer that an opposition player was injured. That would include Brady. That's just not the kind of person I am. I would applaud -- and maybe stand if it was an opposition team's star player -- as the player was taken from the field in the cart just like I would a Bills player.

It generally takes DTs who aren't high first round draft prospects about 3 years to reach their potential, so I don't think 2019 is a make or break year for Harrison, so not so much pressure. He may also play a different, "quieter" style in which he plugs holes and takes up space rather than collapses the pocket and sacks QBs. I think that Phillips needs to show solid improvement, but he could very well never "flash" and still be a good NFL DT. Remember that Kyle Williams took more than a couple of years to become first a competent DT, and then a top one.

You're actually comparing Sean McDermott's situation with the Bills in 2019 to Bill Belichick's situation with the Patriots in 2008???? Seriously? Belichick had won 3 Lombardi trophies going into 2008. Sean McDermott has 1 playoff loss in a wild card game, 9 blow out losses over 2 seasons, and virtually an entirely new offensive coaching staff because his first crop of offensive coaches were so incompetent going into 2019. I suppose in some alternative universe these two situations could be considered similar, but unfortunately, not in the one we inhabit.

I don't think Jones is under that much pressure to at least make the team simply because his competition for a WR spot is mostly UDFAs or refugees from the practice squad. I do think he needs to step up his game if he's going to stick with the Bills beyond his rookie deal, however. I think that Allen is under much more pressure than the article indicated because he's under pressure for his personal career, but his performance also impacts the team to a far greater degree than any other player. I disagree that 2019 isn't a make or break year for Allen. Young QBs who are going to become good/great QBs show that talent early on, and especially in their second seasons. If Allen doesn't play significantly better early in this season than he did late last season, that's a big red flag. If he's better early on but doesn't continue to improve his play over the season, especially in the cerebral part of the game, he's probably never going to develop into a real franchise QB. In that case, he'd likely be just another first round draft pick who gets four or five years --- possibly even a second contract as Sanchez and Tannehill did -- to prove he's not much more than an adequate backup. The Bills might win some games with that kind of QB -- Jacksonville almost went to the Super Bowl with Bortles in 2017 -- so he could still have a positive impact on the team for a time, but in the end, he'll never be the real solution for the team. So, it's a double whammy for Allen. The article -- and the thread -- is about players who are under pressure. If it were about coaches, McDermott would be at the head of the list if the offense stinks as badly as it did last season since McDermott is ultimately responsible for selecting his assistants. He can't be considered a competent HC if he hires two duds at OC within three years. He needs to return to being a DC.

So, your "big picture" is only 2017 and the first round of the 2018 draft??? FTR, I was specifically addressing the job that McDermott's done/doing as HC, not Beane, who's future as GM will likely be determined by how Allen turns out.

That's my "big picture", dude. 2000 was the last year of the remains of the Glory Years as John Butler, AJ Smith, etc left the Bills for San Diego, and Wade Phillips was sent packing. 2000 was the first year of the Drought. 2000 was the year Bill Belichick became the Patriots HC and drafted Tom Brady in the 6th round of the 2000 draft, a dramatic changing of the guard in the AFCE and NFL from the Bills dominating the AFCE and AFC for most of the decade to the Patriots dominating the AFCE, the AFC, and the NFL for two decades. You cannot claim that the current regime is somehow "different from" previous regimes unless you actually know what those previous regimes did. I'm sorry that you don't like the fact that the record of the current regime hasn't been significantly better than previous ones but facts are pesky things when they contradict the favored story line. No, I answered a poster claiming I didn't "see the big picture". I could say I'm sorry that you don't like that but I'd be lying. I don't care if you like it or not. The Bills history over the last twenty years is NOT POSITIVE in any way, shape or form. Unless or until McDermott proves he's not another poor/mediocre HC, he's no better than his predecessors. I'm not proud. I'll gladly admit that McDermott is a good HC when he proves he's better than his predecessors but I'm not giving him kudos for being no better than Ryan, Marrone or Gailey. It's time for McDermott to prove it. Even a blind squirrel gets lucky and finds a nut occasionally. Andy Dalton threw a 49 yard TD pass to Tyler Boyd on 4th and 12 with 44 seconds left in the game, knocking the Ravens out of the playoffs and putting the Bills in ... on tie breakers. Ummm... not true. John Overdorf continues to manage the Bills contracts and cap situation so that the Bills continue to be unable to "afford" to re-sign most of the top young veterans they develop. If Josh Allen actually develops into a top NFL QB, Bills fans had best hope that the Bills resident "cap genius" retires before that happens because if the Bills couldn't afford to keep their best young vets when they didn't have a franchise QB, they'll either let Allen walk away or strip the team of talent first. Russ Brandon was in charge of the team from 2006 through 2017. In those twelve seasons, the team went 75-117 (.392), had 2 winning seasons, and a single one and done playoff "run". Prior to Pegula's buying the team, Brandon's team won only 43 of its 117 games (.368) , had 1 winning season, and no playoff appearances at all. Why did Pegula keep Brandon when he sent almost all of the rest of Wilson's FO hangers-on packing? Why did he promote Brandon to a position in which he ran both the Bills and the Sabres, Pegula's other hapless, non-winning team? Except for Brandon making moves on the wrong female staff member, he'd STILL be in charge of both teams. Maybe that screams Pegula cares about winning to you, but it sure as hell doesn't to me, but I'm sure you'll find some "logical" reason for keeping and promoting Brandon other than his infamous ability to put butts in the seats. Nobody who's been critical of the McDermott/Beane regime has been demanding 10 wins, and most aren't even demanding 9 wins. I certainly haven't. Why is it NOT realistic to expect that with much better talent and a more experienced young QB, a competently coached team can win 2 more games than the previous 6 win season if there are no catastrophic injuries that derail the team? McDermott was responsible for that "stripped down team" because he wanted to replace players he didn't like with "his guys" ... and yeah, I included 2017. Why not? It's not like a 9-7 season and making a wild card slot on a tie-breaker over another 9-7 team is such a monumental accomplishment that it was all that special -- except to desperate Bills fans. Since the Bills reverted to form, record wise, in 2018, it's on McDermott to prove that 2018 was the exception and 2017 was the norm.

Really???? A summary of the Bills record since 2000 shows this record ... In 2000 the Bills won 8 games but went 3-13 in 2001. In 2002 the Bills won 8 games but went 6-10 in 2003. In 2004 the Bills won 9 games but went 5-11 in 2005. Between 2006 and 2013, the Bills failed to win more than 7 games in a season. In 2014 the Bills won 9 games and then 8-8 in 2015 but then 7-9 in 2016. In 2017 the Bills won 9 games but they went 6-10 in 2018. The "big picture" of the Bills organization over the past two decades has been one of losing seasons infrequently interrupted by a handful of non-losing ones. The Bills only managed to put together back-to-back non-losing seasons in 2014 and 2015 when Marrone coached the team to 9-7 and Ryan coached the team to 8-8. Their only playoff appearance occurred in 2017. Bills HCs since 2000 ... 2000 Wade Phillips, 8-8 2001-2003 Gregg Williams, 17-21 2004-2005 Mike Mularkey, 14-18 2006-2009 Dick Jauron, 24-33 2009 Perry Fewell, 3-4 2010-2012 Chan Gailey, 16-32 2013-2014 Doug Marrone, 15-17 2015-2016 Rex Ryan, 15-16 2016 Anthonly Lynn, 0-1 2017-2018 Sean McDermott, 15-17 Dick Jauron also had a plan, significant control of the roster, and tried to create a team which fit his plan. Unfortunately, his plan was seriously flawed. In some ways, McDermott's insistence of building a team that fits his plan -- specifically preferring attitude and effort over talent -- echoes Jauron's plan. McDermott's issues with his offensive assistants, including his OCs, echo Jauron's poor choices for offensive coaches. The 2017 Bills that made the playoffs was not a team that fit Sean McDermott's plan; it had been built by Doug Whaley to fit the "plans" of Doug Marrone and Rex Ryan with McDermott's "plan" tacked on to it. McDermott owns the 6-10 2018 and he'll own the 2019 team because the rosters were/are filled with players he picked to fit his plan. So, if his plan is worth continuing on with, it has to show results this season. Beane went out and got him more talent on the offense as well as adding some nice youngsters for the defense. I don't think that's enough for the team to challenge NE or SD or KC but they should be good enough to win at least as many games as they lose (8-8). The offensive assistants, including OC Brian Daboll, need to do better. The defense also needs to step up, especially against the run, and especially late in games. McDermott needs to do better. He needs to produce wins not losses masked as "moral victories", ie not getting blown out by NE or losing a close game in the closing seconds because the defense can't make a clutch play when it needs it. It's put up or shut up time.

The last time I looked, HCs are responsible for the performance of the defense, offense, and special teams. If the 2019 offense is again poor with a healthy Josh Allen, the buck does NOT stop with Brian Daboll. McDermott will have struck out with 2 OCs as well as most of his offensive assistants in just 3 seasons. How does this suggest in any way that McDermott is going to get any better at it if he gets more time??? As for Beane, if Allen does not show significant progress towards becoming a competent NFL starting QB -- if he's making the same mistakes, if he continues to run too much, if he doesn't improve his short passing game and decision making etc -- that seriously suggests he's going to be a bust. Surrounding a bust with all the talent in world cannot make him a good QB. Mahomes would have shown himself a good QB in 2018 if he'd had had half the offensive talent around him. Mark Sanchez and Christian Ponder played for very talented teams that actually made the playoffs despite their poor QBs. Spending a fortune in draft capital to draft a bust can get any GM fired. They DID ask Incognito to take a pay cut, however, which may or may not have contributed to his psych problems. They also traded away Cordy Glenn -- and don't give me this "he was injury prone" excuse because they went out and signed Morse who also is allegedly "injury prone". They also might have addressed the OL in the 2018 draft before the end of the fifth round when they finally got around to drafting Wyatt Teller. How can NFL professionals NOT realize the importance of having a good OL, especially when they've sunk a fortune in a rookie QB???? I see the big picture just fine. I see that the Bills under McDermott and Beane bear a depressing resemblance to previous failed Bills regimes despite a change at the ownership level. I see a team that three years into a new regime isn't significantly more talented than it was in 2016 and probably even be less so, and which remains uncompetitive with the elite teams in the NFL. IOW, I don't see much progress at this point. Maybe the 2019 season changes that with the development of young players from the last three drafts along with the addition of key FAs, but it's time for the current regime to produce results not promises.

I'm not sure what you consider a failure. Obviously, you have much more tolerance for poor performance than I do, because going 6-10 the season after a playoff appearance screams "FAIL!" to me. IMO, McDermott has completely used up any and all of his free passes. Because of league parity imposed by the salary cap, good coaching is essential. Part of being a good NFL HC is hiring good assistants. That's why certain HCs produce winners anywhere and everywhere they go and create "coaching trees" of former assistants who go on to become good HCs on their own. McDermott's assistants on offense and special teams have been disasters. That's what happens in almost any endeavor when you rely on nepotism to fill key positions. Many of his personnel decisions have been questionable at best ... Peterman and Jones from the 2017 draft are most notable. McDermott puts a better product on the field -- ie, minimum 8 wins -- or he deserves to be unemployed for 2020. As for Beane, at least he's not saddled with the 2017 draft but the only thing that he's done positive is go "all in" on a QB. His fate will be determined by Josh Allen's success or failure, and at least he has tried to improve Allen's supporting cast this season which gives the kid at least a chance to succeed.

You have repeatedly questioned my fandom since I dared to question the belief among many posters here that McDermott and Beane walk on water. I simply chose not to respond to your posts in recent months until this one.

I never wish any player to fail, whether they once played for the Bills, currently play for the Bills or never played for the Bills. Even as poor a player as Bennie Anderson or Nathan Peterman. Even as hated a player as Tom Brady. Furthermore, don't even pretend that you know anything about me or my motivations. Contrary to your continual slander, I have never wished for the Bills to lose or do badly. Unlike yourself, however, I no longer blindly believe that the people who run the team --- from ownership down to assistant coaches -- know what they're doing -- and the team's record since John Butler left all the way to the present support my cynicism that the current regime is somehow different from the failed previous ones, including the 2018 offensive horror show. I don't need to hope that Watkins lights up the league just to find "ammunition" to criticize the McDermott/Beane regime's personnel moves. All I have to do is point to Stephon Gilmore, Robert Woods, and Ronald Darby ...as well as Kelvin Benjamin, Jordan Matthews, and AJ McCarron plus the entire mismanagement of the QB situation in 2018 starting with determining that they were going to draft a first round QB but not bothering to hire a QB coach with any experience as a QB coach in the last 30 years.

Watkins' two teams since he was traded were loaded at WR, so he was never his QB's favorite target. In LA, Cooper Kupp and Robert Woods were already established as Goff's go-to guys before Watkins joined the team. In KC, Tyreek Hill was already established as the Chiefs' #1 WR. Currently Hill's status is in limbo. If Hill is suspended for some or all of the season, Watkins will likely become Mahomes' primary target, and he could very well "set the league on fire" in 2019.

The history of the NFL is littered with QBs with tremendous physical talent who busted because they lacked the right psychological make up to enable them to succeed. JP Losman always comes to mind when I think of a QB with great talent who just couldn't make the right play under pressure. I think your description of why Fitzpatrick always ends up throwing INTs in key situations is perfect. While Nate Peterman doesn't fit the scenario of having "tremendous physical talent" he has enough physical talent that he probably could have a productive career as an NFL backup QB if only he could keep himself from getting baited into trying to throw passes he can't possibly complete except to a defender in game action. I'm convinced that's why Peterman can look so great in practice and even look decent in preseason games but comes apart in regular season games. Allen doesn't seem to be saddled with the bad decision making that derailed Losman or that derails Fitzpatrick and Peterman but it's entirely possible -- very likely in fact -- that if or how well Allen can change/overcome his own psychological limitations will impact his success in the NFL. Being physically able to throw accurate short passes is likely not one of Allen's problems, but being able to consistently throw short when his natural inclination is to chuck it downfield may very well be a serious problem for him. Every young QB faces the same issue of overcoming psychological inclinations, so it's not something unique to Allen. The ultimate "intrangible" -- psychological limitations/inclinations -- is what makes finding franchise QBs so difficult.

A five year rebuild may very well be ridiculous in today's NFL -- if the ownership is dedicated to having a winning team. In the last twenty years, teams going from bottom feeders -- non playoff teams of various quality -- to playoff teams within two or three years has become a benchmark for judging rebuilds. Really good organizations not only field playoff teams within two or three years of bringing in a new coaching regime, they frequently make the Super Bowl within 3 or 4 years. Teams that fail to make significant progress quickly in a rebuild don't ever seem to quite get there. The problem may be the ownership, FO, coaching staff or the lack of a franchise QB or poor personnel decisions in general or any combination, but "incremental rebuild" seems to be a euphemism for "perpetual rebuild mode" that teams like Buffalo, Cleveland, Detroit, Miami, and New York Jets have been in seemingly forever even if said teams occasionally make playoff appearances. I agree that the Bills personnel, especially on offense, doesn't match up very well with the top teams in the league. They've added talent, but they started out with almost none on offense and added pretty modest veteran talent except for perhaps Morse, so regularly competing with the big guns doesn't seem realistic at this point. I don't think that can be an excuse, however, for them not making significant improvement in 2019. I think a losing record with a healthy Josh Allen for all or almost all of the season raises all kinds of red flags that the current regime isn't all that different from previous regimes.

I don't owe Wawrow any apology. I criticized his article because I felt that he was simply repeating "the company line" from the Bills FO and he took exception to that. That's fine. It's a discussion. Since then, however, he's personally insulted me at least twice. He's also personally insulted/attacked other posters who dared criticize his views. In this thread, he's repeatedly wrapped himself in his professional connections/knowledge when making his case for his views, but he's repeated sunk to ad hominem attacks on those who disagree with his views. That's most unprofessional. PS -- I'm not surprised that you're taking up his cause since you, too, apparently have difficulty with opinions that don't mirror your own.

The Bills weren't any better prepared to cultivate a QB last season when they drafted Allen. David Culley, the QB coach, hadn't coached QBs in thirty years. It was just another part of the total mismanagement of the QB position in 2018 despite having invested so much in a first round QB. Obviously, the truth hurts. LOL.

^^^ Well, before Allen gets to prove he's better than Mahomes or Watson, he'll have to prove that he's a bonafide NFL starting QB, something that he's not done yet. Personally, I don't think the Bills have nearly enough offensive talent on the sidelines or on the field to enable him to do more in 2019 than prove 1) he's not a bust and maybe 2) that he could become a very good QB in the future. What's vapid is continually demanding "accountabiilty" from players and assistant coaches but constantly making excuses for bad decisions from the ownership, GM and HC.