Shaw66

Fair enough. It's not worth arguing about, but I'd suggest that if Elway's game had been under control earlier, the Broncos would have won more, and might very well have been on your list of great teams. In his first ten seasons, Elway's passer rating was in the 80s once; every other season he was in the 70s or worse. For his final six seasons he was in the 90s twice and mid- to high-80s the other four. Someone got his game his game under control. Not coincidentally, when Dan Reeves left, Elway improved. Some will argue, see, the head coach needs to go when the star QB is underperforming, but Reeves was, of course, an offensive coach. When your HC is a defensive coach, then you need the right OC and you need a HC who gives the OC the reins. I may as well say it before others do: Or you need a HC who is an offensive guy.

I'll argue just with the thread title, as it's a little too hard to follow the OP. Allen is, in fact, Michael Jordan and not Scotty Pippen. Allen has transcendent physical skills, just like MJ. Allen is Michael Jordan before Phil Jackson. Jordan thought he was going to win by being the greatest player ever, when in fact he only became the greatest player ever when he had a coach who harnessed his talents in a winning system. That is exactly where the Bills are with Allen. Give Allen an effective offense that he can execute, and the Bills will win like Jordan's Bulls.

Yes, Bob, Josh has done all the things you complain about, but that's Josh. That's what the coaches have to work with. We've seen Josh NOT throw into double coverage, NOT ignore the underneath routes, STAY in the pocket, throw with TOUCH. We've seen him throw accurately. We've seen him do EVERYTHING a great QB does. He CAN do it, without question. I have said almost since Josh arrived that of all the great QBs, Josh is most similar to Elway. Premier physical talent - in fact, Josh is physically better that Elway was. Elway didn't win Super Bowls until the end of his career, because coaches failed to get him and his game under control. The answer is not to say that Josh makes mistakes, because without more that implies that the Bills should move on from him. The Bills should not move on from transcendent talent. Every great QB needs to be managed. Elway, Favre, even Manning. The only answer is to get coaches who can help him realize his greatness. Josh needs to be coached and managed. He is a supreme talent, and he can and should be executing an offense that is dominant in the league. It's up to McDermott and his offensive coordinator to reach that objective.

I think it's very clear just watching. Allen was spectacular earlier in the season. It was so clear - the offense was generating open throwing opportunities on schedule, Allen knew where they were, and he delivered the ball easily and accurately. For the past five weeks, either the opportunities weren't there, or Allen didn't know where to find them. Either way, that's on the coordinator (and not the QB coach). The coordinator has to figure out how to attack this week's defense in a way that can be managed by the QB. That's his job, and that wasn't happening. The simple comparison is the Chiefs. Reid always has an attack designed to work against this week's defense, and his QB is prepared to implement the plan. Yes, even Reid and the Chiefs don't get it right all the time, but they do often enough, and we all see it. What did Dorsey do to attack the Broncos? So far as I could tell, all he did was put Diggs in motion all day long. And what did that accomplish? Hard to say; it certainly didn't create mismatches that Diggs could take advantage of. Again, the way the Bills will have big success if by having an offense that can be executed by one of the most talented QBs of all time. If Allen and the offense were humming the way it should, we wouldn't be having these conversations, because the Bills would be on top of the league.

Agreed. And I'll give you a simple example that I didn't include in my essay yesterday, but that bothers me a lot. I said in the off-season that Allen and Dorsey had to be better. I said in particular that Allen had to get his completion percentage up, because the real measure of good offense is percentage of positive plays. Every incompletion is not a positive play. And so, in the beginning of the season, after the Jets, Allen's completion percentage was leading the league and he and the Bills were absolutely killing it on offense. Why? Because Allen was reading the defense and going to where the open man was supposed to be. That often was to the back, over the middle or in the flat. It was working great. But in recent weeks, defenses have figure out how to limit the effectiveness of those short throws. One play in particular was a two-yard completion over the middle to Murray Monday night. Two yards, and the defender was right on him. And the throws in the flat are getting them nothing, too. Well, if the defenses have adjusted to that strategy, then there must be other areas of the field to attack. If the linebackers are staying close to the LOS to stop the outlet passes, there are openings somewhere else. Dorsey's job was to know where those openings are, to install plays that take advantage of those openings, and give Allen the reads to decide quickly where the ball should go. Instead, what did we get? We got things like Allen throwing an interception on a deep out pattern to Davis, a play Allen and Davis had great success with two years ago, but a play defenses have long since shut down. Allen should have known that throw was not open, and he should have had open options elsewhere, option he understood and could find. And for the second week in a row, we saw Allen and Davis miscommunicate on a back-shoulder opportunity, with Davis stopping and Allen air-mailing it deep. Things like that shouldn't be happening to an experience QB and an experienced receiver, and it was Dorsey's job to be sure they weren't happening. Everyone can see the same thing: If you have a QB as talented as Josh Allen, you should be winning some Super Bowls. And the way you should be winning Super Bowls is with a top-five offense. That's how McVay won, and that's how Reid has won. Daboll was giving the Bills an offense that was at least within shouting distance of the top five. The Bills hoped Dorsey would continue and build on what Daboll started. He didn't. Obviously, those who say Dorsey was the wrong hire from the beginning are correct. It was a mistake. There were those who said he should have been fired after a year, and they were correct, too. We can discuss whether McDermott was late to pull the plug on Dorsey, but that's just a question of times. GMs and HCs make mistakes all the time, and mistakes are not the reason to fire them. Performance is the reason. This season is the first season where the Bills have underperformed, and the underperformance is tied directly to the failure of the offense to be top 10 or better.

You really can't see the answer to your own question. If Dorsey had been that guy, and the Bills had been scoring 30 points a game, they'd have two losses, or fewer, this season, and no one except the most pig-headed Bills fans would be complaining about whatever boneheaded decisions you seem to think McDermott makes. After Monday night, I won't argue with the people who say McDermott isn't getting his team prepared properly. The penalty at the end of the game is in the same category as 13 seconds and several others, where his team just wasn't prepared to execute. I get that. But, as I said, if the Bills had the kind of offense they should have with Allen, Diggs, Davis, Kincaid, and Cook, this morning they would be 8-2 or better and be a favorite to make the Super Bowl. I'll take that all day, any day.

Oh, yes. I agree that firing Dorsey is an admission by McDermott (and I'm sure he understands it) that his choice of OC was wrong. I don't agree it was desperation. It was the right move by an executive. There was no upside keeping Dorsey, and there was clear downside. There was no downside in firing him, and there is clear upside, if for no other reason than you get to try out Brady for the job. I don't know if McDermott is desperate, and I don't know how you'd know, either. I mean, has Terry told McDermott he's out if he doesn't get to the AFC championship this year? Has McDermott told his wife to expect to be moving our of Buffalo after the first of the year? I don't think so, but I don't know.

And when I posted, I knew it was just my opinion, too. I understand that people feel differently. The real point is that right now, in the middle of November and at 5-5, firing Dorsey was the right move. The idea that he was a scapegoat is silly - Dorsey demonstrably was not succeeding at his job. I don't believe McDermott should be shown the door any time soon, but I know others think differently. Whether one likes McDermott or not, firing him now makes no sense. There's no one to take over the head coaching job now, because there's no OC and no DC. Why don't I believe McDermott should be replaced? Well, as I said earlier, he has one of the best records of all active coaches in the league, and the chances are that whoever replaces him will be worse, not better. Sure, we all can point to things he could have done differently, starting with Mahomes, but it makes no sense to point to those things and ignore the fact that he a took a team with a historic losing record for twenty years and turned into a perennial playoff team (except maybe this season). I'm not prepared to unload quickly someone with that kind of record.

Yes, that's true. The alternative is to hire an OC-HC, if you can find the right one, but then you have the same problem on the defensive side. The fact that it will be hard to hire and keep a successful OC is more or less a given, unless you fire McDermott to keep the OC. I'm really not here to defend McDermott. I just think at this point in this season, the only move that made sense was the one they made. Dorsey was failing and gone at the end of the season. May as well try out Brady. Well, I'm not sure McBeane won't make the same mistake twice. Ralph Wilson made the same mistakes for decades. It's not a given that McBeane will succeed, and they've given us reason to doubt them.

I was with you to the end. As I just said, he hired Daboll, so why is it that the Bills won't get another good coordinator? Good for you, truly, that you knew Dorsey wasn't the right guy, but the fact that you were right about one OC and McDermott was wrong doesn't mean that McDermott can't hire and thrive with a good OC.

If I'm an up and coming coach and I get a chance to be Josh Allen's offensive coordinator, I'm taking it in a heartbeat. Jon Gruden rode Brett Favre to a great career - not with Favre, but that's how he built his reputation. Hiring one isn't going to be the problem. Finding the right one is the problem. Eventually, yes. I don't think he's there yet. He hired Daboll, and that worked out fine. So, he's one for two.

I can respect that opinion, and I can't argue with it. I have confidence the man will continue to get better. But I'll admit that my confidence has been shaken. Good criticisms of McDermott. Thanks.

Boston Globe writer Ben Volin says it’s “scapegoat season” in Buffalo, with Ken Dorsey being the latest scapegoat (less than a year after Leslie Frazier was the scapegoat). That "scapegoat" crap is what commercial journalists drag out every time a team fires a coordinator in mid-season. (It's like dragging out the "rust" discussion every time one baseball team sweeps and then has to wait a week or more to play again. At least rust is a real thing; this scapegoating is not.) They say it because some portion of the fan base believes the head coach should be fired; identifying Dorsey as a “scapegoat” (without proof, of course) proves, doesn’t it, that McDermott is the real problem. These headhunters imply that the Head Coach should understand he's the problem and - what - fire himself? Quit? The journalist doesn't necessarily believe it, but saying that the OC is simply a scapegoat is playing to the people who want the head coach out, and not journalism. So, I think Volin is taking a simple, hackneyed way out instead of doing his readers a favor by explaining what's really going on. The reality is that a lot of people who understand the Bills had the same view of the team as I did in preseason - that the defense would be solid, and the success of the team would be measured by the success of the offense. Success of the offense depended on (1) Dorsey running a good offense, and (2) Allen executing it. We're now seeing those two questions being answered. In other words, if the Bills were going to have a difficult season in 2023, the most likely reason was exactly what we're seeing. The team's defense has been decimated with injuries, but even so, they've kept the Bills in games. They are middle of the league average in yards allowed per game, but they are fifth in the league in points allowed per game. It's actually quite an accomplishment that McDermott as HC and DC has built a defense that is somehow surviving the injuries and still making opponents work hard to get something. It's the offense that has disappointed, not the defense. Allen is not performing well, and it's possible he's lost focus, hit a wall, or something, but that's less believable than he running this offense well. He still can make all the throws better than anyone ever, but he isn't making them. Sometimes he seems not to be decisive, and yes maybe he just can't master reading defenses and executing the offense. But, it doesn't look like that's true, and even if it is, no one is going to give up yet on his talent. He's a generational talent, and it's just a stupid play to trade him for a boatload of picks and players, or whatever. So, that means, one way or the other, Dorsey is the problem. Either Dorsey is failing to design a quality NFL passing offense, or he's failing at training Allen to execute. If he's failing in design, you have to move on to someone else. If his offense is fine and he can't get Allen to execute, then, again, you have to move on, because you're committed to Allen long term, and you need to find an OC who can harness Allen's talent. Dorsey's offense last season didn't look good as the season wore on. He picked up from where Daboll had left off, but he failed to build the offense further (and he has more to work with than Daboll had). Still, it was clear to me that he is a talented guy, and it was his rookie year. If you believed in his potential, you needed to give him another year to see. If you didn't believe in his potential, then you shouldn't have hired him in the first place. Now, ten games into the season, the Bills are five and five. The offense, after an early season explosion, with Allen looking all-worldly, is getting stopped consistently by most every defense they see. Whatever it takes to be a good offensive coordinator, whatever creativity it takes to keep tweaking your offense as the opponents tweak their defenses, whatever that is, Dorsey doesn't seem to have it. In his second season, his opportunity to prove the brass wise, he is looking somewhat less capable than in his rookie year. This team is now top-10 in yards and points per game, but they've fallen way off from their league-leading production in the first four or five weeks. Now, they are struggling, visibly and statistically. But even if they plateau around the top-10, that is NOT the expectation with this offense. The whole point is that with a talent like Allen, top-10 simply isn't enough. If your offense with Allen isn't top-3, then your offense is failing. (That’s true if injuries weren’t a problem, and Dorsey hasn't had many injuries. In fact, I think he started the same offensive line for all ten games.) Are there other problems with the Bills? For sure, and that was completely apparent against the Broncos. The special teams had three really bad plays, the final being an inexcusable procedural penalty that cost them the game. The defense seems to be getting gashed for the big play more frequently, and it is bending a lot and breaking sometimes. But, as noted, the injuries are serious - their best safety, their best corner, their best linebacker, their best interior defensive lineman ALL are out for the season. (And their best edge rusher (Von Miller) has not yet recovered to anything like what he was. He said he was going to play early, and he is playing. But it's common to take more than a year to recover from an ACL, and he's right on schedule. We might not see the real Von Miller again until next season.) Look at the scores in the Bills' losses: 22-16, 25-20, 29-25, 24-18, 24-22. It's a team that has a defense that keeps the Bills in games, despite their injuries. It's a team should have a top-5 offense with Allen but instead has an offense putting up numbers that are no better than ordinary. And finally, is it possible that for some reason (personality, ego, whatever) McDermott will never allow an offensive coordinator the freedom necessary to run the offense? In other words, is McDermott the problem? Well, yes, sure, that's possible. But the question is the same as with Dorsey: did you believe in him when you hired him, and do you believe in him now? When the guy has put together winners like he has, it's hard not to believe in him for a while longer. He's intensely committed to winning. So, yes, maybe the problem is McDermott, but let's say we bet: You can bet on the future career of the second-season offensive coordinator whose offense isn't getting it done; I'll take the future career of the fifth-winningest coach (%) among all active NFL coaches, behind, LaFleur, Belichick, Reid, and Tomlin and ahead of McCarthy, Harbaugh, Carroll, and McVay. (Oh, and total wins among active coaches? He's ninth, ahead of McVay, Shanahan, Vrabel, and Lafleur.) So, no, Mr. Boston Globe, sir, moving Dorsey out of there in mid-season has nothing at all to do with some "scapegoat" nonsense; it is, in fact, the logical decision under the circumstances. Maybe with a change, you can find a way to salvage the season, but whatever happens, you know now Dorsey won't be the guy in 2024. If he's not the guy next season, then at a minimum you can try out someone from your staff to see if he might be the guy. GO BILLS!!! The Rockpile Review is written to share the passion we have for the Buffalo Bills. That passion was born in the Rockpile; its parents were every-day people of western New York who translated their dedication to a full day’s hard work and simple pleasures into love for a pro football team.

I'm hopeful. McDermott is a fighter, and his team will fight. Its a long season, and we're getting into the stretch that really matters. Dotson and Williams have to step up. (I'm out of touch - is Bernard playing?) Offensive line has to step up, too. The season isn't over, not by a long shot.

Oh, so that's what happened. I was there and confused like you. That play was obvious miscommunication between receiver and quarterback, and calling that intentional grounding is ridiculous. There was nothing intentionally about that ball falling incomplete. Its absurd to call that and not to call the 5-yard line drives thrown at the feet of screen receivers. That's pitiful.

I came on here to just throw a few thoughts out there. I was at the game. These are the first two points, and as you suggest, they may the only two things that really matter. It's basic football - if you have evenly matched teams, turnovers will play a big role in the outcome. Kincaid fumble was a real killer. Allen badly underthrew the INT. He had Davis, and it's a throw he's made many times. The defense actually did okay, holding a really good offense to 24 points. But the defense wasn't good enough to make enough stops. On the last Bengal drive, Boyd burned Johnson bad, but that's what I mean by a really good offense. When a team comes at you with three wideouts like they have, and with a QB who is one of the most accurate throwers I've even seen, you're going to give up plays. Holding them to 24 was good, especially because the Bills were playing with guys I didn't even recognize. Dodson or Williams made a really dumb play by coming on a late blitz and leaving their tight end open for the TD that was the game winner. Bernard and Milano likely would have played that right. Pass protection was weak. Allen needs to be part of the attack - his runs in the second half opened things up for the offense. Bengals fans are very nice, and they were all orange and black, but they don't make noise like Bills fans. They're pretty noisy, but not as loud or as consistently as we are. They're kind of too busy singing Sweet Caroline. And they have a stupid touchdown song. But they do have a good football team. McDermott's got a lot of work to do, patching that defense together. And to say what I've said so often for so long, I think offensively the season is on Dorsey. His quarterback should not be standing back there looking around wondering where he can find an open receiver. I thought Allen looked much better running the offense when they went no huddle last week. He seemed more engaged, he was studying the field pre-snap. Maybe they can't go no huddle in a noisy environment. Whatever it is, Allen's receivers should be getting open on schedule, and either they aren't or Allen doesn't know where to find them.

Not a lot of blue outside Paycor. It's all black and orange.

Yes. Can't thank Yolo enough. His service was fabulous.

Where's the centerfold?

Wow. Didn't occur to me that others might be having the same experience. One reason is that we traveled with family for two weeks after the game, so I didn't have time ti watch games and study posts here. I discovered I didn't miss it.

Hey, thanks for the concern. I'm fine. I seem to have turned a corner on my Bills fandom. I've been intending to do a post about it, but it's a bit of a project, and I'm travelling to Cincinnati this weekend. Since London, I missed the Bills the following week, I watched the last two games, and I watched no other pro football. I'm reading nothing about the Bills. I come here just to see if there's any news, like acquiring a corner back or a 1 Tech, but I seem to have lost interest in talking about the Bills. I just watch the games, am pleased, not so pleased, or not pleased with what I see. Then I just spend my week thinking about other things, until the next game. My one substantive thought: I think the NFL is all about building to a team that can win the playoffs. The Bills are working on building that winner. I have no idea whether they'll succeed, but the fact that they don't look dominant right now isn't something that I worry about. I did worry about before, but not since London. Either some players will step up, or they won't. If the Bills win it all, there will be great praise for all the guys who stepped up. If they get close and fail, well, someone didn't quite do what is incredibly difficult to do. Josh, Von, Diggs, Bernard, Cook, the oline, Floyd, and unnamed people all could step up. Taron Johnson had a career play in the playoffs before we understood how good he was. Maybe Benford will be that guy this season. I don't know. Every pro football team is trying to do something that is incredibly difficult - to win the Super Bowl. Every team works incredibly hard at it. Maybe the Bills will succeed, maybe they won't. I've stopped trying to figure it out. I'm just watching to see what happens.

I didn't mean that he is fearful. I just meant that before he was running too much and taking too many risks. Now he's not running when he should.

Well, I don't know about night games, but I'd say planning tailgating for a few hours is a good idea. The earlier you get there the better. After a few games it'll get sorted out, but probably not yet.

Yes, after Johnson was injured, but then he came back and was playing regularly. They were going with three lbs for tactical reasons, I think, not to save Johnson. And yes, in plays I noticed Williams more than Dotson. Flies around is right. But Dotson as quick, too. Just less instinctive, I think.

McDermott said he was on a pitch count. He was in a baseball cap on the sideline for the whole second half. I think they just wanted him to have a few live-action reps. He played like it was preseason.