Dan

I agree. I don't think a lot of people have listened to it. Why do I keep reading about Brandon? He wasn't there. The only mention of him was Whaley saying he has other responsibilities and isn't involved. Yet, somehow, Russ' name keeps getting thrown about like he was there. People are just projecting past criticisms onto the current situation. That's all. If anything I feel more positive, because he said very plainly that Russ is not involved in any way. I mean isn't that what we've all been wanting for years? I disagree. Whaley did a great job. Many people think he didn't because he gave a lot of BS answers. But that was almost certainly his intent. I do alot of press events. And for the big ones, you always have a PR person give you your "talking points". These are the answers they want you to give, and tell you at every opportunity...go back to it. That's what you say. And then sit and wait for another question. Then give the same answer. Repeat until someone tells you that to leave. The answers I bolded are almost certainly PR-provided responses that he continually came back to. There are a few others he had as well. But, I guarantee he was given these answers and probably even rehearsed types of questions and when to use them. Does it give the press the answers they want... No. Does it give the public the answers they want... No. But, it gets him out of there without doing any addtional damage... Usually. And its how all big organizations typically handle press conferences, especially likely combative ones.

I finally had time to watch the Whaley press conference. I've also read half the threads here about it. ..and all I have to say is.. Holy crap!! Talk about much ado about nothing! First of all, Whaley did a great job! He clearly had several talking points the PR people wanted him to stick to... And he did. I'm focused on winning. I was not privy to that conversation. The ownership issued a statement. Etc. etc. he stayed on point and gave the press zero additional bait. So what do they all do... Begin the spin and speculation because that's all they have. Could/should he have been more candid and discussed the inner workings and conversations? Maybe. Maybe that would have altered all this specualtion about ownerships involvement, Russ' involvement, the FO structure, etc. But, clearly, the owners and Whaley don't want that information out there and that's that. So he stone walled the press. But, of course, they still have papers to sell (or clicks to get), so they're gonna write something! But, a few points.... Whaley seemed more confident than I've ever seen him. For the first time it seems he's actually making the decisions and it's not a committee decision. We have a "football guy" running the show. Maybe he sucks. I suppose we'll find out. But, it's all on him for the first time ever, it seems. Also... What's with all the Tyrod specualtion? He clearly said... If the Bills were still in the hunt, Tyrod would have started. Period. The decision to sit him and look at EJ, was clearly a business decision. They had one game left to decide if EJ had progressed enough to stay on the roster as a backup. That's it, IMO. Why leaveTyrod in a meaningless game, risk injury and still not have an idea how far EJ had prgogressed? Yeah... People are definitely projecting past dysfunction on the current situation. I get it. It's easy. It's fun. It drives readership. But, let's see how Whaley does. This offseason is the make or break time for him.

Definitely agree! I wouldn't reach or probably even take one in the first round. But, every year it seems a good QB is found in the 2nd or 3rd time rounds. So, unless we suck dramatically and get a top 3 pick, its all a crap shoot. So... Keep shooting till you find one.

I don't have a problem with this approach at all. Our offense isn't why we lost most games... Sure it needs to improve specifically in the passing game. But no need to overhaul what isn't broke. However, I would still draft a QB ...this year and every year... Until all doubts are lifted, not only about Tyrod but also the #2. If you wait till your current QB sucks so bad you need the #1 overall pick, you're a piss poor franchise waiting to collapse.

1 and 2 are precisely what most everyone was clamoring for the final couple of weeks of the season. When the decision is made to do it... It's immediately construed as whaley wants to cut Tyrod and start EJ. You really can't please people.

I've read most of this thread and you are repeatedly defending Rex based on these stats. But the primary issue I think you're overlooking is that you're assuming Rex was fired based on the performance of the Defense alone. Rex was a HC. Schwartz is a DC. Two completely different jobs with different responsibilities, demands, and performance measures. The Bills, as a team, were disorganized and undisciplined. The team's record did not improve at all, but more so, neither did the individual attitudes, performances, or apparent understanding of what they needed to do. Add to that the poor game plans, the poor game day management, and probably discord behind the scenes (i.e. private meeting with the owner that gets you fired). That's just a few of the reasons a HC gets fired before his contract is up. Had the Bills won 10games, I'm sure a lot of stuff gets washed away. But, when you're not winning and you're dealing with all that disorganization? Something has to give. By all accounts, Rex was given all he asked for in terms of coaches, players, and control. And the result was not a better team. If anything, this team seems less cohesive than when St. Doug left! And lastly, I don't think anyone thinks that ...just plug in a new HC and we're Super Bowl bound. And few have complete faith in Whaley to get it right. But, Pegula is giving him the reigns, it appears. If he doesn't, guess who's gone next? And it doesn't seem like Pegula is going to give him 3-5 years to see. So the pressure is on him to deliver. All any of us can do.. Is hope he does. Just like we all hoped Rex would deliver. But I will applaud our owners for recognizing that the current direction wasn't the right one and making a decision based on that, and not on how much money they were about to lose.

I never really liked the Rex hire. In fact, dropped the Sunday ticket this year because I knew this year would turn out like this. Rex is ok; he gives good press conference; but the vast majority of his HC career has been marked by inconsistent, under achieving, undisciplined teams. In the end, that,s what we had for the last 2 years and I'm glad to see him go. On the the next. Let's just hope this time they get it right... A good HC.. Who hires 2 good coordinators.. Not one. And not someone who decides the team we have needs to be replaced on a 3 year plan! Other teams have turned it around in one year... Damnit so can the Bills.

IMO, it's all about the coordinators. The best teams, the most consistent teams, have a strong head coach to lead the team.. Keeping everyone on the same page, disciplined, motivated, and practicing well. We've seen the HC's try to be the offensive coordinator or the defensive coordinator. It doesn't work. So, is Lynn the right guy? I have no idea. But, if he wants to run his offense or call the plays or whatever; then I say pass. As a HC, he needs to step up to the next level and manange the ENTIRE team and stop thinking like an OC.

Absolutely disagree. Discipline, teaching fundamentals, game day adjustments are just a couple of the ways a coach ..directly.. affects the players on the field

The offense make the defense do pushups all half time... Obviously they're too tired from our bad offense.

The defense is close.

I'm not good enough to know if Whaley or the rest of the FO actually know what they're doing. So, I can't speak too much to all that. Other than to say... At some point you are what your record says you are. And the Bills under Whaley et al. struggle to win 9 games and have yet to make the playoffs. At some point... You gotta hold people accountable, right or wrong. Regarding Rex and the coaching staff... I didn't like the hire then and I don't like him now. His hallmark is an undisciplined, sloppy team. And that's exactly what we have. Players getting suspended, getting days off from practicing, cheap penalties, mistakes, and lack of focus.... That's how I best describe this team. And it all stems from the head coach. I got no problem with Rex getting shown the door, I would have done it after last season's complete fail. Tyrod.... I want to like him. But, in the end, he just doesn't see the field well enough and is just inconsistent enough to cost us games. Yeah, he's good and the offense scores and all, but how many times have we needed a pass on 3rd down just to watch the ball sail or see him scramble. At some point, he has to make defenses pay. Rarely does he do it. I'm torn. I want a better QB, but he geniuinely seems to care and does do a lot of stuff good. Pretty much every other player and position on the team... See my comments on Rex. Get a new coach and many of them would turn it around. I firmly believe that. Are they all pro bowlers? No. But few teams if any have more than a couple of 3-4 true stars. The rest are role players that perform when needed. A perfect example of that is Woods. He's not Watkins, but he doesn't have to be. He just needs to be the safety valve when Watkins is doubled. We have plenty of those players. They just need a coaching staff to keep them focused, healthly and playing with a solid game plan. So, to the OP's point.... yeah, we've beat bad teams and lost to good teams. Occasionally, everyone plays tough for Rex. But can they do that consistently, week after week? Rex's teams have never done that. Do I want the whole team blowed up after the season... No. Do I want Rex gone... Yes. Other coaches have shown that you can come in and win in the 1st year. We're close, we just need to find the guy that can do that... and maybe a QB that can actually throw downfield with some accuracy. Or see if Tyrod needs glasses (ala the Wild thing).

Exactly. That's my question.... So our chances hinge on the Jags beating TN? If so... We might as well call it over now.

They could fire the GM, the scouting staff, and coaches... Set up a poll here of who to draft and have 1 of several posters here submit game plans each week, and make the play call. ..and I honestly think they'd do better. It defies the laws of nature that they can go this long without finding a competent QB or figure out how to string together enough wins to make the palyoffs. So, you ask for a name... I say they jsut need to pull their heads out of their asses and do what we all know needs to be done.

For me... The bolded part is what this loss put on clear display. I kinda half expected a loss, even started a thread suggesting that a loss today doesn't necessarily mean the season is over. But, here we are at 6-6 and more often than not, even in half our wins, we all end up with tangs of this feeling in out guts. This is not a disciplined team. It's the team Rex has has put together, the defense he wants to run, the QB he wanted... And this is what we are. Undisciplined, full of holes, and mediocre record. I have no reason to have confidence that Rex will suddenly figure it all out. 2:50 left in the first half, up by 4... What do you do? Go into a shell and piss away a possession. On the flip side, the Raiders get the ball with 30 seconds... What do they do? ...throw the damn ball down the field and get a FG to end the half. Pretty much pathetic.

To your first point, yes I would agree. When Tyrod won the starting job last year, it was obvious. He was a better QB and looked far more poised and prepared to lead the team. So, I wasn't then nor am I now, pining for EJ or some other QB. But, I will say, Tyrod's level of play seems to have leveled off this year when I was hoping he would continue to improve. Lots of really good QBs have bad halves, even bad games. But, the good ones turn it around and keep fighting. I give EJ a lot of credit for doing just that. Yes, he deserves a lot of blame for losing that game. But, the defense deserves a lot, as well. I know it's gotta be a black and white world, but can't we live in a world where even the worst players, like EJ, are capable of doing something right? I'm not saying EJ should get a shot here, I'm just suggesting that he's not the complete trainwreck so many people say he is.

I have to agree with a lot of this. I like Tyrod. I want him to be THE answer. And he's certainly the best starting QB the Bills have had in quite some time. However.... The offense goes into a shell far too often and has serious issues converting 3rd and long. That, IMO, is when the QB earns his money. He makes great plays with his legs and occasionally with his arm. But, all too often, he misses the throw on 3rd down. And I find myself wondering why we never hit receivers in stride? So, I like him. But, I'm still waiting to see how the final games play out before I go all in. What I'm afraid of the most, is he's one of these guys that does just enough to look good at times and get your hopes up, but never really puts it all together to consistently put wins together. But, to be fair, EJ played a really good 2nd half, threw for 2TDs, and left the field with the lead. That loss was not all on him, it was the very definition of a team loss.

Agreed. But one thing you can be sure of... Everyone always wants more money. So whether you have part time refs, with great full time careers, or full time refs with with lower overall salaries... They're susceptible to bribes. IMO, it's less about the quality of the salary they make and more about the quality of man they hire.

Simplification of the rule book certainly is a big part of it. The fact that no one can tell you what a catch is anymore is all you need to reference for that. But, also, there's no consistency with the penalties? The "hit" on Bradford's head on thursday night, should not be a penalty (in my opinion). But because the rule is you can't touch the QBs head in any fashion, and they've called roughing the passer when a defender whispers too close to Brady, makes it an egregious over sight by the ref that likely cost the Vikings the game. I think the overly complicated rules, allow for two things... Inconsistency in their enforcement and lack of focus for the refs. That is, the refs are so busy looking for all the various nuisanced penalties that they miss blatantly obvious things. Combine those two and it's hard not to think the league is fixing games. The only other conlusion is that the refs are patently incompetent. Maybe neither is true but when you watch a game and see wildly inconsistent, ticky tack flags, it's hard to draw any other conclusion. So I say, simply the penalties and combine that with full time refs that can work on consistently applying the rules.

I've been saying this for years. Find a dozen or so plays that your players can execute at a high level. Then change the formations and personel to disguise those dozen or so plays. But keep it simple, do what you do best, and don't be predicitable with package plays and formations.

Ahhhh.... Makes sense. I didn't realize they were doing walk throughs. Shows ya what I get for thinking before I have a full load of coffee.

Do they still say... Practice like you play. ? I just wonder if the best teams in the league also practices where it looks like the players are half walking through their routes?

Not a problem. I guess your attitidue (amd mine) comes with age. There's more to it that just wins and losses. Sure, winning is what its all about. But, at some point its about the whole journey as well. The memories. The cheering and hoping with family. The pride of being a Bills fan. Its why we're all here. Maybe the Bills will win out, maybe they'll lose out. But, honestly, after week 2...who would have thought we'd be in December still with a shot? I, for one, thought the season was done and was looking at potential new coaches. It's been a crazy season... And we got at least 5 more games to go!

Absolutely, great perspective and attitude. Thank you.

Interesting... Am I reading that correctly? The Raiders and Dolphins games are most important to our playoff hopes. Loses to either of them lowers our percentage the most. That is definitely how the Bills typically do it! The last two weeks are showing me that the Bills are starting to change their ways and not lose those kinda games. Granted, they don't make it look easy. But they didn't lay down against the Jags, they fought hard and pulled out a solid win.