K-9

Who’s at a dead end? The debate about whether the GM is doing a good job is a fluid situation. Imo, it’s a mixed bag at this time. Having perspective about not getting upset about things of out of your control, is a foundation of grownup thinking, whereas ranting and raving or otherwise getting upset is childish. Pretty simple concept. Can you refer me to a post of mine where I’ve said “what does it matter?” I’m sure I have at times, but in this discussion I don’t recall. And if I’m gonna be called out for it, I’d appreciate some context before I respond. Marrone and Dareus are probably spooning to it as we speak.

Not a question of good and bad. Just necessary, unfortunately. Some situations become untenable over time. Maybe “y’all” should acquaint yourself with the volumes of posts where we’ve all said on multiple occasions during the course of the seasons they’ve been here that they made mistakes. It’s a question of perspective and being grownup about situations we have no control over.

What more convincing do you need? He wanted out and acted like it. That’s all the reason a head coach needs and he was accommodated. Ah, but it doesn’t jibe with YOUR expertise in running an NFL team and so it was wrong. I understand. People of your particular genius always seem to need more convincing. A pity you have to suffer McBeane and other less visionary football savants like yourself. Must be very frustrating for you. You’d think more fans would find that refreshing. Someone should warn the never satisfied masses there will be other mistakes made by this and future regimes.

No, YOU don’t give him credit. Others can and I do. He tried something, it didn’t work. He owned it, moved on, and tried to correct it. You seem to see that as some sort of character flaw. Are you so f**king perfect that you’ve never screwed up, admitted it, and tried to correct it? Dareus wanted out of Buffalo. Period. End of story. His character issues notwithstanding, and there were several. His chronic tardiness issues, showing up fat and out of shape, being one more infraction away from a suspension, and half assed efforts the first month of the season, were not “perceived.” They were DEMONSTRATED. More than a few times, too. More patience? McDermott gave him 10 months to get on board and turn it around. Other coaches may not have been so patient. As for reuniting with Marrone? Good for them! Feel free to play some Peaches and Herb in their honor.

So, coach. How do you manage that situation knowing that he’s not committed to your program, doesn’t want to be on your team, has chronic tardiness issues, and gives a half assed effort half the time ALL while you’re a first year coach trying to establish YOUR vision, YOUR culture, and YOUR rules of conduct? Yeah, it’s much more productive to keep ripping him for making the mistake in the first place. You ever make a mistake and own up to it? Your second sentence is asinine.

There is one thing worse than making a poor decision. And that's compounding that poor decision by continuing to do nothing to correct it. Beane admitted he screwed the pooch on the QB situation last season and finally did something about it. I give him credit for owning it and trying to rectify it.

No doubt Rex ruined Dareus. It was dereliction of duty by that idiot. And yet, like a lot of coaches who think they can be that positive influence on a player to get him to max his potential, McD gave him every chance in the book to get on board. I mean, Dareus's talent is obvious. Especially to a D coordinator who knows it when he sees it. But McD reached his breaking point and cut bait. Totally understandable, imo. All we need to know about that is what Beane said when he traded McCarron: "AJ's not who we thought he was." That's as big an indictment on a player as I've heard.

Showing up as an out of shape tub of goo doesn't make a good impression on a 1st year coach, too.

Before he was hired or after McDermott came in and crunched the tape on Dareus? I think it was the latter because he'd have seen what we all saw; a player capable of mind boggling domination at times as well as a player just going through the motions at times as well. Which is why I think he gave Dareus every chance to buy into the process and be a max effort player on every snap. What he got, in addition to chronic tardiness issues, was a player that put out part time effort. It was GLARING at times in the first month and a half of the '17 season.

That said, I nominate you as the poster to take the position!

Perhaps, but when I put those moves in context it makes sense. McBeane were clearly setting their sights on the 2018 QB class, one of the best and deepest in history. With that as a backdrop and having to make a decision on exercising the 5th year option on an injury prone and (self admitted) selfish player not all in with the program in Sammy as well as a less than reliably available Cordy Glenn who was capably filled in for by a rookie LT, I think they saw an opportunity to acquire valuable draft assets to use as chips in that QB rich draft they had their sights on. A plan they executed quite well, imo.

Team "fits" are not an insignificant factor, especially when it's a player you are intimately familiar with as a coach. And I agree with you that McBeane had no illusions that Star was gonna be on par with Dareus. None at all.

That simple fact trumps all other factors involved; renders them all moot points. Why we insist on believing it's still worth debating is beyond me.

Point is these are golden years compared to a previous 25 year era when we were literally the worst team in the four major pro sports in North America. So, while you see fit to rant, rave, and rail against the present state of things, it's been much worse in the past. And by comparison, imo, you don't have near as much to moan about. It's the old walking to and from school, up hill all the way, both ways, in blizzard conditions, "get off my lawn", old fart complaint about how you youngins have it so good.

Can't argue with any of that.

Well, I most likely deserve it.

Indeed. And I'm not surprised we agree on those three exact elements of his game. One reason why I'm confident is that he showed marked improvement in all three aspects upon his return. Why wouldn't I consider him to continue that trajectory this season? Of course there are gonna be bumps and the pitchfork and shovel crowd will be out in full force, but we both know that's a natural part of development. He started to act like the game slowed down considerably upon his return last year. He was clearly starting to get it. And the reports out of OTAs and mini camp of him showing receivers how to run routes and starting to make the team his own have me convinced. He's gonna be a star for a long time in this league. And I don't care how many times I'm called stupid when I say it.

Not me. Not this experienced observer of great QBs! I am what I refer to as RECKLESSLY optimistic about Allen; caution fully thrown to the wind! Mark my words or hear me now and listen to me later: when it’s all said and done, Josh Allen will be the best QB of his class and a first ballot HOFer.

Well, it wasn't pointless to the two people who were actually discussing an issue about the worst three game defensive stretch in Bills history; a very refined point. Too bad you felt the need to chime in and insisted on making my very narrow point a part of amuch larger argument you were having with others when it didn't involve your argument. Especially when I agree with the larger point of having been worse on defense after trading Dareus. Had I meant it to include your argument, I would have responded to one of your posts directly. If you don't like tangents that are pointless in your opinion, don't involve yourself in them.

Let's just forget about it Dave. My point had nothing to do with Dareus in 2012 and I regret using the term "with Dareus" now that I think about it. The only point was that the Bills have had worse stretches than in the aftermath of the Dareus trade. I'm moving on.

His premise was, and this is the last time I'll say it: After the Bills traded Dareus they had their worst three game stretch in history on defense. I countered that argument. That is the ONLY aspect of the argument I was involved in, so save your indignation for those actually arguing the point about not being worse without Dareus. Because I F**KING agree we became worse vs. the run without Darues. Are we done here? Finally?

I didn't forget about the points given up, I was strictly looking at it from a total and rushing yards given up standpoint which tell a different story. And I don't give a crap about the 2012 Bills, either. Nor do I give a crap about the 2017 Bills. McBeane felt they had legitimate reasons to offload Dareus. Regardless if it made them worse in the short term. That's taking a principled stand and I can respect it. Dareus made it clear he didn't want to be part of another change in Buffalo, either. It was an untenable situation. Now you and others are certainly free to keep reminding the rest of us how stupid it was, how it created a hole, how Star sucks, etc., but the point is made: you feel McBeane screwed the pooch. How long does that have to be yelled from the rooftops? Until Star leaves? It's going on two years. It's history. And I don't understand the reason for it other than to keep trying to convince the rest of us that McBeane are stupid. The next regime is going to make head scratching moves, too. Maybe we can get an early start on griping about their stupidity now.

Ooh, the "gotcha" moment you've been waiting for. Nice try waiting to spring the points against rather than the total and rushing yards given up. But let's continue your disingenuous exercise, shall we. What happens when we add the ONE game immediately after those three game stretches and make them a four consecutive game stretch instead? Glad you asked: The four game stretch in 2017, post Dareus, we yielded 145 points, for an avg. of 36 per game. The four game stretch in 2012, with Dareus, we yielded 148 points, for an avg. of 37 per game. So, if you want to sit on your laurels and stand by your "worst three game stretch in history" without Dareus in 2017 argument, fine. I counter with "worst four game stretch" in Bills history with Darues in 2012. But please don't act like total yards and rushing yards given up don't tell the WHY of the points against. Try being a bit more intellectually honest and/or diligent when having to make a stretch to support a point. We now await your ever present and never effective moving of the goal posts. I agree 100% that it doesn't matter one F**king bit if there was worse 3 game stretch. I just object to specious arguments for the sake of bolstering a faulty premise. Now, I know you weren't part of that, but you inserted yourself into my particular argument, when I did nothing of the sort in yours. Sorry about your dad.

Is it just laziness on your behalf? Or is this a drama club challenge? Show me a three game stretch where the Bills defense gave up more than 1,553 total yards, 740 of which were on the ground after they traded Dareus in 2017, and I'll thank you for the edification.

Good stuff, BF4. Much appreciated.