The ONLY problem with the Bills and the playoffs

[Alphadawg7]

I finally sat down and watched the Buffalo Pittsburgh game all the way through. The offensive line is not doing the job, and at least at this moment is crippling every other element of the offensive game. Losing Peters, not drafting an offensive lineman as a first choice are the worst decisions the bills have made in years, and that includes a lot of bad decisions.

It is a wonder Edwards LIVED through that game. TO and Evans could have been open downfield, but TE would have been lying on his back long before he got a chance to throw. I was buying the argument of many that it was TE...but it ain't so. I have to LAUGH that we think bringing in another RECEIVER will help. Randy Moss, Jerry Rice and Andre Reed won't help if the quarterback doesn't have time to throw. Jim Kelly would be on his ass with this line. Joe Montana would be on his ass with this line. Unless we see better play from the o-line i'm seeing four wins as a major achievement.

 

The line is important, and it has had it struggles sure, but the idea that its been so bad its crippled the offense is exaggerating for one. There are plenty of QB's in this league that could move the ball with this line. First of all, the line has given Trent plenty of time to throw a lot this preseason. Second, with all these weapons and quick short routes, it should be a 3 step drop and throw...Trent holds the ball WAY too long for the drop he is taking because he does not know how to read a defense and isnt quick at progressing through his reads.

 

What people fail to understand is that there is lots of ways to deal with a struggling line but Trent isnt capable of it yet. For example, go watch the AZ game against us last year (or any AZ game for that matter) and you will see what a team does with a below average line a good QB. A very quick 3 step drop and FIRE, and walla you have Warner picking the Defense apart on short crossing routes all day long (this is also how you beat the blitz)...Trent cant seem to FIRE anything...he drops back and HOLDS then tries to check down...

 

The O Line has been good enough to score more than 3 points all preseason by the starting unit...Trent has not

[BuffaloBill]

I completely disagree.

 

I've watched each game twice now, in brutal detail, and Trent had plenty of time to throw on the vast majority of passing plays called in each game. He looks totally unsure of himself out there (outside of his one throw to Evans in the Chicago game--that was better even if it was a little underthrown, I can handle that). If he really is afraid of playing behind this line, then he doesn't belong in the NFL, because they're doing fine in pass protection. Their run blocking, however, leaves something to be desired, but I agree with FLBillsFan and Maddog that it's a result of defenses crowding the line--that, and Buffalo doesn't have a tight end that can block at all (Schouman is a disgrace out there).

 

Trent has time, he's just not getting the job done.

 

 

I tend to agree with what you are saying Only point of dispute is that the line has been far from stellar and overall they seem to be weak against bull rushes.

 

On a different note, one element missing in this discussion is WR / TE play. Take away Lee Evans and the Bills appear to have nothing (If T.O. is on the bench). Reed may get better with T.O. on the field but as he is best in the slot. Don't even get me started on Parrish. He is a joke as a WR and the sooner the Bills realize this the better.

 

The Bills seem to complete very few passes in the middle of the field - points directly to the lack of TE's out in routes and the need to get Reed in the slot. Not sure if it is due to design (probably) or Evans play but he catches very few balls in the center of the field. Bellicheat* can probably gameplan for the Bills in nanoseconds. Eight in the box, roll a safety over Evans and don't worry about the middle of the field - done.

 

Not saying that Trent Edwards doesn't contribute to this mess as he does. I strongly believe that the Bills have also done themselves a disservice by failing to recognize the lack of depth at WR and the failure to realize that there is green space in the middle that a decent TE and slot receiver could exploit.

[Guest dog14787]

Outside of the Levitre play against Tennessee, when has a lineman been shoved into his face this pre-season? I don't remember any other instances, can you give me one?

 

 

We have the folks that seen our O-line play poorly, folks who seen our RB's play poorly, and folks who seen our QB play poorly, I myself seen the whole offense play poorly.

 

Maybe You don't remember because you were to busy watching our QB play poorly which he did, but all you have to do is read some of the other posters for instances or watch the game again.

 

So you can be single minded about it or say it was a collective effort, but anyone who knows football well will tell you it starts with the O-line, the o-line plays poorly, the offense plays poorly, its as simple or as complicated as you want to make it.

[gjv001]

I finally sat down and watched the Buffalo Pittsburgh game all the way through. The offensive line is not doing the job, and at least at this moment is crippling every other element of the offensive game. Losing Peters, not drafting an offensive lineman as a first choice are the worst decisions the bills have made in years, and that includes a lot of bad decisions.

It is a wonder Edwards LIVED through that game. TO and Evans could have been open downfield, but TE would have been lying on his back long before he got a chance to throw. I was buying the argument of many that it was TE...but it ain't so. I have to LAUGH that we think bringing in another RECEIVER will help. Randy Moss, Jerry Rice and Andre Reed won't help if the quarterback doesn't have time to throw. Jim Kelly would be on his ass with this line. Joe Montana would be on his ass with this line. Unless we see better play from the o-line i'm seeing four wins as a major achievement.

The Bills Front Office hasn't a clue as to "how to build a competitive football team". Their player roster decisions appear to be designed to make a short lived splash rather than building a competitive team. How to you go through the entire off season and not address one of the weakest front sevens in the league. If their was a line on the Bills to be remade it was the "D" line.

[Flbillsfan#1]

We have the folks that seen our O-line play poorly, folks who seen our RB's play poorly, and folks who seen our QB play poorly, I myself seen the whole offense play poorly.

 

Maybe You don't remember because you were to busy watching our QB play poorly which he did, but all you have to do is read some of the other posters for instances or watch the game again.

 

So you can be single minded about it or say it was a collective effort, but anyone who knows football well will tell you it starts with the O-line, the o-line plays poorly, the offense plays poorly, its as simple or as complicated as you want to make it.

You can have the best O-line in the NFL, unless you have a good QB it won't matter. That is the reason the Jets went after Favre last year & the Vikings did this year.

[Flbillsfan#1]

The Bills Front Office hasn't a clue as to "how to build a competitive football team". Their player roster decisions appear to be designed to make a short lived splash rather than building a competitive team. How to you go through the entire off season and not address one of the weakest front sevens in the league. If their was a line on the Bills to be remade it was the "D" line.

Peters forced their hand. I think the Bills are fine at DT, they need ends, & they took one with their 1st pick.

[Guest dog14787]

You can have the best O-line in the NFL, unless you have a good QB it won't matter. That is the reason the Jets went after Favre last year & the Vikings did this year.

 

 

You can have some of the best skilled players in the NFL including a good QB and without a good O-line it doesn't matter does it, like I say it can be simple or it can be to complicated for some to comprehend.

[BuffaloBill]

Outside of the Levitre play against Tennessee, when has a lineman been shoved into his face this pre-season? I don't remember any other instances, can you give me one?

 

 

Watch Raji in the GB game on three different plays he owned Hangartner (Sp?), Butler and Wood.

[BuffaloBill]

The Bills Front Office hasn't a clue as to "how to build a competitive football team". Their player roster decisions appear to be designed to make a short lived splash rather than building a competitive team. How to you go through the entire off season and not address one of the weakest front sevens in the league. If their was a line on the Bills to be remade it was the "D" line.

 

 

I would take a "splash" as we have not had even that unless you count the 4 -0 start last year.

[Flbillsfan#1]

You can have some of the best skilled players in the NFL including a good QB and without a good O-line it doesn't matter does it, like I say it can be simple or it can be to complicated for some to comprehend.

As others have already said, a GOOD QB can still be effective with a poor O-line. I don't think the Bills O-line is as bad as some want to think & will get better with time.

[tennesseeboy]

Yup, if we could draft Mike Williams all over again- we'd be all set. He was a unanimous can't miss prospect- remember? A good running game will help, and a good running game isn't all about the O-line... it's about brilliance in play-calling and back with foresight and will.

oh..mike williams..the character guy we went with while passing up the football player Bryant McKinney? Whatever happened to McKinney? Ask Brett Favre or Adrian Peterson.

[Guest dog14787]

As others have already said, a GOOD QB can still be effective with a poor O-line. I don't think the Bills O-line is as bad as some want to think & will get better with time.

 

 

You know this how, do you have anything at all to support something so hilarious.

[34-78-83]

You can have some of the best skilled players in the NFL including a good QB and without a good O-line it doesn't matter does it, like I say it can be simple or it can be to complicated for some to comprehend.

 

 

While you're points definitely ring true in a general sense, real problems can be due to small specific areas and it is clear that TE is off his game. It is also clear that the pass protection he has received from the O-line has been pretty good (Of course the RB pass protection is a whole other story). You're right though, it does start with the O-line.... and in Pass Protection, they have done their part.

[The Senator]

"It all starts,

 

or stops,

 

with the offensive line".

 

(for the eleventeenth goojillion time)

In that case, you want to replace Dick Jauron with...

 

Mike Leach

[Alphadawg7]

You can have some of the best skilled players in the NFL including a good QB and without a good O-line it doesn't matter does it, like I say it can be simple or it can be to complicated for some to comprehend.

 

Not true at all...explain the AZ cardinals last year...

 

A good QB who can take 3 steps and fire can beat any blitz and a bad O Line all day long...Case in point Kurt Warner who may be the slowest QB in football and yet still gets the ball out fast and to his WR's all day depsite having an O line that was worse than ours last year.

 

A good QB makes a bad O line look solid...the bottom line is that our O Line is good enough to win with and gave Trent and JP all kinds of time to throw last year that was never utilized. Are they the best no O Line, of course not, not even close. But they are good enough to see a lot more production out of the offense.

[Guest dog14787]

While you're points definitely ring true in a general sense, real problems can be due to small specific areas and it is clear that TE is off his game. It is also clear that the pass protection he has received from the O-line has been pretty good (Of course the RB pass protection is a whole other story). You're right though, it does start with the O-line.... and in Pass Protection, they have done their part.

 

 

and I say they have not and I'm not the only one, many of us view the O-line as a work in progress as it should be viewed including the coaching staff. Its also why the coaching staff has probably instructed TE to not take any unwarranted chances in preseason.

[Alphadawg7]

You know this how, do you have anything at all to support something so hilarious.

 

I answered for him...Kurt Warner and the AZ cardinals.

 

3 steps back, FIRE...that simple. Kurt picks D's off all the time depsite being pressured all the time. His O line in AZ is well below average and they cant run the ball, yet Kurt is one of the most productive QB's in the league and took AZ to the SB...

[tennesseeboy]

1.) There are MANY other problems keeping the Bills from the playoffs than just one thing. That one thing is certainly not the offensive line.

 

2.) The pass protection by the line in the Pittsburgh game was excellent. No idea what you were watching. Were you high?

 

3.) We did select a lineman with a 1st rounder. His name is Eric Wood. Don't know if you've heard of him.

 

I said first CHOICE, not first round. We picked Maybin (and I suspect you've heard of him). While Maybin fits a need we had five very good offensive tackles in the pool and a BIG gap with Peters gone. Frankly I gave the benefit of the doubt assuming they knew something about existing tackles that I didn't. We have what we have and I hope they gel soon. If not we are going to be thankful for those god awful teams in the late sixties, as this bunch might compare with them. If they gel and TO and Marshawn perform, I think we might make the playoffs. As someone said earlier, it begins and ends with the offensive line.

[Guest dog14787]

I answered for him...Kurt Warner and the AZ cardinals.

 

3 steps back, FIRE...that simple. Kurt picks D's off all the time depsite being pressured all the time. His O line in AZ is well below average and they cant run the ball, yet Kurt is one of the most productive QB's in the league and took AZ to the SB...

 

 

Arizona went to the SB with a well below average O-line, (unknown maybe)

 

 

do you just make this stuff up

 

 

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/KentSomers/58624

[Flbillsfan#1]

You know this how, do you have anything at all to support something so hilarious.

If you aren't familiar with the Cards as Alphadog has said, you could go back to the Flutie/Johnson Bills. The Bills O-line looked like a totally different unit when Doug was behind center than when Rob was.