billybob Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 The book on McKinnie was great pass blocker but only a fair run blocker- the book on Mike Williams was that if he got his hands on you it was all over- the rest of the book was that he was top heavy, had problems with speed rushers- McKinnie had some sketchy college off-field incidents and Williams was labeled as immature. Neither player has lived up to the hype- at the time of the draft I wanted McKinnie because he had the better skills to play left tackle but thought at least they got a offensive lineman- it should be noted that at the time of the pick the Bills big focus was to build a power running game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 It wouldn't suck, not like the Bills screwed up on this one. Every one of the 31 other teams would have cut him under the same circumstances. If he gets his act back together, good for him. Nobody can blame the Bills for cutting him when they did. Didn't screw up!??!?!!?!? They drafted him with the 4th pick in the draft. I think that qualifies as having screwed up. Maybe the biggest draft screw up this team has made since Walt Patulski. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 The book on McKinnie was great pass blocker but only a fair run blocker- the book on Mike Williams was that if he got his hands on you it was all over- the rest of the book was that he was top heavy, had problems with speed rushers- McKinnie had some sketchy college off-field incidents and Williams was labeled as immature. Neither player has lived up to the hype- at the time of the draft I wanted McKinnie because he had the better skills to play left tackle but thought at least they got a offensive lineman- it should be noted that at the time of the pick the Bills big focus was to build a power running game. The book was also that Williams played RT in college, not left, so he didn't face the best rushers on the other side. I am not sure but he may be the highest picked RT in draft history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybob Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 The book was also that Williams played RT in college, not left, so he didn't face the best rushers on the other side. I am not sure but he may be the highest picked RT in draft history. you are correct but I remember talk about how he would start off at RT and in a couple years after the Bills coaches whipped into shape that he would move to LT- that talk changed to maybe his best position might be guard after a couple seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 He played RT because the Texas QB at the time Chris Simms was a lefty. So he was protecting the blind side. http://a.espncdn.com/melkiper/s/2002/0420/1371357.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fewell733 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Read on Fox sports that he is down to 340lbs. He lost over 100lbs. I hope he does not make the Redskins roster, but one has to wonder if he is now mature and ready to contribute. This could suck. Why would you hope he doesn't make their roster? just cause he stunk for the Bills years ago? Just be happy that the guy may have gotten his life in order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVUFootball29 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 He played RT because the Texas QB at the time Chris Simms was a lefty. So he was protecting the blind side. http://a.espncdn.com/melkiper/s/2002/0420/1371357.html Again, don't piss on their parade, they KNEW and everyone else just didn't have a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Hey, I'm no fan (of Williams), but let's not make s#it up. If we wasn't good enough, blame the coaches for starting him. He took the field nearly every week, that's for sure. Or blame Donahoe for drafting him. Sometimes teams make mistakes and the player pays for it the rest of his career by being characterized as an underachiever. Now Williams didn't seem to have the work ethic or passion to be outstanding but the Bills have to share the blame for drafting him 4th overall. Work ethic or not, he's clearly not an elite talent and shouldn't have been drafted so high. The book on McKinnie was great pass blocker but only a fair run blocker- the book on Mike Williams was that if he got his hands on you it was all over- the rest of the book was that he was top heavy, had problems with speed rushers- McKinnie had some sketchy college off-field incidents and Williams was labeled as immature. Neither player has lived up to the hype- at the time of the draft I wanted McKinnie because he had the better skills to play left tackle but thought at least they got a offensive lineman- it should be noted that at the time of the pick the Bills big focus was to build a power running game. You are correct. Neither player has lived up to expectations although McKinnie has had the better career by far. McKinnie was also a member of the "crew" that was tainted in the "Love Boat Scandal" which re-raised the questions about his character. I don't wish that we drafted McKinnie when I think about Williams. The book was also that Williams played RT in college, not left, so he didn't face the best rushers on the other side. I am not sure but he may be the highest picked RT in draft history. As was pointed out by another poster, he protected lefty Chris Simms' blindside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsWatch Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Mike Williams was improving player until front office stuck their fingers into Rusty Jones' area. First they "promoted" him, then they marginalized him until he left and went to Chicago. He was one of the guys who Bruce Smith cited as reason he became all Pro. He had not lost it for he won 2006 National Professional Strength and Conditioning Coach of the Year Award after leaving Buffalo and was very highly recommended to Chicago by Marv Levy and Rueben Brown. Mike Williams was one of those rare natural big guys who needed professional, constant monitoring to keep him in NFL shape with huge amount of food the players eat to keep that must muscle on their frames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVUFootball29 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Mike Williams was improving player until front office stuck their fingers into Rusty Jones' area. First they "promoted" him, then they marginalized him until he left and went to Chicago. He was one of the guys who Bruce Smith cited as reason he became all Pro. He had not lost it for he won 2006 National Professional Strength and Conditioning Coach of the Year Award after leaving Buffalo and was very highly recommended to Chicago by Marv Levy and Rueben Brown. Mike Williams was one of those rare natural big guys who needed professional, constant monitoring to keep him in NFL shape with huge amount of food the players eat to keep that must muscle on their frames. Buffalo has been seeing what a loss Rusty Jones was with the plague of injuries that have stricken the Bills the past few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Ill never understand the reasoning behind drafting him. The consensus top LT was Bryant Mckinnie, who has been starting at LT for one of the better OLs the last 5 years and not out of football. No one talked about Mike Williams before the draft, while McKinnie had spots on Letterman. McKinnie and Williams were neck and neck before the draft. It was a big question who would be picked first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Bull revisionist history. i agree, captain. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Mike Williams was improving player until front office stuck their fingers into Rusty Jones' area. First they "promoted" him, then they marginalized him until he left and went to Chicago. He was one of the guys who Bruce Smith cited as reason he became all Pro. He had not lost it for he won 2006 National Professional Strength and Conditioning Coach of the Year Award after leaving Buffalo and was very highly recommended to Chicago by Marv Levy and Rueben Brown. Mike Williams was one of those rare natural big guys who needed professional, constant monitoring to keep him in NFL shape with huge amount of food the players eat to keep that must muscle on their frames. not entirely true on the Rusty front, though that's another story. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Dude, seriously? He didn't play well enough to merit the #4 overall pick, that's not stealing. The over-dramatization on this board is unbelievable sometimes. Reading into Ross Tucker's comments about Williams, he knew that his salary was so high that it protected him from being cut. So he ignored coaches a fair amount of the time and was generally a prima donna. And nobody could do a thing about it. Even if he's over that now, I don't have to like him. I hope he fails. He took our money and didn't give full effort, or even close. And that's something I can't forgive. Here's Ross's comments: "I once played with a top five pick who didn't really like football, who did whatever he pleased around the facility, practiced more or less how and when he felt like it, and pretty much never played when he had any type of injury. Nobody respected how he handled his business, but they were also aware that he was in a different situation. Guys knew he could do whatever he wanted and they resented him for it. It hurt team chemistry. Everyone in the building knew there was a problem, but there was nothing that could really be done about it because of the amount of money guaranteed and the salary-cap implications." There's no absolute guarantee that he was talking about Williams, but who else fits the bill? link: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writ...tees/index.html So, yeah, I hope he fails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsWatch Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 not entirely true on the Rusty front, though that's another story. jw I have heard both Marv and Rueben on radio raving about Rusty and locally Bruce was talking about how much Rusty helped in when he was with Washington. I am assuming there is more to the promotion / leaving than has been in press. When he went to Chicago he commented on how happy he was to be back coaching so perhaps this was a case of someone who got promotion and later realized it was not what he wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Reading into Ross Tucker's comments about Williams, he knew that his salary was so high that it protected him from being cut. So he ignored coaches a fair amount of the time and was generally a prima donna. And nobody could do a thing about it. Even if he's over that now, I don't have to like him. I hope he fails. He took our money and didn't give full effort, or even close. And that's something I can't forgive. Here's Ross's comments: "I once played with a top five pick who didn't really like football, who did whatever he pleased around the facility, practiced more or less how and when he felt like it, and pretty much never played when he had any type of injury. Nobody respected how he handled his business, but they were also aware that he was in a different situation. Guys knew he could do whatever he wanted and they resented him for it. It hurt team chemistry. Everyone in the building knew there was a problem, but there was nothing that could really be done about it because of the amount of money guaranteed and the salary-cap implications." There's no absolute guarantee that he was talking about Williams, but who else fits the bill? link: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writ...tees/index.html So, yeah, I hope he fails. he was referring to Williams, no doubt. wish Tucker had the guts to discuss this "on the record" when he was in Buffalo, is all I'd have to say about that. And you can quote me on that, Ross. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I have heard both Marv and Rueben on radio raving about Rusty and locally Bruce was talking about how much Rusty helped in when he was with Washington. I am assuming there is more to the promotion / leaving than has been in press. When he went to Chicago he commented on how happy he was to be back coaching so perhaps this was a case of someone who got promotion and later realized it was not what he wanted. Rusty was relatively -- ok, seriously -- pushed out by a certain regime, which first began the coup by marginalizing his authority. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 he was referring to Williams, no doubt. wish Tucker had the guts to discuss this "on the record" when he was in Buffalo, is all I'd have to say about that. And you can quote me on that, Ross. jw He and Sam Adams mixed it up during a practice at SJF, the last year they were both here, I think. I asked him about it afterward, and he said, "He likes Big Macs, and I told him Whoppers were better." Funny line and all, but still ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuklz2594 Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 i will agree that everyone deserves a 2nd chance, but the guy basically gave the Bills the finger, took the money, and left without a care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 He played RT because the Texas QB at the time Chris Simms was a lefty. So he was protecting the blind side. http://a.espncdn.com/melkiper/s/2002/0420/1371357.html That was an assumption made by many, I don't think we could know that for sure. He still was not lining up against the other team's best DE. Blind side or not, I would put my best blocker where the most dangerous DE is lined up regardless of the QB's blindside. Their other QB's were right handed, what if they end up starting? Bottom line is that because of these issues, there was a risk to Williams that was not present with McKinnie and a number of other players on the board that year. And this isn't hind sight, I made this exact argument on this board prior to that draft and its not like I was the only one with those concerns. No one saw him becoming this big of a bust but plenty thought he was not our best option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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